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Cold Feet
December 10, 2009
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Joe Newton
I am a 23-year-old male who has been in a relationship with a great woman for four years now. She is an amazing person, and we oftentimes talk about marriage. The issue is this: I have a foot fetish and she is fully aware of it. She doesn't like the idea of me kissing her feet or indulging my fetish in any way. We have sex quite often, and I've always let it slide that she doesn't want any part of my fetish. I don't know what to do, because I'm at a stage in my sexual growth where I need to experience my fetish. I'm getting mixed advice from different people and I just want a straight answer. The sex we have is amazing, but I would enjoy it so much more if I could act on my desires once in a while.
Sexually Frustrated Fetishist
Here's a straight answer: Your amazing girlfriend is an amazingly selfish lover, and I'm amazed that you've put up with her bullshit for as long as you have. A foot fetish is not uncommon or outrageous; as fetishes go, SFF, yours is the least taxing for a nonkinky partner. It's not like you're into shit or choking or Christian side hugs. Any amazing woman who truly loved you would regard indulging you as a no-brainer.
Share time: I have a good friend who's not kinky at all—unless you count being gay—and he's a runner who goes for long runs every Saturday morning. When he gets home, he handcuffs his boyfriend to a chair in his kitchen, duct-tapes one of his sweaty sneakers over the boyfriend's face, and leaves him there while he has breakfast. My friend—who came to me for advice when his boyfriend confessed his fetish—isn't really into guys with sneakers duct-taped to their faces. But it gets his lover off, and isn't that what lovers are for?
Your lover has had things—she's had you—on her terms for four years, SFF, which means you're going to have to play the breakup card. It's the only leverage you have. Tell her that if she can indulge your fetish—happily and regularly—and take some pleasure in giving you pleasure, she might be "the one." If she can't or won't, she obviously isn't. (Not that "the one" is anything other than a destructive myth, but for the sake of winning this argument, go ahead and use it.)
Finally, SFF, don't let the girlfriend—or anyone else—tell you that you're threatening to end this relationship over something trivial. Sexual fulfillment is important, particularly if your relationship is exclusive. And the "triviality" of your kink cuts both ways: If your kink is so trivial, why not just indulge you then? And in a long-term relationship—or a marriage—one partner's sexual selfishness and another's sexual frustration rarely prove trivial over the long haul. They're more often grounds for divorce.
I am a 35-year-old partnered gay man, but I've been having an online conversation with a married bisexual man that has become an ongoing game of sexual dares. It's a safe form of sexual adventurism for both of us. None of our dares has involved sexual contact with another person, but some of our dares have begun to involve other people at the edges. For example, we've posted ads to Craigslist as submissives and responded to some of the replies from dominant men. None of these interactions with third parties will result in actual contact. It feels a little like we are exploiting the "flakes" aspect of Craigslist, i.e., it's common to hear from someone a few times after making contact on Craigslist and then never hear from them again. But it also feels a little like we are using these folks. Is this expansion of our game to involve other people ethical?
Concerned About Harming Craigslist Fellas
P.S. This letter is itself part of a dare. If you publish it and include a dare in the reply, I will have to fulfill that dare.
The expansion of your game to Craigslist will annoy those guys on CL who are looking for actual contact, CAHCF, but as those guys amount to something less than 0.02 percent of the men trawling Craigslist at any given moment, I wouldn't worry about it. Everyone knows that CL is overrun with flakes and game players and picture collectors; the odds that the "dominant men" you've chatted with on CL are interested in actual contact are pretty damn slim. (Guys interested in real-time BDSM play are likelier to be lurking on Recon.com or in your local hardware store.) So post at will.
P.S. I dare you to go to www.tinyurl.com/ye3otsh and take the pledge.
I'm a straight guy in my late 20s. I have a girlfriend of several years whom I live with and I love very much. I just read your most recent column, in which you used the acronyms HND (honest nonmonogamous dude) and CPOS (cheating piece of shit), and it struck a nerve. I have never been an HND; I have in the past been a CPOS (though not in this relationship). My girlfriend is lovely, supportive, and generally GGG, and though the sex is good, I have a significantly higher libido than she does and I would like to have a little more variety in my sex life. I want to be an HND, but I don't know how to broach the subject with the girlfriend without ruining our relationship. We are very open about our sex life and our relationship in general, but I think this is probably a "next level" topic that may not go over very well. How do I bring this up without screwing up our relationship beyond repair?
