Washington State Can Have a Single-Payer Health Care System by 2020. These Candidates Will Champion It.

Comments

1

Guess what? It's reported that Obamacare premiums are decreasing for 2019 and they would further decrease if not for destructive actions by the Presidents administration. How about make the ACA better. It's already in place. The Democrats in DC lost the House and Senate for passing the legislation. Want to be the minority party in DC and WA state? Go for an all out push on single payor. Plus it's politically unfeasable and we are already running huge deficits. If the economy stays strong the GOP has support to block it, if the economy gets week there is no way to fund it. Good luck.

2

Single payer is making us the stupid party

https://extranewsfeed.com/single-payer-is-making-us-the-stupid-party-49d7abaebfaa

3

@1 +@2 - Yes. Most of the civilized world has universal healthcare, but we can't do this in America. We prefer paying higher dollars for poorer outcomes because private insurers and other parasites have to skim money from the system.

And of course, we can't afford this healthcare because of the high deficits, which are never a problem when it comes to war or giving rich people tax breaks.

4

^^^ Let me save you a click on this stupid article linked above.

Besides being yet another loud-mouth polemic about how dumb liberals are and of course written on a bullshit satire blog, it's filled with just-so stories, inaccuracies, and obscene fallacies.

It get's so many basic facts wrong in it's effort to paint liberals as know nothings about the super serious "science" of eeee-co-nomics it ridiculous. Right of the gate it states that the proposed NY and CA single payer plan would "cost more than the pentagon budget." Citing a $600 billion total for the two states. Well sorry, but the Defense department budget doesn't work that way it's stated $588 billion 2017 budget doesn't include about another $300 billion in associated moneys for Veterans care, Intelligence gathering, and logistics for military. So that cite is disingenuous. And the argument itself is fallacious and irrelevant.

So what if single payer for two states cost more than defense department budget? Dear dumbshit: Healthcare NOW costs infinitely more than the Defense department budget! A huge chunk of that money is money lost to the general economy that could, you know, be used to taxes o pay for neat-o new weapons or maybe smart phones and provide jobs. Money that now get's lost in inflated insurance executive salaries, WallStreet speculation and off-shored.

Our current inflated costs private healthcare system has immense negative impact on the economy at large.

He whines and complains about a 15% payroll tax blithely ignoring the the cost savings of the on the user end that is KNOW FACT of single payer systems the world over. The fact is if his employer didn't have to pay for his insurance (which corporations don't even WANT to do anymore) then that money could go to his salary.

But anyway. the article is pure amateur-hour talking points that have debunked over and over. For fuck sake we have the rest of the developed world to point to for superior public alternatives to our stupid private healthcare system.

So TLDR: Don't bother reading the above article. It's stupid.

5

@3 Exactly.

It's ike our problem with guns that most of the wealthy democratic world seems to avoid.

See, there is the special magic force field around America that not only makes us much more uniquely violent but also changes American DNA so that it adds about 200% to the average cost to our healthcare. So. We just cant change anything. We're just toooo special.

6

If Noel Frame can join together with other state legislators to gain a state single payer health care system I might let her out of the corner for asserting that state legislators don't have to comply with the Public Records Act (RCW 42.56).

7

Good ....Now we have a list of candidate NOT TO VOTE FOR!

I have no intention of getting behind a single payer system which provides the lowest, most inefficient form of health care known to mankind.

If you want to "cover the poor" and provide for them with universal health care from cradle to the grave, then put them in the pool with medicare and medicaid.

We already have a crappy system which is "single payer" as mentioned above...we don't need or want to suffer through another inefficient, bloated, overlapping, low quality program.

8

@7 that's a lot of words to avoid talking about how much less actual single-payer countries spend on health care than we do. While getting better outcomes.

9

@7 Ah. Surprise, surprise.

Nothing like a bold statement of certainty that has absolutely no object truth or basis in fact, provides no cite or source and basks in ignorance. We wouldn't expect any less from our resident shit piles.

Study after study after study has definitively concluded that socialized medical systems generally not only are cheaper but have better outcomes. This is a settled matter in medical science and healthcare. Here are cites with data and sources. Which of course you will not read.

"Commonwealth Fund: U.S. Spends More on Health Care Than Other High-Income Nations But Has Lower Life Expectancy, Worse Health"
https://www.commonwealthfund.org/press-release/2015/us-spends-more-health-care-other-high-income-nations-has-lower-life-expectancy

"A Single-Payer System Would Reduce U.S. Health Care Costs"
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2012/november/a-single-payer-system-would-reduce-us-health-care-costs

"Comparisons of Health Care Systems in the United States, Germany and Canada"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3633404/

10

I voted for Jennifer Gigi Ferguson in the US Senate primary. Her platform is solid, including support for single payer health care. If Maria Cantwell won’t sign on, there are other candidates who will.

