our (former) Slave Patrols
are now ANTIVA? NO one
couldda seen that one
coming.

Cops are like everybody else. They can't afford to quit. They'll whine and cry, because that's what they do, but they'll get the shot.

If not, plenty more fish in the sea.

I suspect SPOG gives Chief Diaz massive headaches.

and (some of) the Citizenry
massive head Injuries.

@3 yeah hillbillies who think taxes are too high here never scoff at an opportunity to be well paid with tax dollars

Weeding out dumbass cops who refuse to vaxx sounds like a great idea! 100% support them quitting in a fit if they don't want to get the jab. Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out.

So Republicans are celebrating Cuomo resigning and yet they continue to do nothing about Republican governors nationwide actively killing people, with tens and hundreds of thousands of the great unwashed and unvaxxed getting COVID, especially all of the children who CANNOT get vaccinated, whose governors have mandated NO MASKS IN SCHOOLS ARE NO MONEY!!!

And of course they all did nothing about Trump and all of sexual assault and abuse cases (including the rape of a 13 year old girl that looked an Ivanka twin). But hey! They get to party because Cuomo is OUT! (Also with no irony, because while Cuomo ran as a Democratic, he behaved like a Republican - working with the other fake Dems in the NYS legislature to ensure the Republicans held the upper hand and their agenda was met instead of the Democrats').

This country has truly reached peak destruction.

Over 1,000 kids in Mississippi have COVID since schools opened. How many will get it in Florida (who knows, they don't report accurately)? And Texas? The governor of Texas is begging health care workers from other states to come help them because their hospitals are overwhelmed with COVID cases. HELL NAH. FUCK TEXAS.

Republicans have doubled down on their demands that everyone, including children, die for their dogma. They made their fucking COVID beds, now they are going to have to bury their children and everyone else they kill while lying in it. And they will play the victims, of course, pretending to mourn and cry and wail and scream about all of the dead kids like they give a shit. It's truly unfuckinbelievable.

Jesus, that Grecian fire footage is awful, but incredible, looks like something out of a freaking Michael Bay disaster thriller or something. Don't think I've ever seen anything like it. oof.

The guaranteed income experiment is interesting. I do think that Tacoma is asking to have it tied up in litigation forever by adding a racial preference though. They could get the answer to their experiment a lot faster if they did it strictly on the basis of economic status, which is much harder to challenge.

Love that all of you are having a circle jerk over the thought of getting rid of anti vax cops. Pretty sure this issue goes well beyond SPOG. The head of corrections for example stated that he thinks only 40-50% of corrections employees are vaxxed. Even in high percentage departments there is probably still 10-15% of personnel unvaxxed for whatever reason. Is it realistic for Inslee to fire all of those people? Doubful.

I guess the only word I can use in reference to the Cuomo resignation is relieved. Pretty excited about New York having a woman governor. Always happy when women break down another barrier, historic or otherwise. Cuomo's father must be rolling in his grave. Mario is a hero of mine - a great, great man IMHO who was a follower of St. Augustine who believed we should enjoy life and be happy. I'm not a believer, but who can argue with that? How terrible, then, is it to have a son who obviously feels entitled enough to play unwelcomed kitchy-kitchy-koo with his female staff?

Well, maybe it's over now, and New York State can get back to being New York State. BTW, as many of you know, Mario Cuomo was also a man of letters. May I suggest his book, "The New York Idea"? In it, he documents how possible it is for many disparate social and ethic cultures from around the world - as many as you can imagine - to coalesce and form something pretty fucking spectacular. It makes my heart beat with admiration and pride.

Some people think he's Don Quixote. but Bernie is my knight in shining armour.

@19 As someone who grew up in NYS (including going to college there and working and living in NYC for years after college) Andrew Cuomo is hardly the first problematic governor. His father (governor while I was in HS and college) WAS a great governor and a really decent human being. But prior to Andrew there was David Paterson who was a shit show of a governor after getting the job because of shit show Eliot Spitzer (who also resigned because of a sex scandal) - and notably both A. Cuomo and E. Spitzer were the AGs of NY before they became governors. Pataki may have not had any notable scandal but he was an absentee governor who lived far from the Capital region and did as little as possible while in the position (how he got re-elected is beyond me). And while it's good to be happy about NYS having its first woman governor, there is the slight problem that she worked with A. Cuomo (both terms) until now, so what does that say about her?