Aspiring Honest Nonmonogamous Dude
Based on what you've learned about yourself in past relationships, AHND, i.e., that you're a CPOS waiting to happen, I would encourage you to err on the side of screwing up your current relationship with an honest conversation about your mismatched libidos and your natural and normal desire for a little variety. Lies, damn lies, and statistics all demonstrate that, in time, one or the other or both of you will cheat. Better to toss that out there now, even at the risk of calmly winding down this relationship before you revert to form/CPOS, than to see the relationship explode after someone, most likely you, winds up cheating.
And while we're on the subject of cheating...
I suppose I'm obligated to say a few words about Tiger Woods. First, let's pretend that Elin Nordegren cheated on Tiger and that Tiger went after Elin with a golf club. Would Elin be viewed as the sole transgressor in the marriage then? Probably not. And second, daily papers and cable news outfits reacted to Tiger's "transgressions" by changing the names in the same "Why do powerful men cheat?" stories they've been pimping since Bill Clinton blew a load on a White House intern. For the millionth time: Men cheat for the same reasons women cheat, i.e., because they're bored or horny or unfulfilled or desperate to see someone else naked for a change. People cheat because monogamy isn't natural and we are wired to cheat. That doesn't make cheating right, of course; people should honor their commitments, and blah-de-nine-iron-blah. But we shouldn't encourage people to make commitments we all know they're unlikely to keep. The end.
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2
Good advice again as per usual.
Sorta boring, vanilla questions though... but I guess not every week can be all poo eaters and dog fuckers.
Sorta boring, vanilla questions though... but I guess not every week can be all poo eaters and dog fuckers.
4
Tiger is a CPOS, which would be only his and Elin's business had he not pimped his wholesome image for tens of millions.
5
I know this isn't going to be popular, but what if SFF's girlfriend is truly, fully turned off by having someone sucking on her feet and making them an object of desire? What if it is completely nauseating to her, if it makes her feel trapped, ill and violated? They have a great relationship, she's a great woman and they have great sex - except for this one thing, which admittedly, is important to SFF. Why is it that just because someone has a strong urge FOR something, that it's not ok for the other partner to have an equally strong urge AGAINST it? My partner and I explore all kinds of kinks and ideas - but only those that are mutually agreeable. I will sometimes try something that I'm more than ambivalent about to please my partner, but I would be hurt and pissed if my partner pushed me hard for something that made me feel demeaned or violated - if she/he made it a make or break in our relationship. SFF needs to decide if the foot fetish is worth losing the "great" woman over - but if they've had a healthy conversation about his desires, and she simply can't accomodate for a strongly held reason - she's not the bad guy here. GGG is all good. But we don't force those we love to undergo experiences that take something from them emotionally or physically. It's a two way street in getting needs met.
7
OK, Dan I took the pledge. Not one more fucking dime until the DNC honors their commitments. I'll still vote for them though. As I told my right wing Republican mother," I'd rather my tax dollars go to support some welfare mom pumping out kids than manufacturing bullets to kill someone overseas.
BTW AHND I cheated on every girlfriend I ever had until I got a bisexual one. It was like the heavens opened up and I could finally be honest about my non monogamous ways. I'm now married to a woman who likes woman as much as I do.
BTW AHND I cheated on every girlfriend I ever had until I got a bisexual one. It was like the heavens opened up and I could finally be honest about my non monogamous ways. I'm now married to a woman who likes woman as much as I do.
8
Wow, my grammar is sucking. I guess that's what I get for drinking a double vodka tonic and commenting.
9
People shouldn't make commitments that they are unlikely to keep! Of course, no one is perfect and we all have our own bit of "transgressions" to contend with, but Tiger is a horn dog with women falling out of the wood work. Although, I don't agree that we are all wired to cheat,Tiger clearly is, and probably knew that about himself before he ever got married.
