SL Letter of the Day: Fresh Wrappers


wow you guys are so awesome.

except for the part about being so fucking stupid.

if it is wet and it isn't your's don't touch it.
This was the most bragging letter published in awhile. Maybe getting a positive herpes test would humble them a little.
so. Danny. any news on the mormon prophet front?

have you even looked on wiki?

do we have to do it for you?
@2 Yeep. Or maybe someone curing herpes would humble you a bit. POLLY here strikes me as a bit of an idiot but I've never heard of a virus that makes people smarter. Contrary to popular belief, things that impair the function or appearance of the lower head rarely improve the function of the one with the skull in it.
This all seems too risky. Maybe? "A dick is going in a hole it needs a condom." Yup.
Today in stupid questions one already knows the answer to asked for the express purpose of bragging/shocking- sounds hot, sounds rare, wrap it up, have at it, and leave the rest of us to what could only be our boring routines in comparison...


I second @2, just because POLLY's a bit of an ass doesn't mean I wish him an incurable STD. Christ.
It does seem to be totally bragging, which of course raise questions about the veracity. In fact, I'm sure many people will doubt that any of this is true. If only there were some way for the LW to prove any of this.
I suppose in the public service sense, for all the 13 year olds reading the column now, the letter and answer make sense.

But no one this naive about STIs should be having orgies with rotating casts of partners. Come on dude.
I'm really glad that I don't know of anyone in my life gross enough to initiate an orgy at the their wedding reception.

Did daddy get the first dance?
Also just wanted to say, "When used correctly, a condom cuts the chances of getting chlamydia or gonorrhea by more than half."

POLLY, that's still leaves a lot of gonorrhea getting passed around among people using condoms correctly.

Also, note the rise of untreatable gonorrhea -- a version that doesn't respond to antibiotics.…

So, okay, most of us drive and that is more likely to kill us than any sex act. But don't think proper condom use makes your fun sex risk-free.
@9 "a wedding reception", not his wedding reception.
Dear Disappointing Fuckwit #3,

Anybody with half a brain understands what Dan meant, the church did not allow African American males to hold the priesthood until -- I believe it was -- sometime in the late 70's,. Upon realizing how they had become inadvertent bigots by not recognizing the mistakes that had become an American tradition that few people had the courage to question. They prayed and were willing to hear the TRUTH as an answer to their honest question of "What is the right thing to do God?"

They publicly admitted to making a mistake and officially allowed African American males to hold the priesthood.

The church also publicly denounced the prior practice of polygamy, due to government pressure and evidently a change in heart. The church history is such that during the harsh trip to the Salt Lake Valley, many men lost their lives. This resulted many more females then males. In an attempt to thrive and grow to healthy numbers they decided that the practice of polygamy was acceptable given their circumstances, which was retracted and denounced many years later.

To answer your question, Einstein

No polygamy by itself is not wrong, abusive relationships and any type of forced relationship dynamic by a community -- even if only an attempt to influence -- is not only wrong but seriously fucked up.

those are decisions that are not OK for anybody to infringe upon another's right to choose for themselves

You don't need an excuse to love a fully knowledgeable consenting adult. It is up to each individual to choose their chosen family members. Each of US is free to offer Our Love to whomever we choose. The only other person who has any say in those decisions is the person or persons we offer Our Love to, and it is up to them and only them to accept or reject the offer to share Our life with each other.

which leads into the still not recognized crimes against same sex families, in regards to benefits and privileges afforded to committed heads of a family.

Not only that, but considering how wrong it is to not respect the God Given Right each of US has to chose who we will start families with, even telling people who they are is wrong -- because of who they choose for their family -- is just as fucked up and as serious a crime as implying non-Caucasians are any less human beings than the abominable Christian white hetero bigot blinded by hate (which is nothing more than a psychological disorder which can be taught wherein the diseased confuses love for hate and makes decisions based on a flawed understanding of truth)

Each and every church official, prophet, office holder , whatever who continues to lead people spiritually astray is guilty. People in positions whom the public has entrusted for spiritual guidance are held to a higher accountability than joe plumber whose flawed opinions have no effect on others.

Religious leader voluntarily take those positions, and they should take them seriously enough to not completely fuck up, or else fully disclose that they really aren't in any position to steer you.