11

@8 and @9 First I love all these studies which don't have any basis in fact as the US has not had a single payer system. So at best you have a "theoretical idea" with no data.

1) We do have a quasi- single payer system completely funded by taxes.... medicare and medicaid. We don't have to implement studies, review finding or anything else. It sits right before your eyes. Its very expensive and very crappy.

2) If you'd care to listen....I'm not arguing with you point of view....just the scope. Put the low income in medicare and medicaid programs and let the rest of us decide if we want to be in the crappy medicare/medicaid system or have private insurance. Hop on the single payer Meicare/Medicaid band wagon...take her for a spin. Just don't force the rest of us to go on the trip.

3) Then when you are done digesting that simple concept...pucker up for the cost of the single payer system.... hope you like federal rates in the range the European's enjoy. : D

12

@11 Yes the dumbfuck who makes sourceless pronouncements says the studies he didn't read have no basis in fact.
Despite, you know, the cites, and data on full display in each case.

The dumbfuck who ignores the clear unambiguous consensus of nearly every expert who spends their lives studying nothing but the economics of healthcare have concluded that socialized systems are superior.

Yup. Sound legit.

Christ, dude. Don't you get tired of being wrong like nearly all the time? Being on the wrong side of history is like a hobby for you.

What is your life like out there? Do you just stumble along your day pick up dog shit off the sidewalk and eat it? "I don't need no science or study to tell me this bad for me!"

14

You can write all the pie-in-sky articles you want, this isn't going to happen. Not now, not in 2020 (the incumbent almost always wins) not in 2024, or'28. Maybe in the 2040's. But by then many of you will have made the middle age "change" that is, the change to conservatism. It happens, it is a real thing after you have watched idealism fail you time and again for several decades of life. To paraphrase a rotten racist scoundrel of a man and a failure as a military leader, but great leader overall, Winston Churchill: "If you are not a liberal when you are young, you have no heart. If you are not conservative when you are older, you have no brain."

15

I'm another wondering when Maria Cantwell and Patty Murphy are going to sign on with Bernie Sanders' S1804 - the Senate companion bill to the House HR 676. They're both taking monies from insurance and pharma, especially Patty from the pharmaceuticals, I read, and it's time for both of them to throw these monies and these gangsters out of their campaigns. Otherwise, we can all consider that they do not represent us - they represent them. And We are the future, not these insurance ghouls.

I wish I could feel more confident about all of the names on this list. Unfortunately, we've had too many betrayals in Congress and elsewhere. Which of these candidates are corporate free and/or refusing to take monies from the insurance and pharmaceuticals? This is a key question that we wish the Stranger would be reporting on, rather than, insisting they have a method to getting us through this madness - when you could very well be voting for more of the same in the Democratic Party's corporate wing. "Savoir faire?" No thanks. This is just a plain down and dirty fight - and everyone needs to get on board with that program - get the money or get out of elected office. Pass single payer NOW - not in 300 years. Lincoln abolished slavery outright, and we can damn well do that with the insurance and pharmaceutical gangters who have taken over what is OUR government, not theirs.

16

@15 - edit/correction- that's supposed to say, "Get the money OUT - or get out of elected office."

Single Payer NOW: HR 676 S 1804 > Those are the bills in the House and Senate.And we need to not only flush Congress but flush this Washington State Legislature so we can pass it at the state level. We are advancing on all fronts. Be with us on BOTH, and get the bribery money out - or get out of elected office.

Because we are here - and we are going win - and you all are going to lose (and I know some of your henchmen are reading) - and you are going to take your rightful place in the dustbins of a disgraceful history whereby up to 45,000 Americans die every year because they can't get the health care they need or on time. We have the worst waiting times in the entire world.

17

@14 That's a poorly informed quote that confuses age effect with cohort effect. The period at which you come of age predicts your lifetime political beliefs -- people who are older today are conservative because conservatism was ascendant in their formative years while younger people's values today are shaped by liberalism.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/07/09/the-politics-of-american-generations-how-age-affects-attitudes-and-voting-behavior/

18

If there's no chance single-payer can happen, why are all the usual right-wing suspects jumping in here to denounce it? You don't attack if you're not scared-and these guys are: they are scared that we might finally join Europe in being a civilized place to live.

19

@18:

I think they're more scared by the possibility someone else might get something they believe only they deserve...

21

@20 Conservatives are always railing against wimpy liberals for being scared all the time. It's not a good look for you guys, this kind of weakness. Instead of being scared, figure out an alternative. Unless you'd rather continue a failed experiment in a market-based healtchcare system where, instead of giving you money, your company throws out thousands a month into a black hole on your behalf with dubious results, out-of-control cost increases, profiteering, and generally poor outcomes and service.