10
it's not that it's not ok for her to feel that way, it's just not ok for her to feel that way and still expect him to be his whole self in a relationship. it's not ok for him to stay in a relationship that isn't right for him. and it IS shitty of her to not even try, or at least explain what you said above "hey, i've tried it, it's horrible for me and you need to know that i can't ever do that with you. if that means we can't be together, then i'm sorry but it just won't work." they each owe each other that.
incidentally, it's funny this one came up today because i was just thinking earlier today about how i should indulge my partner's anal fetishes more, regardless of my personal distaste for anal. after all, it is his enthusiasm for it that makes it worthwhile and even enjoyable for me.
incidentally, it's funny this one came up today because i was just thinking earlier today about how i should indulge my partner's anal fetishes more, regardless of my personal distaste for anal. after all, it is his enthusiasm for it that makes it worthwhile and even enjoyable for me.
11
Why can't SFF go to the girlfriend and say this, "You know I like this one thing (foot fetish), and I know you don't. However, it's really starting to bother me that I don't get to indulge in it. Here's are the options: 1) You let me indulge my fetish once a month/quarter/week/whatever, and I will pay for monthly pedicures for you. Or 2) I get to indulge my fetish by going to someone else (no intercourse involved. It really needs to be one or the other for me because I can't keep on going never having this need met. What can we do about it?" And then the ball is in her court. I would let my husband indulge his foot fetish if it involved a pedicure as often as he gets to indulge. That might be what pushes her "go" button. Try it. I really think it's better than the "my way or highway" approach Dan advised above.
12
As a woman, I'd like to think this whole "men are scum for cheating" thing is karmic payback for the thousands of years women have been forced to endure being divorced, publicly shamed, or even killed for cheating on their husbands when they were allowed to keep several concubines. Shame on those men for thinking of and treating their wives as property. Karma's a bitch, isn't it?
13
Come on people, I thought we were all past this stupid "first?" crap. It's lame and just taking up space. If you don't have something relevant to say, don't post!
14
I'm w/#5. How far does one have to go to be GGG? A foot fetish seems harmless to me but what about, say, a threesome. They're fairly common these days and my BF would probably cry tears of joy if I agreed to one but there's just no fucking way. The idea does less than nothing for me and it would make me feel like complete shit. I just don't have it in me. Otherwise we have lots of great sex and I don't ask him to blow another guy or anything. Is it really fair for someone to ask you to do something repulsive (to you) and you're the bitch if you won't do it?
15
I'm SO SICK of Tiger Woods! If I want to hear about some creepy sleaze ball's sordid sex life, I'll read Savage Love (which I do, religiously). It's on the news, though! Last Wednesday, on the 11:00 network news, the Tiger Woods nonsense was the LEAD story and occupied the first 7 mins of the broadcast, complete with street interviews and “expert” opinions. The night before's devastating failure of the gay marriage bill in the NYS senate occupied less than 1 min, 15 mins into the broadcast. Obama's decision to send 30,000 more troops into danger in Afghanistan wasn’t even mentioned at all. THIS is why I usually get my news from NPR. Walter Cronkite is turning over in his grave.
16
Ugh, I can't even watch the news anymore. It's all turned into crap like the Insider. At least the Insider doesn't pretend to be "hard-hitting" and unbiased. Who the hell cares about Tiger Woods? He isn't a religious conservative Republican spouting off anti-gay, pro-family values crap. He cheated on his wife (with several women) and got caught. She flipped out when she found out and went after him with a golf club. Why is that news we need to know about? He didn't smack her or kill and dismember his wife. Why do we need to know if he cheated?
17
I have to agree with comment 5 above, and I do so not only from imagined sympathy for the hypothetical girl who is turned off by foot-play, but from my own experience as a real live woman. While I am more than happy to indulge my partner if I can, I am completely, utterly, and 100% repulsed by toe-sucking, toes in private places, heel-licking, you name it. My memories of a previous boyfriend's attempts at this behavior still sicken me (not that I think there is anything wrong with it, on the contrary, I think it's absolutely harmless, but it's just not my thing). While I am perfectly comfortable with clean, well manicured, non-stinky feet in an ordinary context (I even give great foot-rubs), feet completely gross me out in a sexual context. If my boyfriend of several years made his foot-fetish a make-it-or-break it issue, I'm afraid it would break it for me because I couldn't stomach it.