@18,

Reagan fired a ton of air traffic controllers and somehow planes still managed to fly and land safely.

What the investigation of Andrew Cuomo has revealed

...it’s notable that Letitia James summarized the report as concluding that the governor and his senior team engaged in prohibited retaliation,,,

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/08/andrew-cuomo-sexual-harassment-investigation-report.html

@13 Prof, Your rage machine was often amusing when the comment section was overrun with Trumpster/RWNJ sock-puppets, but now that they've been largely extinguished, you just spew at anyone who doesn't pass your purity test.

If you want to rage at the police, good, I'll rage with you - but you're just being an asshole when you direct it at other commenters who are being far more reasonable than you are.

@18 It is reasonable and it can (and hopefully will) happen. Get vaccinated or lose your job. Period. It's a simple choice. If you believe there are no people who ARE vaccinated (or willing to be vaccinated) to fill those jobs, you are mistaken.

I wish Oregon's governor was as direct and definitive in her approach. What's convincing people to get vaccinated in Oregon who can't be forced to get vaccinated? They don't want to pay for weekly testing out of their own pockets and their employers are not going to pay for it and neither are their insurance companies, so guess what, they are getting vaccinated or they are quitting their jobs. Good riddance to every anti-vaxxer out there.

@12, 13, 15
AWESOME
comments.

this just in:
Gov. Abbott
“Direct Threat” to
the Children of Texas

from Democracy Now

As the highly contagious Delta variant continues to spread, many hospitals are reporting record numbers of children being hospitalized, especially in areas with low vaccination rates, including Arkansas, Florida, Missouri and Texas.

Dr. Christina Propst, a pediatrician in Houston, says children under 12 who are still ineligible for COVID-19 vaccines are at risk.

“They are currently our most vulnerable population, just as this highly transmissible variant is surging across the country,” Propst says.

She says Texas Governor Greg Abbott’s order banning mask mandates in schools is a purely political decision that ignores science.

”What he is doing is a direct threat to the health and well-being of the children of Texas,” says Propst.

tonnes and tonnes More at
https://www.democracynow.org/

@Rich, TS, there's a crime wave in Seattle. Whatever statistics you are referencing are BS. TS and left-wingers can continue to bury their head in the sand, but it doesn't change the reality that everyday Seattleites are facing.

One of the biggest issue is that many criminals are being caught and then immediately released, often never charged, and then it's just rinse and repeat over and over again.

Everyone (politicians, city attorneys, judges, police) points the finger at someone else for why this is allowed to continue - voters can't figure out who to blame, so they just start voting for anyone who says they'll be tough on crime. Hence, Repub Davison is on the verge of being Seattle's next City Attorney.

@33 Prof, see, you just can't help yourself. You are king of the strawman. It's kind of amusing to watch you go from point A to point wherever the fuck over the course of a few paragraphs.

@32,

So you agree the insurrectionists should be given higher fines, yes?

I like the Professor.

"Seattle community is already experiencing a Seattle Police Department staffing crisis. Given this crisis; which in part resulting [sic] in an alarming crime wave, can Seattle now endure more losses of police officers due to Mayor Durkan’s vaccination order?"

So, we've previously disproven that SPD is experiencing a staffing crisis beyond normal attrition, that the so called "explosion in crime" is actually specific to certain crimes and only up marginally compared to the steep decline on violent crime since 1990 and that crime is up nationwide, but no one seems to point out that violent crime is often up the most in cities that "INCREASED" their police budgets in 2020:

Just a partial list of cities that increased their police budget in 2020 and had increased violent crime rates despite this:

‘We Have Not Defunded Anything’: Big Cities Boost Police Budgets"
https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020-city-budget-police-defunding/
"Of the 50 cities, more than half increased or maintained their police budgets last year. The increases amounted to 8.6% in Tampa, 5.4% in San Diego, and 4.6% in Atlanta."

Top 10 U.S. Cities With Highest Number of Murders in 2020
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/top-15-u-cities-highest-022443422.html
10. Indianapolis-Police Budget Up
There were a total of 129 murders in Indianapolis in 2020 through September 1st. This figure was 98 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Indianapolis has a daily average of 0.526 murders so far in 2020.