I understand it is hard to see clearly as life is not what it seems while you are living it, but if they pray earnestly and honestly, and are willing to hear the truth for themselves, they will hear THE TRUTH, and there is absolutely no excuse not to listen, as these days God answers earnest and honest questions asked by everyone -- not just "prophets" -- perhaps you should consider asking the same question so that you may know the truth, fuckwit.

your attempts to symantically trap people won't work on people who are not afraid to admit they are human, and therefore not always perfect, fuckwit
I thought this letter sounded fake fake fake. It was like he trawled Dan's past columns and pasted together a Greatest Hits, followed by that stupid stupid question.
So you're saying it's Seattleblues?
What's so "gag" about dental dams? It's not like you actually get them from, like, a dentist office. Babeland has some vanilla flavored ones that aren't half bad!
@12 - you give the LDS church too much credit. They amended their policy because they needed to recruit more sheepies and build more temples, and Africa was ripe for the picking, so to speak. Hard to expand there when you didn't allow African-Americans into the priesthood back in the U.S.
I don't think the letter is fake, just that the LW overestimates his and his wife's awesomeness and fabulousness and intenseness.
I Lurve you guys so much.
As an outside member of Dan's Stranger club, I think this LW just wants to find out what risks Dan takes personally, in order to validate themselves and what they do. I am, unfortunately, someone who has considered sending a letter just like this. I want to be sex-positive, but I'm scared to indulge all of my sexual desires. Getting an "OK" from someone you assume is more experienced than you can really release your inhibitions. But it's not gonna happen here!
So they're kinky and fun and fabulous parents. And open to the world. So much awesomeness! Well, the kids are gonna hate it. If their first priority is the kids, well then quit being fantastically kinky. Kids want their parents to be normal. I'm not saying that parents have to be that, but maybe make an appearance of propriety for the kids sakes.
And, um, if the dick is going from a butt to a vagina, new condom every time, regardless of STD status - even if the two holes belong to the same person. Normal butt bacteria can make a pretty unpleasant infection in a vagina.
For them and their favored two, each should have their own toys.
Fake, fake fake fake

Fake, fake fake fake faaaaaake
It would be really useful if someone could put together a list of sex acts and an actual numerical probability of transmitting an STI.

Obviously, this sort of thing would vary from person to person and situation to situation, but something along the lines of describing relative risks in terms of orders of magnitude would help people make informed choices. For example (pulling numbers right out of my ass), what are your odds of HIV transmission if you're getting fucked by someone who's HIV+ and wearing a condom? !:100? 1:1000? 1:10.000? 1:100,000? 1:1,000,000? How does that compare to unsafe sex? Or oral sex? What about other STIs?

It would also be very useful to have a discussion about how things like multiple sex partners, HIV and other STI prevalence in your geographical area, the population your partner(s) are coming from, etc., etc. all affect those probabilities.

In short, it's not enough to say "this act is unsafe and that act is safe (or safer)". That doesn't give people enough information to make informed decisions. On the contrary, it substitutes someone else's risk assessment for your own. Hardly empowering.

If you're going to encourage people to act in ways that affect their risk, it seems to me that it's incumbent upon you to give them the best information you can to make their own, informed risk assessment.
@20 so true.

especially since these clueless shits "are out to the world about being "poly" because (they) think it's important for the world to know it can work well".

they should start the kids in counseling now.....

butt wait!

Danny says anal is 100% FoolProof and Safe for kids who don't want to use condoms......

The CDC has already done that, Moron.

They advise abstinence until in a longterm relationship (aka "marriage") and monogamy thereafter.

If by "If you're going to encourage people to act in ways that affect their risk" you mean Danny be aware that he is a malicious prick who wants everyone else to get AIDS. something about revenge for Reagan infecting him. bitter bitter little boy, this one. If you follow his advice you deserve what you get.

ah yes. of course.

so was doing polygamy wrong or was quitting it wrong?

and who got it wrong?

could you please peek inside Danny's head and find out?
@24 Corydon said: "It would be really useful if someone could put together a list of sex acts and an actual numerical probability of transmitting an STI."

Reply: I tried this recently with access to a medical school library. Unfortunately, the data just don't exist for most STIs -- too many variables and studies that do exist vary too much from study to study in terms of specifics to permit the type of meta-analysis you seek. What one can do is create a relative risk scale, which is why educators can say with confidence that sex+condom is less risky for herpes than sex without condom but still some risk, PVI riskier than oral, anal unprotected most risky, etc., but no specific odds.