Honestly, from what SFF wrote, I believe that the real question is whether SFF wants to remain with his girlfriend, foot-fetish or no. I mean, he is only 23, and he's already been with her for a few years, which means that he was very young when they got together. That doesn't mean that a life partnership is out of the question, of course, but it does make it a lot less unlikely. It's very likely that he feels compelled to sow his wild oats, and if he feels that way, then he should probably do it before he grows bored and resentful. And while his foot-fetish may be very important to him, it may also be a convenient excuse to leave his current relationship. If so, he shouldn't feel bad about it because most people aren't ready to marry the person they started dating at age 20, but he should do what he can to spare his girlfriend's feelings, e.g., tell her he wants to break up because he's not ready to settle down, vs. blaming it on her unwillingness to suck nauseating his toe jam down her throat.
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Honestly, from what SFF wrote, I believe that the real question is whether SFF wants to remain with his girlfriend, foot-fetish or no. I mean, he is only 23, and he's already been with her for a few years, which means that he was very young when they got together. That doesn't mean that a life partnership is out of the question, of course, but it does make it a lot less unlikely. It's very likely that he feels compelled to sow his wild oats, and if he feels that way, then he should probably do it before he grows bored and resentful. And while his foot-fetish may be very important to him, it may also be a convenient excuse to leave his current relationship. If so, he shouldn't feel bad about it because most people aren't ready to marry the person they started dating at age 20, but he should do what he can to spare his girlfriend's feelings, e.g., tell her he wants to break up because he's not ready to settle down, vs. blaming it on her unwillingness to suck nauseating his toe jam down her throat.
18
17 - I have to agree with you. There isn't anything that could make the idea of my husband's foot/toe/heel/whatever in my mouth sexy. Kudos for those who like it, and I hope you find people to satisfy your harmless kink, but it's just not for me.
However, it sounds as though his thing is sucking on her toes. Maybe if she had a little incentive (see my previous comment about pedicures above), she might be enticed into trying it. If, however, she is completely repelled by it, perhaps he needs to find fulfillment elsewhere.
However, it sounds as though his thing is sucking on her toes. Maybe if she had a little incentive (see my previous comment about pedicures above), she might be enticed into trying it. If, however, she is completely repelled by it, perhaps he needs to find fulfillment elsewhere.
19
I really find it difficult to accept the argument that "monogamy is not natural" and people are simply "wired" to cheat. You've mentioned this quite a bit in your column, and I'm just curious if you are faithful to your own partner and co-Daddy, Dan?
21
re: Tiger Woods. If it's true he only married for publicity reasons, AND if his wife knew and went along with it, then can he really be said to have cheated on her? Then again, if she knew it was fake I guess she'd have no reason to go after him with a golf club?...so if he fake-married her without her knowing, then he's an even bigger jerk than the typical serial cheater.
22
19, read the back columns. It's evolutionary science for one -- virtually no animal in monogamus, and humans certainly aren't meant to be.
I bet Dan's faithful in a Savage Love way -- in that he is perfectly honest and GGG with his partner. But really, it ought not matter, because it's his own business.
I bet Dan's faithful in a Savage Love way -- in that he is perfectly honest and GGG with his partner. But really, it ought not matter, because it's his own business.
23
@4 Actually, I think the violence that apparently entered into their relationship for at least one night is more the reason why this is our business. It's sad that people in 2009 still have the mindset of "if no one wants to press charges, then it's none of our business"
Domestic violence is our business, no matter who is the aggressor.
Domestic violence is our business, no matter who is the aggressor.
24
@5-- There's nothing fundamentally wrong with someone for not wanting her feet played with. What it comes down to in the end is that he wants to be in a relationship that includes X, and she wants to be in a relationship that includes at least as much Not-X. If one or the other isn't going to give, then they're simply incompatible.
Neither of them is a better or worse person for it, but sometimes people aren't right for each other and sometimes it's because of stuff far less important than a fetish. It is possible for two people to decide that a relationship is going to work out without one of them necessarily being 'the bad guy.'