Kansas City- Police Budget Up
There were a total of 139 murders in Kansas City in 2020 through September 11th. This figure was 109 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Kansas City has a daily average of 0.55 murders so far in 2020.
Dallas Police Budget up
There were a total of 152 murders in Dallas in 2020 through September 10th. This figure was 148 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Dallas has a daily average of 0.60 murders so far in 2020.
St Louis Police Budget Up
There were a total of 185 murders in St Louis in 2020 through August 31st. This figure was 136 during the same period in 2019. Overall, St Louis has a daily average of 0.76 murders so far in 2020.
Los Angeles Police Budget slightly down
There were a total of 208 murders in Los Angeles in 2020 through September 5th. This figure was 183 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Los Angeles has a daily average of 0.84 murders so far in 2020.
Baltimore Police budget proposed down, but then revised up
There were a total of 223 murders in Baltimore in 2020 through September 8th. This figure was 239 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Baltimore has a daily average of 0.885 murders so far in 2020. Baltimore is also one of the rare cities that saw a decline in its murder rate in 2020.
Philadelphia Budget proposed down for 2021, but no budget cuts yet.
There were a total of 306 murders in Philadelphia in 2020 through September 13th. This figure was 238 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Philadelphia has a daily average of 1.19 murders so far in 2020.
New York City Proposed down for 2021, but not down yet
There were a total of 305 murders in New York City in 2020 through September 6th. This figure was 226 during the same period in 2019. Overall, New York City has a daily average of 1.22 murders so far in 2020, slightly ahead of Philadelphia.
Chicago Much like Seattle, Chicago proposed cuts to the police, but didn't actually do it:
https://chicago.suntimes.com/city-hall/2020/11/24/21612903/chicago-budget-approved-city-council-mayor-lori-lightfoot

There were a total of 524 murders in Chicago in 2020 through September 6th. This figure was 345 during the same period in 2019. Overall, Chicago has a daily average of 2.1 murders so far in 2020.

I think the data is clear. If we want to reduce violent crime, we need reducing the police budget.

For the children.

Lazarus Seattle - "Nobody likes him"

I'm sure you junior high take on the "cool kids" popularity contest here at The Stranger broke his heart, but do you imagine you're winning the popularity contest around here?

prof feverishly hitting f5 all day to reply to people he claims not to care about. typical tuesday.

reminder to wear your masks, two of my vaccinated friends got covid.

"The police can abandon their jobs during the peak of a crisis.

The police can literally kill citizens with bullets, choke holds or viruses with almost no consequences.

But somehow we can’t fire cops.

We can’t really reform cops without them defining what that reform is and them measuring its “success.”

And we can’t NOT give raises to cops."

This message brought to you by the Anne Davison campaign with the proud, unwavering support of the "I still don't think that was just a wood carving knife" SPOG.

She's running as a Republican, not that you should assume anything based about that based on the full "yes to capitol riots, no to vaccine" SPOG support.

Has anyone told her the difference between a misdemeanor and felony yet? I As former AG Pete alluded to on his way out the door, it might be useful for her to learn the difference.

@20: I find your slight problem about Kathy Hochul working with Cuomo over two terms unrealistic, as if she should have foregone those years of experience instead of ending up where she is now. It's not a problem at all. Was Hillary being married to Bill a slight problem too?

Professor Hiz's lecturing (@20) Catalina is quite amusing as she has more on the pulse of the city and its departments by orders of magnitude.

I like the Prof, too. He (that's my assumption) says things I agree with, but with a wonderful blend of anger and intelligence. But hey, I'm just a lurker who occasionally posts about Dune, movies, or mental health, so whatever.

Btw, ff someone wants to start a discussion about the psychiatric presentations of characters in the upcoming Dune movie, my post count will go up significantly. See you then.

@27 - "Cops and their apologists"

Same with bakers and their apologists, hey and don't even talk about the data scientists and their apologists.

I know what you mean blip, just calling attention to an overused conflation.

Actually responding to the professor when he's blocked you has its advantages.

