Comments

1

Funny how we have gotten to the point where complexity in a film's portrayal of people and themes is now kind of seen as negative because it may not push one's chosen worldview hard or exclusively enough, or it may bring joy to people the reviewer sees as the "bad" type of person.

2

Yeah, I was thinking the same as #1 as I read this. It sounds like what we used to just call a complex movie, which is what I was hoping for based on the previews.

3

I really don’t care much for comic books or movies based on them. I used to, when I was in my childhood through my twenties. The whole concept of Superman or Batman coming to save the day, while the rest of us just passively cheer for the hero without doing anything to help ourselves, is a bit ridiculous.

I mean, I get where it comes from. Religion inculcates this idea from birth, the notion that Jesus is going to take care of everything and all you have to do is believe in him, is pervasive in the culture. Politics is like that too- why bother taking direct action when you can just vote every four years and just let the electeds fix it? And then of course, children’s lit fills your head with that crap too- Tinkerbell’s gonna fucking die if you don’t believe in fairies. And new age books like The Secret tell you that you can manifest anything into reality just by wishing for it hard enough.

It doesn’t matter what you believe in, belief is complete bullshit, you can’t wish things into existence. What matters is what you physically, actually do. Superman isn’t real, neither is Batman. Nobody is coming to save you. You’ve got to get off your ass and save yourself. Praying won’t help you.There are plenty of villains in this world, but they don’t wear makeup or spandex. They wear suits and ties and sit on corporate boards.

And that’s kind of the antithesis of comic book genres.

4

"I’m not ready to label Joker something as simple as 'good.' Joker is problematic, transgressive, insulting, and also probably art. At the risk of hyperbole, Joker might represent a new approach to popular cinema: This is a movie that works both for people who see it to luxuriate in the fearsome power of the Joker’s violence, and those who will instead see the character as pitiable. The fact that Joker works for both has me wondering if, going forward, more films will abandon a singular viewpoint. Phillips’s approach feels like a perfect fit for our current, polarized culture."

Sounds like a grudging endorsement. I had every expectation this film would be a dumpster fire, but all reviews seem to agree that there's some value there, if you can stomach it. I'm curious to see how they portray Batman in this, if that's what you're implying. I'd love to see a take on him like he was portrayed in "Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth" where he's no more than a moralistic fascist. But that's probably hoping for too much in this one.

@3: Thank you for supplying us with a transcript of your TEDx talk.

5

Let me guess, social justice warriors hate it. Along with their kin, the religious right.

6

4,

I can assure you, if never be invited to give a TED talk, or any other kind of public address.

8

Some people, @7 for example, just want to see the world burn.

10

I was able to see it early to review it for a different site. It's not for Batman fans. Heath is still the best Joker, because this isn't Joker. With all his tragedy and mental health issues, there is no glimmer of the necessary sadistic brilliance to become Batman's greatest adversary. This guy doesn't have the chops.

11

@6: Well, I appreciate you being a good sport about the ribbing.

12

“If you’re a dude who believes in chaos for the sake of chaos, this film was made for you.

That’s pretty patriarchal of you to exclude women from wanting that same kind of chaos

13

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14

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15

“ Joker is problematic, transgressive, insulting, and also probably art“ - nah the movies just bad and boring. If you’re the type of person that thinks inception was deep instead of a derivative piece of shit, then you’ll probably think this movie is “deep”. But it isn’t. The direction is hacky, oh look another shot through a window to show how deep the joker is! Another dolly shot! The script is hacky, he’s so pathetic even the children attack him. And Phoenix is overacting.


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