Neither of them is a better or worse person for it, but sometimes people aren't right for each other and sometimes it's because of stuff far less important than a fetish. It is possible for two people to decide that a relationship is going to work out without one of them necessarily being 'the bad guy.'
25
#5, #17, et al...
I actually think that's kind of the point. There is nothing wrong with her absolutely refusing to indulge him in that kink. But she has to acknowledge that, in doing so in the context of a monogamous, heading-towards-marriage relationship, she is basically telling him to accept a lifetime of sexual denial.
And please, no fake-out allusions to what else is on offer, sexually. If he is as sexually connected to feet as he himself states, then citing the all the great head she'll give him is purely diversionary.
In short, if that is her line in the sand (and she has every right to draw one), than they will probably have to just admit they are not going to work out in the long haul. Sad, but better now than in ten years when she catches him beating off with someone else's foot in his mouth.
I actually think that's kind of the point. There is nothing wrong with her absolutely refusing to indulge him in that kink. But she has to acknowledge that, in doing so in the context of a monogamous, heading-towards-marriage relationship, she is basically telling him to accept a lifetime of sexual denial.
And please, no fake-out allusions to what else is on offer, sexually. If he is as sexually connected to feet as he himself states, then citing the all the great head she'll give him is purely diversionary.
In short, if that is her line in the sand (and she has every right to draw one), than they will probably have to just admit they are not going to work out in the long haul. Sad, but better now than in ten years when she catches him beating off with someone else's foot in his mouth.
26
19 - This column is not about Dan. If it was, it wouldn't be as successful as it is. This isn't "Sex and the City" bull-shit, so he's not going to talk about what he and his husband do, particularly since Terry has told Dan he doesn't like it.
27
Monogamy *is* natural for some people. Same as being gay, or being poly, or being straight is natural for some people. We're not meant to be all the same. Saying monogamy isn't natural is very judgmental to those of us for whom it comes naturally, and is also just incorrect.
It's like saying because most people are straight, being gay isn't natural. Because most humans are brown, being white isn't natural. Because most human beings have dark eyes, light eyes are unnatural.
Why isn't it simply ok to be wired the way you're wired, an it harm none?
Which goes for both sides of that argument, btw - the non-monogamous can stop smugly telling use how more evolved and truer to their nature they are, and the monogamous can STFU about other people's adult, consensual, honest choices, ffs.
(Can you tell I'm sick of people assuming their way is the "natural" or "best" way for everybody else?)
It's like saying because most people are straight, being gay isn't natural. Because most humans are brown, being white isn't natural. Because most human beings have dark eyes, light eyes are unnatural.
Why isn't it simply ok to be wired the way you're wired, an it harm none?
Which goes for both sides of that argument, btw - the non-monogamous can stop smugly telling use how more evolved and truer to their nature they are, and the monogamous can STFU about other people's adult, consensual, honest choices, ffs.
(Can you tell I'm sick of people assuming their way is the "natural" or "best" way for everybody else?)
28
@5 and similar,
I recall Dan saying some time ago how blowjobs are no longer kinky (were they ever?) and someone refusing a BJ is way outside the norm and sorta strange (and therefore dump-worthy without having to feel shitty for dumping someone for a kink).
Foot fetishism is boring and vanilla. He's not asking her to eat his poo or fuck his dog. It's a foot. It's boring. She can't bring herself to do something as boring as a foot-job every now and then?
She's not evil or mean or anything, but she is refusing to do something that's really barely kinky. Unlike eating poo or fucking a dog, there are a million other chicks out there who would likley be identical to this chick but with the advantage of also being willing to do feet too.
Evolution of sex can be a bitch for those unwilling to change.
I recall Dan saying some time ago how blowjobs are no longer kinky (were they ever?) and someone refusing a BJ is way outside the norm and sorta strange (and therefore dump-worthy without having to feel shitty for dumping someone for a kink).
Foot fetishism is boring and vanilla. He's not asking her to eat his poo or fuck his dog. It's a foot. It's boring. She can't bring herself to do something as boring as a foot-job every now and then?
She's not evil or mean or anything, but she is refusing to do something that's really barely kinky. Unlike eating poo or fucking a dog, there are a million other chicks out there who would likley be identical to this chick but with the advantage of also being willing to do feet too.