What a fun thread! The professor is usually to be found at the extreme edge of any argument. He is not to be taken seriously, like any other professor.

Professor dear, you’re distraught. My only point was that the anti-vax cops, like rest of the anti-vaccine city employees, are crying wolf. They won’t quit over this. They can’t afford to.

And if they do, they’re easily replaceable.

Professors that are to be taken seriously are in the math, physical sciences, music, and computer science departments.

@57 While I can't tell which specific poster you're referring to (google gave me a variety of results), I'd say that the vast majority of movie posters are lackluster these days. I'll give the Dune folks some leeway here, as they've got to try to sell a heady sci-fi epic to not just the nerds that already love it, but the mainstream yokels that don't know what the fuck Dune even is, or only know it as that weird-ass David Lynch movie (except grading on a curve, Dune is one of Lynch's less weird movies).

As for battle-pugs, sadly I doubt they'll be there. I love them too. But I also love Sting's danger-undies and shouting "Chaaaaaa-saa!" when I wish to explode things with my mind. But they'll live forever with Lynch-Dune.

Now where the design team deserves big-time credit is the way they elegantly use nothing but two symbols (an arch pointing different directions and a single circle) to spell D-U-N-E. That shit looks great.

I wish more people would have taken my Dune-bait...

@67,

I agree the graphics they used to spell Dune was brilliant! I think they even used a tiny Arrakis as the middle part in the E.

And yes, Lynch's version of Dune is one of his less bizarre movies, though it's still bizarre.

I've read Dune once, I should really read it again, but it's so dense. I think that's both the reason why I want to re-read it and why I haven't re-read it. Also I despise the ending, though I later heard from an interview with Herbert that he intentionally left it rough and unfinished because he wanted readers to come up with their own endings.

I actually kind of like Lynch's Dune more and more each time I see it (which has been maybe 5 times) even though he basically took Herbert's story and then decided to hyper-focus on one aspect of it (e.g., anything in the story involving treachery).

This upcoming movie has me intrigued, but I'm not going to get my hopes up too much because, like many others, I think Dune is un-filmable. I mean, the book is almost entirely told through narration instead of dialogue. How the hell are you going to film that? A bunch of people milling about while a background voice reads the novel to you?

Anyway, it's one of the few upcoming movies I give two shits about.

@68 Yeah, it is a tiny Arrakis but I didn't want go into the point any more than I already was.

I love the Lynch Dune for its own reasons. I saw the TV cut when I was pretty young and was totally enthralled by the look of it. No clue what was actually going on. But it definitely struck me as "This is smart adult stuff in space. Cool!". Read the books (the six main Frank Herbert books) in high school and just kind of fell in love. And yes, they are dense as hell, every single one of the main six books. I find re-reads to be thoroughly enjoyable too, as I find new connections and interpretations as I get older.

I have hopes for the movie primarily because the director has already shown he can make watchable, thinky sci-fi films. But even given that...Dune is a tough one. So far the casting and visuals look on-point. We'll have to see how the actual storytelling plays out.

And I swear to gawd, if anti-vax dipshits keep the risk level high enough that I can't see Dune in a theater this fall, I'm-a be pissed, yo.

Xina - Children are not dying en masse and the CDC has said nothing to support that statement. Please stop spewing your bull shit false statements. IF fatalities for 0-12 year old kids were remotely close to those of 70+ years old, I can guarantee you the response from this country would be extremely different, and much more united.

When you know your argument is weak, pound the table, yell louder.

RE: Dune. Excited to see it. Was afraid to see Blade Runner 2049 for years as the original was one of my favorite movies, but was glad I did. Loved the visual style. When I discovered that Dune was directed by same - even more excited.

RE: the Professor. I am convinced he is my partner in a crabby mood. But I can't even get him to admit he reads The Stranger much less post comments. HEY HON - if you run an errand we are out of milk and coffee.

@70: "Of course now the history major and Casino are going to insist we are the same person."

And that you're all my sock-puppets. Because it's doubleplus unpossible for multiple commenters to call them on their tremendous bullshit.