The area where experts have tried to do this most thoroughly is HIV infection so there are specific odds estimates in some studies -- but these vary widely between studies for the same acts and depend on the base rate of infections in population subgroups. Plus the infectiousness of the virus / bacteria vary depending on strain, and epigenetics (one's own biological susceptibility profile including both genes and their expression) is a big factor but one that isn't yet possible to calculate. Maybe in 20 years!
@20,25 Seriously? Why don't you two take a flying fuck at a rolling doughnut?

I am not solely defined by my children and their wants and desires (often shaded by their limited experience) are not paramount. I realize someone is going to argue that this makes me a deficient parent, but only by ignoring most of human history, but even your (most likely purely speculative) special snowflakes simply do not require the level of slavish devotion.

Further, everyone's parents are weird in some way. Certainly, this is obscured from their peers their own personal popularity, or by their parent's absence in some cases, but there is still the kid with the vegan parents, the ethnic parents, the amazingly huge parent, the incredibly attractive parent, etc.; most kids are just fine.

Honestly, I expect at least one of you knows this, but found Polly's kids a convenient way to do the shaming you wanted to do without having to own it.

when homosexuals pray to god about their God Given Right! to start a family does he tell them the secret of how they can start a family? because Darwin seems to have left that part out.

or perhaps you could share what THE TRUTH is about homosexual reproduction, assuming god has told you.

pretty please?
@32. Wow, chill. Over react much? Of course parents are odd. I was and am the weird one. What people want to do with themselves is entirely their business, I'm not interested in shaming anyone. But having vegan parents is different than "My parents have kinky group sex on Saturday.". I just found a bit of a disconnect between between the "We're kinky and poly and open! And totally into being super duper parents.". I'm not sure being parents is really of any import to the question, other than to lend credence to their self appointed fabulousness.

And 25 is a troll.
@34 'But having vegan parents is different than "My parents have kinky group sex on Saturday."'

In that the vegan parent thing comes up every school day and such abnormality is transfered directly on the child through their lunch box, making it a lot more impactful, right?
@34: Who says the kids know anything about their parents' sex lives? It's not that hard to keep it private, especially as the kids are still young.
that seems like a lot of wind-up for a stupid question for someone who's been reading Savage for a long time to ask. but even if this letter is only half fake, all I can say is, ... wow, my life is pretty boring.
I know the guy was bragging (to the extent he wasn't lying), and no moral/ethical judgment here, but are there really many people out there who would live like this, even if given the opportunity? It sounds equal parts exhausting and icky to me. I mean, do people really want to go to a wedding reception, look around, and have to think about which guests you should invite to the orgy that you're planning for later? Or wonder/worry which guests might invite you to the orgy that they are planning for later?
Corydon @24, when I was in my promiscuous phase (couple of years ago), I looked at the research, and it seemed like with correct condom-usage the odds of getting/transmitting something life-threatening was quite low. But the odds of getting/transmitting something that could affect fertility was relatively high.

I'm done breeding, myself, but I would feel terrible if I prevented someone else from having a child -- so, personally, I didn't have sex with people who were still interested in having children.

Gotta be fake. Such a painfully obvious question for a so-called long time fan. (Even willful ignorance can't go this far...) The question is just to highlight how many holes are lined up to be fucked in the writer's erotic imagination.
The piece the letter leaves out is getting tested and talking about STIs. They should all be getting tested every 4 months or so, if they're having lots of sex with new people. They should make sure to exchange contact info before sex (which is hard at an orgy -- something to keep in mind).

And they should practice their reaction when they get the first phone call from a sex partner who got a positive test result. If you react badly ("How could you have done this to me?") then you're teaching your regular partners not to bring you bad news.

For the record, the proper response is: "Thank you so much for letting me know. I know this must have been a hard call to make. Are you doing okay?"

from page 36 of "Etiquette for Gommorahans"
@36. You're right, but the LW states that they are out to the world about being poly, thats it important to them that folks know its a successful lifestyle. Can't see how that is being discreet.
You gave me Anal Warts on my tongue?

oh. wow. are you OK?
at 17

Holy Moly did you hit the nail on the head, while it isn't exactly true that all poly people have this ridiculous sense of superiority, the fact that those who do -- deny it -- is enough to make people denounce the identity of being "poly", even though it may only be a small portion of polys who exhibit the behavior that make people make it a point to say "oh no! I am NOT poly"

Which is a shame when the attitude of a minority within any demographic causes people to distance themselves completely from said demography.