Evolution of sex can be a bitch for those unwilling to change.
29
I love the discussions about monogamy. It doesn't work for me! :) One of my favorite jokes about the tools I sell (sextoys!) is that it's a safe and cheap way to have that threesome you've been pining for! It's funny to me that some people will are even jealous of TOYS, let alone people in their partner's boudoir. Hell, I have more extra PEOPLE than some people have TOYS!
I just adore having my feet touched. (Note to self, next boytoy will have to love feet.) I only worry about someone wanting to kiss my feet if they're not completely clean. (and no, I don't want to kiss them afterwards!) But if they're clean, they're just another part of me! People can be such germaphobes!
I just adore having my feet touched. (Note to self, next boytoy will have to love feet.) I only worry about someone wanting to kiss my feet if they're not completely clean. (and no, I don't want to kiss them afterwards!) But if they're clean, they're just another part of me! People can be such germaphobes!
30
I hate it when you say monogamy is unnatural, Dan. It's probably not the most common orientation, but I'm sure some people out there do not have any interest in sex with someone other than their partner. Your dismissal makes it sound like there is something wrong with these people, and it reminds me of right-wing nuts jobs screaming that homosexuality is unnatural. I wouldn't be surprised if 8% of the population didn't have make an effort to stay monogamous.
32
@22: "It's evolutionary science for one"
If you look at most higher animals, the inherent urge is to monopolize several partners. The ideal for any one person is the harem, not the free love free-for-all. Unfortunately, every member of my harem has to want to be in a very lopsided relationship, and there's a real shortage of people into that side of things.
Which is what makes monogamy so popular. As awesome as it sounds to have multiple partners, most people are less than happy seeing their partner do the same. It's not for no reason that poly types are seen as manipulative and controlling unicorn hunters, after all.
If you look at most higher animals, the inherent urge is to monopolize several partners. The ideal for any one person is the harem, not the free love free-for-all. Unfortunately, every member of my harem has to want to be in a very lopsided relationship, and there's a real shortage of people into that side of things.
Which is what makes monogamy so popular. As awesome as it sounds to have multiple partners, most people are less than happy seeing their partner do the same. It's not for no reason that poly types are seen as manipulative and controlling unicorn hunters, after all.
33
@22: Funny how "evolutionary science" is used to prop up pretty much any argument these days. It seems to me that all that sexual honesty is really just the new fidelity. Oh, but wait - doesn't "evolutionary science" also tell us that people are hardwired to lie?! Back to square one.
34
@5, 17, 18--I don't get to experience sorrow, empathy, disgust, or pity the way the vast majority of you primates do. I understand complex human emotions much in the same way a color blind artist must understand color. 'Oh, that particular gray must be blue,' he must think.
The best way I can describe the disquiet I feel realizing that there are people to whom indulgence of such a safe little kink would be a deal-breaker is very similar to the feeling I get when someone gets up to get a beer and I ask them, 'hey, since you're up, would you mind getting one for me?' and they say, 'get it yourself.'
I don't know what you'd call that feeling. But it's not a good feeling.
The best way I can describe the disquiet I feel realizing that there are people to whom indulgence of such a safe little kink would be a deal-breaker is very similar to the feeling I get when someone gets up to get a beer and I ask them, 'hey, since you're up, would you mind getting one for me?' and they say, 'get it yourself.'
I don't know what you'd call that feeling. But it's not a good feeling.
35
Tiger Woods was abused. His infidelity is trivial, and a money whore like Elin should have expected it. The real story is spousal abuse. She committed grievous bodily assault on Tiger and is getting away with it. Far from being sent to prison, she is extracting hush money. And the media talks about nothing but Tiger's indiscretions this, Tiger's infidelity that. It's a travesty.
36
Tiger Woods was abused. His infidelity is trivial, and a money whore like Elin should have expected it. The real story is spousal abuse. She committed grievous bodily assault on Tiger and is getting away with it. Far from being sent to prison, she is extracting hush money. And the media talks about nothing but Tiger's indiscretions this, Tiger's infidelity that. It's a travesty.