@70 -- well they're the same

our dear Perfessor
can get a little hot under the collar and suffers Fools poorly but usually sees clearly thru the Bullshit (and's been known to toss some piles of his own)(god love 'im). a Warrior, he’s tS’s General La Hire -- perhaps France’s greatest General of his time* and if he’s a little gruff (or so) it’s cause arguing with the Somnambulent is Always a lost cause -- be thankful he carries no Sword.

but his comments
@12 and 13
are brilliant

*see: Twain’s Personal
Recollections of Joan
of Arc, his Fave.

Regarding the new "Dune" movie, I admire the ambition (and hope to see it for myself in IMAX), but as others here have suggested, the story is both too large and too dense for even a five-hour film to capture with any amount of fidelity. It needs at least a mini-series. (I haven't seen the SyFy version from ~20 years ago.) Now that Game of Thrones, Mad Men, and The Sopranos have shown us how to do long-format stories on television, I hope Dune gets a big-budget TV treatment soon.

Dune.

I actually disagree that it would take several installments to tell the story. The problem isn't that the story is too long, like LotR is long. And it isn't that it has a difficult plot either. Dune's plot is rather simple and straightforward. It isn't even that it has too many characters that need too much screen time. Many characters ARE important, but don't really speak much in the novel.

If I remember correctly (it's been some time since I read it... and again, I only read it once and it's fucking heavy), the real problem with translation to screen is that Herbert went into enormous detail describing the situation of how things are, the environments, the social constructs, nobility, heritage, etc. He described a lot of things that are either visual, or things that exist in people's knowledge of the universe.

The novel describes the Fremen and how they're treated by both House Harkonnen and House Atreides and by the Empire in general. It describes the environmental impact of Spice harvesting on Arrakis. The differences in social orders between the opposing houses. The purpose and history of the Spacing Guild. The purpose and history of the Bene Gesserit. And so on...

I think that's why there's that version of Lynch's Dune that has the extended opening narration, where he describes the overthrow of the machines, the forming of the guilds, the Bene Gesserit, etc. It tries to shoehorn in all that narrative.

All that stuff is great for a book, and it IS great for a book... Dune's a great book! But like I said in my previous post... how do you film that? It would end up more like a documentary than a drama film. But it could be done in a couple regular length films.

Also as an aside, I've only read the original novel Dune. I never read any of the later books because so many people warned me away from them.

"... more like a documentary than a drama film... "
--@Urg

hmmm -- like Oliver Stone's
(horrific) Natural Born Killers

Revolutionary sci-fi.
although .... District 9
but -- why not?

@75: I actually don't mind that you run a sock puppet like Toby II, but I'm disappointed you're so bad at it.

I left some notes on another thread how to cover your track better. Simple stuff life avoiding being on the same thread with exactly the same ideas and opinion in the same language without every interacting with each other. Not posting a comment with one handle, then responding with a different handle when the first handle is challenged as you frequently do.

There are plenty of people here who disagree with me that maintain there own accounts. If nothing else, pay attention and copy them.

@80: I'm hoping that was merely a witlessly failed attempt at satire, because otherwise your paranoia is really running rampant now. Thanks for validating my prediction @75.

@82: "18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection

"Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States."

The Congress has the legal (indeed, constitutional) authority to count the votes of the Electoral College. Therefore, any violent attempt to interfere with that counting counts as "Rebellion or insurrection", and most of the persons who stormed our Capitol should get ten years in federal prison.

"Real insurrectionists bring weapons."

How about I squirt some bear spray in your face, and then claim it is not a weapon? Would you agree to that? (If that's OK with you, we can move on to the actual firearms some of those idiots brought to our Capitol.)

Furthermore, they and Trump also committed Seditious Conspiracy, 18 U.S. Code § 2384, which defines that crime as (among other acts):

"If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to ... to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States ... they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both."

The insurrectionists (note total lack of scare quotes) did indeed attempt to "oppose by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States...", specifically, "to prevent, hinder, or delay" the Congress from counting the votes of the Electoral College. Therefore, they each should get up to twenty years in federal prison.

@82

Insurrectionists/Rioters
Potato\ Po-TAH-to.

Most those numbnuts probably couldn't define "insurrection" if shown it in a dictionary, but that's what it was.
Like the "scare quotes"?
I did that just for you.

Thing is, they did bring weapons. They just parked their shit outside city limits.. Look... just because they were incompetent doesn't mean they had no intent.
Doesn't mean they won't try again having learned from their mistakes.