You do realize your company, no longer needing to provide healthcare, would be able to pay you more to offset your increased taxes, right? (Not that they will; most will probably pocket the extra profits because you right-wingers have demonized collective negotiating that could force them to give all of their employees a bump.)

22

I still wonder if one of the reasons people aren't more for single-payer is because they truly believe insurance is only like $50-$100 a month for full coverage.

23

In the 2016 presidential primaries 73% of Democrats in Washington state voted for Bernie Sanders and against corruption twice in two different caucuses. We are not only a majority we are a supermajority. Those of us Washington State Democrats who watched the 2016 presidential primary in real time on the internet witnessed a completely different story on network television. When Bernie Sanders was filling stadiums Hillary Clinton could not fill half of a school gymnasium. This is the point at which we became woke as we like to refer to it. It is quite a shame that a small minority of the Democrats in Washington State are still asleep when it comes to corporate Democrats purposely denying Americans Universal Health Care and continuously voting for war. Whole Washington volunteers worked hard to get signatures for our Universal Health Care ballot initiative and we will do it again and again until we get it on the ballot. Jeff Denton, Marysville

25

My father was a physician who spent his time chasing down for-profit insurance companies. My sister is a nurse, my mother is a nurse, my brother is a pharmacist--they all support single payer. LD 14 is a rural area, we desperately need a single-payer system to increase access to healthcare and mental healthcare. We need to stop segregating the poor to a separate system. We have constituents paying for plans with no providers. We have uncovered young people. We need single-payer in LD 14! Thank you, Stranger Magazine.

26

@1

I don’t know where you “heard” that premiums are decreasing for 2019, because the WA State Insurance Commisioner recently announced that insurers have requested premium increases averaging 19%.
https://www.insurance.wa.gov/news/health-insurers-propose-19-percent-average-rate-increase-washingtons-individual-market

And any of you who think a state with a population of 7.5 million and no income tax can pull off single-payer healthcare ... well, you’re fucking delusional.

27

How nice to see someone NOT wearing a stupid MAGA cap. Here's hoping Washington State can be a frontrunner in single-payer healthcare.
@12 Dr. Zaius, re @11: Forget it, he's beyond help or enlightenment.
@20: That's what you get for forever voting RepubliKKKan, you pathetic tool.

28

@18 AlaskanbutnotSeanParnell and @19 COMTE for the win and nailing it again. Well said.

29

@24 Free market might work in giant markets, but it won't work in anywhere else. L.A. and NYC would have awesome care, but there'd be no doctors or hospitals in most of middle-America, rural-America, or any place with any poverty. It'd be like a food desert, only instead of being unable to buy groceries, you'd be unable to obtain any health services.

Do you really think there are enough doctors in most fields to be a truly competitive market? Or do you plan on making it easier for people to become doctors in order to increase competition to drive down costs? What will drive down prices on pharmaceuticals? How will hospital costs be managed and controlled, or how would you make them competitive when, in most instances, there is literally no competition available and no market for multiple hospitals in certain parts of the country?

30

@24. It's clear you worship at the altar of the almighty free market. But you must get it through your thick skull that it simply doesn't work for healthcare. (Just like it doesn't work for fire or police protection.) You're not shopping for something you want, and You Do Not Know What's Going To Happen To You. You're not shopping around for that Broken Arm you had your eye on or comparing prices for that Bone Marrow Transplant you've been dreaming of. You can never save enough for all the possible illnesses that could befall you or your family. In your dream scenario you seem to imply you could put any medical service on your credit card, no matter how rare, no matter how long term, no matter the cost. Again, you're not buying a pair of pants.

All we can do is increase the risk pool. That's all we can civilly and sanely do. And we ALL must pay in based on our ability. And when we need it, we use it. No questions asked and no bills to haunt us. The misfortune of illness should not be coupled with financial burden. It's tough enough to heal.

And before your fear of government rears its mighty head, just remember, providers would be privately operated. They'd be the ones to determine your care, not the government and not a profit motivated insurance company that offers no value. Providers would 'compete' based on specialty, quality of care, and consumers' personal preference. Most times, location and ease of access would be a large factor.

When can we realize that we're going about this the wrong way? Other countries DO do it better. When can we start doing the actual work to get this implemented? Universal Healthcare using a single payer system is the best solution, and it's exasperating to see these arguments over and over that keep us stuck in a health insurance nightmare.

31

@ 27 Sadly, you and Dr. Zaius live in a land of make believe.

I've provided a link which is instructive on the matter.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2018/07/09/choking-on-the-cost-of-medicare-for-all/#4dafc20956f3

Instead of resorting to pedantic name calling, try reading.

You can have a single payer system....if you can afford it.

That's the real problem....you simply can't afford it.

32

@31. We can't afford our current system!
Sally Pipes is with a free market think tank. Of course she's going to say we can't afford Single Payer.