37
To number 5 above.Nobody said she was the bad guy.If she doesn`t like having her feet sucked she should go find a new boy friend who doesn`t want to suck her feet.No one is bad,they are just not a good match.His feeling of being denied and her guilt for denying him will never go away..Why do so mant people waiste their life with the wrong person?
39
I won't let my doctor look at my feet. I've never had a pedicure- just the thought makes me queasy. I like anal, oral, you name it but if I had a partner who wanted to worship my feet, I'd be on my way out the door.
40
I agree with #5 and others. They may be fundamentally incompatible, but it's awfully damn judgmental to decide she's "selfish" without hearing her side of the story. Like, perhaps, the times she'd tried it with other men and it grossed her out.
On the other hand, the guy might be immature and unrealistic. No partner is perfect. It's deciding what imperfections you can live with. If she's wondeful in every way except for her distaste for this one fetish he admits he hasn't explored (and may not survive), he might be throwing out the baby with the proverbial toe-jam annointed water.
On the other hand, the guy might be immature and unrealistic. No partner is perfect. It's deciding what imperfections you can live with. If she's wondeful in every way except for her distaste for this one fetish he admits he hasn't explored (and may not survive), he might be throwing out the baby with the proverbial toe-jam annointed water.
41
@25 - funny you should say that people who aren't willing to put up with their feet being fondled are behind the times. I'm poly, I'm somewhat kinky (yes, real ropes and real floggers), and the idea of someone sucking on any part of my feet skeeves me no end. I'm happy to do it to someone else, funnily enough, but being on the receiving end would be like kissing a 13 year old boy with a wet fish tongue and enough drool to fill a bucket.
Yuck.
So, yeah, let's just stop wildly generalising - sometimes disliking activity X simply means you dislike activity X, not that you have no sexual flexibility or aren't keeping up with the times. (Such a ridiculous assertion, that)
Yuck.
So, yeah, let's just stop wildly generalising - sometimes disliking activity X simply means you dislike activity X, not that you have no sexual flexibility or aren't keeping up with the times. (Such a ridiculous assertion, that)
42
Is it just Dan in here, or did anybody else read the column this week?
All he advised -- in fact, all he ever advises -- is that people discuss their desires in mature, honest language and come to an agreement (even if it's to disagree; i.e., split up, secret mister/ress, etc.).
He didn't hand SFF some magic power club to beat his girlfriend with, obligating her to be a foot freak.
All Dan did was point out the obvious: if it's important to you in bed, you should find someone who loves you enough to respect that, and take it from there. Step #2 is up to you.
Is that too subtle or something? From the comments, you'd think Dan told the kid to do the can-can on his girlfriend's face!
All he advised -- in fact, all he ever advises -- is that people discuss their desires in mature, honest language and come to an agreement (even if it's to disagree; i.e., split up, secret mister/ress, etc.).
He didn't hand SFF some magic power club to beat his girlfriend with, obligating her to be a foot freak.
All Dan did was point out the obvious: if it's important to you in bed, you should find someone who loves you enough to respect that, and take it from there. Step #2 is up to you.
Is that too subtle or something? From the comments, you'd think Dan told the kid to do the can-can on his girlfriend's face!
43
And, by the way, SFF's GF IS selfish for refusing to try it, apparently without explanation. She's also incredibly unimaginative. If they have a chat about sexual fetishes and boundaries, and power dynamics and so on, who knows? She may have a few things she wants to try, too, but has never given any time to thinking about.
That's what makes this comment thread so distressing: most people seem to see thoughtful discussions of sex as threatening or borderline-abusive ("she said no. No means no! Maybe she has tried it before...!"). I mean, project much?
It would be a shame if two young people wasted years of their primes because they couldn't do that fundamental human activity that is: fast, easy, free: talk to one another. That's all Dan advised, BTW.
That's what makes this comment thread so distressing: most people seem to see thoughtful discussions of sex as threatening or borderline-abusive ("she said no. No means no! Maybe she has tried it before...!"). I mean, project much?
It would be a shame if two young people wasted years of their primes because they couldn't do that fundamental human activity that is: fast, easy, free: talk to one another. That's all Dan advised, BTW.
44
Thank you, #27. Some people ARE naturally monogamous, and Dan's assertions to the contrary have bugged me for years (although I love his column and agree with him on most things).