I grew up in N. Idaho in the 70s/80s. I knew one of Ammon Bundy's younger brothers before they became "famous". scare quote

This is like trying to explain water to a fish.

Tl/DR. Eh....go fuck yourself and spare the rest of us.

More Dune talk! Specifically the sub-topic of the books and adaptations.

If you like heavy skepticism re: institutions mixed in with your sci-fi epics, than I totally recommend all six Frank Herbert Dune books (the ones written by his son and Kevin J. Anderson are not bad, they're just rather...pedestrian, compared to the Frank books. No philosophy or "density" in those).

The real litmus test seems to be the 4th Dune book, God-Emperor of Dune. It's kind of the weird mid-point of the series. The first three books are all closely connected through common characters and timeframes. The last two books (set far in the future from the first books) are basically one big book chopped into two parts. The fourth book is just kind of it's own thing, but is a vital link between the 1-3 book set and the 5-6 book pair. I'm being vague on purpose, btw. But the whole Dune story takes place over approximately 3,000 years. And some shit happens.

I have family that love Dune books 1-3 but could not make it through God-Emperor. While I've come to appreciate that book on its own merits over the decades, it's still the odd one out. But books 5 and 6 are SO good, I really try to encourage people to slog through book 4 (because it's still super-important for the overall story). It's a big ask - hours and hours of possible non-enjoyment. I guess you could review chapter summaries online but...eh. You'll lose so much going that way.

As for adaptations...it's not that Herbert goes on huge tears of world-building that are hard to put on film. Tolkien and LotR has way, WAY more exposition and (at times, very dry) world-building, and yet Peter Jackson and his people did a great job adapting that, both through dialogue and visual storytelling.

No, Dune's problem is that so much of it occurs inside people's heads. The Lynch film (arguments aside) landed on the whispery voice-over method to translate people's inner observations, with very mixed success. What exposition and world-building there is in the first Dune is actually woven pretty well into scenes with interesting dialogue or actions taking place.

Also, narratively, Dune lays it's cards on the table very early on. You know that Paul rises to power. You know that some dirty shit is going on with the current Emperor and Harkonnens in plotting against Duke Leto. It's like a Greek myth (specifically the tragedies) where the drama doesn't come from the suspense, but from watching the inevitable play out (at least for the first main arc - after that it does get less reveal-y with the storytelling, but you still know that Paul comes out on top).

As the Professor stated before, Lynch fucking killed it on the LOOK of the Dune movie. The casting and visuals are so striking that images from that film are mostly what's used in my head as I read the books because they're so fitting (aside from maskless stillsuits, but that's Hollywood).

Timothee Chalamet might win a spot in my mind because he plays so much younger than Kyle Maclachlan (and Paul IS a teenager), but as much I love Oscar Isaac, nobody is beating out Jurgen Prochnow as Duke Leto. That's guy just exudes leadership.

And in case y'all are curious about the Sci-Fi Channel mini-series for Dune and Children of Dune...they're pretty good. They actually do a very good job in the storytelling department, but the casting, costuming and overall visuals are...well, they're downright laughable at times. If I could take the amount of time allowed and storytelling from the mini-series and smash it with the casting, designs, and overall production of Lynch's film - that would be the ultimate Dune. But you really do need about 6 hours minimum to attempt Dune on film. Maybe Denis Villeneuve is skilled enough to do it five hours across two movies (if the second half actually gets made/released).

@71 I didn't say that children were dying en masse. I said how many dead children will it take for the assholes who are responsible for this pandemic not ending to care. There is a difference. And they don't and won't care, as proven by recent headlines. Close to the end of July it was 400 children. That's acceptable? 400 children dead? Now that we've got hundreds of thousands of children infected, what's the acceptable number of dead kids? 1000? 2000? 5000? 10,000? You tell me. As far as I'm concerned the death of ONE CHILD due to a virus where every person aged 12 and up could and should be vaccinated already, is one too many. But hey? A few hundred? A few thousand? Tens of thousands? Maybe a hundred thousand? Who cares right?

The deaths of children are just starting.