33

@32 She's not the only person who discusses the cost of a single payer system being financially unfeasible...and its frankly a sentiment shared by the majority of congress.

Actually we've been doing fairy well with our private insurance system.... it serves over 85% of the population.

The problem is the poor who can't afford it or those who can afford insurance but choose not to buy it. (kind of like those who drive without car insurance)

As I mentioned previously.... those that can't afford it will become card carrying members of the medicare/-medicad brigade. Why not experiment with single payer at this level and see how it does before "experimenting on the entire country"

If it works on this initial scale....then consider expanding it. But I fear, as is the case currently,
both the Social Security Benefits and Medicare/medicaid systems are both financially insolvent.

Or maybe as many advocate, we should do a single payer system, bankrupt the whole system, and bring a speedy and conclusive death to these socialist programs.

34

LOL! My god this rag is good for a daily laugh. Single payer by 2020? If candidates behind this win, I'm holding The Stranger to this prediction.

LOL! Oh this is just too funny....

35

Yeah! I like the sentiment in 33's last paragraph. Let's fucking do it! Liberals and conservatives unite to get single payer. If the liberals are right, we get more affordable, equitable health care. If the conservatives are right, the whole thing collapses and socialism fails in the US. Let's find out.

Conservatives also said our great society would collapse if slavery was abolished, segregation was ended, interracial marriage was allowed, a black man was elected president, gay marriage was allowed, marijuana was legalized, etc etc, so I know which outcome I'll be betting on.

36

@31 misinformed: Living in the Land of Make Believe? No, I know better than to vote RepubliKKKan.

37

Now, now ...let's not get your "socialist --mother knows best" panties in a bunch.

I'm keeping a guarded open mind.

If as you say, nothing bad will happen with a single payer system, then let's test it first using the only single payer system we have....namely medicaid/medicare by expanding benefits to the poor or those who can not be insured.

If as the other camp believes the cost will swamp the boat, then we'll see it as we roll out the single payer system.

This left wing "all or nothing" approach is just the flip side of the ultra right wing....only more scary....because they wrap their manifesto in some sort of twisted holier than God approach to the exclusion of all other points of view.

I'm just pointing out the prevailing analysis of rolling out a single payer system "cold turkey" runs the very real risk of bankrupting the entire system. Is this a good approach? I wonder.

But as the left says....do it, then lets have it out, once and for all, and let the cards fall where they may. Hell is only half way full anyways....plenty of room for more casualties.

(Exercising my normal prudence....I'll keep my private insurance policy.... thank you very much as this social experiment plays out)

Funny.... left wing nut jobs and right wing nut jobs are virtually similar in every respect.

38

@37 misinformed: yaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnn..........your point, Mr. Word Salad?

39

@11: Oh. That's right---never mind.

40

@38 his point is clearly that he's incapable of witnessing the hundreds of other successful "experiments" in socialized healthcare around the world

41

@37 Expanding the existing system without addressing the cost issues with hospitals and pharmaceutical companies will guarantee its failure. In fact, both will probably increase their prices to bilk even more money out of the government.

42

@40 beeeees: I know, right? That plus the MAGA dunce cap glued to his head.

43

@42: Hey---that's TWO points! That said, why don't we just stuff misinformed (@7, @11, @31, @33, and @37) into a basket for a slam dunk and call him done?

44

@37: Hey listen!...............crickets!

45

@44 You'd have heard from me long ago if you had anything constructive to say..... alas, you have just shown you are incapable of a meaningful conversation on the matter.

46

@41 "expanding the system with out addressing the cost issues'.... will guarantee failure....Golly...ya think. Ground breaking analysis.

I think you are the obvious choice to be head of the single payer system

If a partial roll out or test will bankrupt or fail, by inference we can deduce that magically doing the entire system all at once, single payer works just fine. Yes, I guess that works.

We'll just ignore all the cost analysis on a single payer system handed up to congress...who incidentally didn't vote for a single payer system, because they are all wrong.

Some how, some way, against all logic ....you and only you know this will work.

By golly.... who'd have thunk?

47

Yes! Everyone deserves Healthcare! It is a RIGHT! All healthcare too, not just cancer treatment but breast implants, viagra, everything! All the time! Rich people can afford it! And be sure to keep granny alive until she's 120 even if she's ready to go. Because Healthcare! Yay!

48

@45 & @46 misinformed: .......said the trolling fool from the deep, dark, damp fruit cellar in his mom's basement. Do you ever get brave enough to actually venture outside, Norman? Or are you just high on the fromaldehyde?

49

20: Spare me. You're fine with paying ANY amount of taxes so long as they're spent on finding new devices to kill people in other countries, and then eventually to be handed off to small-town police departments with delusions of being the Municipal Legion of Death.