It is truly a case of the eighty/twenty syndrome which has always made addressing certain issues appear as impossible. However once you recognize that 80% of the problems are only due to 20% of the people it becomes clear how to best deal with over privileged white hetero Christian/Atheist attitudes (used to be restricted to fundamental Christians but nowdays Atheist fits too)

It's not that there is no other viable and practical solutions, it's that sometimes you cannot convince people that it is not necessarily what they are doing or saying per se, it's that they feel the need to deny the obvious, and that is nine times out of ten where the problem is rooted.



did you know that 20% of sexually active homosexual men have (and give) HIV?
You guys might want to slow down a bit lest you end up exhausted like the couple in this letter:…
@44 - see, there you go assuming that the caller gave you something, or exposed you to something. That's all kinds of fucked up.

It's just as likely that you passed the STI to the caller. Even though you're freaking out, don't assume you know who the "victim" and who the "perpetrator" is. Anyway, it's not important to figure out blame when everyone involved has been honest about their sexual activity. What's important is to get tested and to let everyone in the network know to get tested. Those aren't fun phone calls, but it's part of being an adult.

And, yes, I believe people should practice making & receiving those phone calls before it's real. Otherwise your freaked out brain will go straight where 44's did, and you'll blurt out "How could you do this to me?" and then no one will ever fuck you again. (Or if they do, they'll lie to you about their STI status.)

But as far as the the any advice and information requested, the only thing that Dan might want to mention is how many people there are out there for whom being knowledgeable about sexual health is a necessity, yet among those people is a prevalence of ignorance.

You would think that all flavors of non-monogamy and interest groups of such themes would be fully knowledgeable when it comes to sexual health, the sad fact is, this is not the case.

When it comes to testing and laboratory work, thanks to the million dollars sales teams of the multi-billion dollar, lucrative industry of diagnostic medical testing, even some actual medical doctors may have inadequate information to be considered competently educated.

in regards to 24, the reason there is no accurate info published reflect the the facts you would like to know, is because if there is anything that can be counted on, it is that people can be counted on to lie and intentionally provide false information.

So the while you can get somewhat accurate statistics of how likely you would be to contract the virus that causes aids if you accidentally poked yourself with syringe containing blood of an infected patient, even those numbers will have a significant margin of error due to Humans preference for denial.

@15 - I'm amazed anyone uses dental dams...I mean...I can't understand licking a piece of saran wrap, even if it is vanilla flavored...and for the just seems endlessly frustrating...might as well use fingers - leave the pants on!

nb - I am not a vagina owner, so I'm just guessing.
“we don't want to bother with condoms or (gag) dental dams for sucking, licking, and fingering”

This is where is gets really weird. Condoms or dental dams for fingering? No honey, it’s called a “glove.” Ask your dentist.…
So what about Homosexual Rapist Michael Stanley's rampage thru Seattle?
Made me lose my lunch about halfway through the letter. What a ridiculous bragging douchebag. I hope he and his wife get syphilis, gonorrhea, and herpes, and then pass it along to their "two young children".
@52: He's a pedophile. Or, technically, an ephebophile. Big difference. Look it up.
@53: See the last sentence of @6. And you wish that on the children, too? WTF?
The politic of it all is very troubling, but my own thing:

I'm a gold-star gay, and somehow this whole scene is my JAM. If only we lived in a world where constantly-mutating retroviruses weren't a concern...

"Try anything. Resist nothing."
@50 I lived in a place once where there were some dental dams in the bathroom cupboard left over from a previous roommate. My (then) current roommate explained that they were good for "when you're eating the ass of someone you don't know very well." There was however, no solid evidence that their original owner ever actually used them, so that still doesn't refute my theory that no one on earth has ever actually used a dental dam for oral sex.
@56: fwiw, I've tried to use dental dams precisely twice. The number of times the woman (not the same woman) looked down, and while maintaining eye contact, removed the dam: Two.
I can't quite resolve the discrepancy between "if a dick is going in a hole it needs a condom" and "Oral sex is less risky (that's true right?) and we don't want to bother with condoms or (gag) dental dams for sucking." Are you not considering your mouth a "hole"? Why would you come up with such a clear-cut rule like "dick in hole requires condom" and then muddy the waters by deciding it doesn't apply to mouths?
@56 Ha ha. Well, I guess technically that refutes my theory....