COVID-19 deaths have been extremely rare among children, unfortunately that's no longer true

Not only are children accounting for a record level of COVID-19 hospitalizations, they’ve also reached a record level of COVID-19 deaths, indicating that there really is something different about how delta affects children.

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/8/11/2045084/-A-pandemic-of-the-unvaccinated-also-means-a-pandemic-of-children

If the cops want to dehire themselves, fine.

As to Dune, the new movie is only half of the first book, part 2 is the second half of the first book.

oh with AntivX running the Show*
this Fucker's gonna Mutate
till we're Devastated
gonna be "Children
of Men" all over
again.

thnx
trumpfers
FOX et fucking al

*end the
Mollycoddle

@88 While I don't view the Golden Path as "humanity must suffer to evolve", it's definitely a reasonable interpretation. Leto II was a controlled version of the kind of galactic-wide threat to the species that could potentially use weaponized prescience. I mean, the paternalism of it all is inescapable, so Herbert is clearly making some kind of statement about how unruly humanity actually is, even when faced with an existential threat (and boy howdy has that ever been demonstrated recently). But he's also made a self-aware "benevolent dictator", one that is knowingly making a huge sacrifice (which is probably a bigger fictional concept than the spice, prescience, and "space-folding" combined).

Again, I don't agree with the libertarian interpretation but it's totally valid - I also don't have the patience to debate it further on this kind of format.

@82,

The blurb from the article says the total cost is $2 billion, not $1.5 million, hence why the judge suggested steeper fines.

So, again, you agree the insurrectionists should receive higher fines, yes?

(By their own confession, their stated purpose was to stop the democratically elected process from taking place and install their own choice for president instead. They committed insurrection. That is the very definition of insurrection).

@95,

I was just going on what Rich posted in the news, which said $2 billion. If the actual cost is only $1.5 million then consider me updated. I don't look for competing evidence because this is an anonymous comment on a two-bit blog... i.e., I have no skin in this game.

Didn't some chick get trampled to death during the insurrection too? That's unnatural. So two deaths.

For reference, no one died in the bombardment of Fort Sumter in the opening battle of the Civil War. The only casualty was a horse. So that wasn't insurrection either?

I don't recall deaths as being a prerequisite to defining insurrection.

@99,

https://nypost.com/2021/01/08/rosanne-boyland-woman-killed-in-dc-riots-was-trampled-by-crowd/

Sorry for the NY Post link. I hate that rag. But the NY Times is behind a paywall and I never know if someone's a subscriber or not.

Anyway, yeah Rosanne Boyland was trampled to death.

Also, Officer Sicknick died from apparently being hit with a fire extinguisher:
https://nypost.com/2021/01/08/capitol-cop-who-died-in-riots-nj-native-veteran-reports/

And again, it was an insurrection. Definition of insurrection: "A violent uprising against an authority or government."
It was an uprising.
It was violent.
It was against the government.

No deaths are required. No weapons are required. Just a violent uprising.

If you can find a definition where insurrection requires the use of weapons then by all means post a link.

So yeah, insurrectionists. The fact that they were also unprepared, ineffective, disorganized, and cowardly is irrelevant. They went in there to stop the government, not just to break shit and cause damage... like what rioters do... they (at least some of them) were there with the express intent to stop the government.

@101,

Every riot is not an insurrection, no.

Are these insurrectionists?:
Rioters who attacked portland federal building: I don't know, what were they trying to do? Overthrow portland's government or just be garden variety vandals?

Arsonists who burned down jail: Same thing. Was it an attempt to stop government?

Are the mentally ill who throw rocks guilty of attempted murder: That'll all depend on psych evals and jury trials.

I'm not sure if the events of Jan 6 were a credible threat to the US gov. We'll never know what would have happened if they had actually managed to kidnap and hold hostage members of congress and/or the vice president. I feel confident in saying that even if they had captured some of them, even if they murdered some of them, government would go on as usual (eventually... it would be very shaken for a while).

But a poorly planned, poorly executed, and utter failure to stop government was STILL an attempt to do so.

I'd be fine splitting the difference and saying they were "attempted insurrectionists." Wannabe insurrectionists. Failed insurrectionists.

Or just criminals. Criminals guilty of the crime of attempted insurrection, trespassing, and for some, destruction of property and assault.