When I am with someone, and I am happy (as I have been with my husband for the past 10 years), I feel no desire to go after anyone else. I might notice that someone else is attractive, but that doesn't mean I am motivated or compelled to have sex with them.
Let's face it: for some people, getting together with someone requires a lot of effort, and if you have someone at home that you are happy with, why bother? Bird in the hand and all that. (If you are unhappy or unfullfilled, that's a different story, of course.) And that's why monogamy works for a lot of people -- it's a comfortable combination of love and laziness.
When I am with someone, and I am happy (as I have been with my husband for the past 10 years), I feel no desire to go after anyone else. I might notice that someone else is attractive, but that doesn't mean I am motivated or compelled to have sex with them.
Let's face it: for some people, getting together with someone requires a lot of effort, and if you have someone at home that you are happy with, why bother? Bird in the hand and all that. (If you are unhappy or unfullfilled, that's a different story, of course.) And that's why monogamy works for a lot of people -- it's a comfortable combination of love and laziness.
45
I think the first two letters were written by spoiled brats who need to STFU & count their blessings. The foot fetishist claims his gf is an AMAZING person and they have AMAZING sex, so what is he kvetching about? If his stupid fetish is so freakin important, he should stop wasting her time & look for a woman who's willing to put up w/this nonsense. She deserves better.
The guy who wrote the second letter says he's partnered, a fact that seems to get lost in the actual body of the letter, for heaven's sake. If he's in a relationship, why is even online with others? Does he even spend time w/his so-called partner?
Needless to say, I completely disagree with Dan's advice to both parties. Oh, and btw, #19? Dan said at a book signing that he & Terry have an agreement that they don't have to be faithful when they're not in the same town. This may explain his writing so many books and subsequently going on lengthy book tours.
The guy who wrote the second letter says he's partnered, a fact that seems to get lost in the actual body of the letter, for heaven's sake. If he's in a relationship, why is even online with others? Does he even spend time w/his so-called partner?
Needless to say, I completely disagree with Dan's advice to both parties. Oh, and btw, #19? Dan said at a book signing that he & Terry have an agreement that they don't have to be faithful when they're not in the same town. This may explain his writing so many books and subsequently going on lengthy book tours.
47
I totally agree with 5. If someone isn't interested in doing something, they shouldn't have it forced on them. And threatening to break up unless they do something that makes them feel uncomfortable? That's pretty much emotional blackmail right there.
48
I really think the people going on and on about how pissed they are that Dan would dare to assert that "monogamy isn't natural" are being a little too sensitive. Monogamy is an act, a decision. Some people are great at it and refrain from fucking other people the entire time they are in relationships. However, there are many more people out there who are not good at it.
Dan has said in his podcasts that they've done studies on animals that have been thought for decades to be monogamous ("hey look everybody, if a bird can do it, it should be easy for people!"). They found little birdy spunk from many different birdies in that little birdy body. That proves that while the birds are not together, they are getting busy with lots of other birds. They just come back to the same nest together.
Like some commenters above said, some people are just so good at being monogamous, that it comes "naturally" to them. That isn't the same thing as saying monogamy is natural for some people. If you ask older couples that have been together for many, many years and they answer honestly, I'd bet there were some indiscretions that happened in their past. Very few relationships are completely untouched by infidelity. It all depends on how well the "unfaithful" one can hide it.
Dan has said in his podcasts that they've done studies on animals that have been thought for decades to be monogamous ("hey look everybody, if a bird can do it, it should be easy for people!"). They found little birdy spunk from many different birdies in that little birdy body. That proves that while the birds are not together, they are getting busy with lots of other birds. They just come back to the same nest together.
Like some commenters above said, some people are just so good at being monogamous, that it comes "naturally" to them. That isn't the same thing as saying monogamy is natural for some people. If you ask older couples that have been together for many, many years and they answer honestly, I'd bet there were some indiscretions that happened in their past. Very few relationships are completely untouched by infidelity. It all depends on how well the "unfaithful" one can hide it.
49
Hey, what about allowing him to worship other people's feet, if she is so against it? There doesn't have to be intercourse. So long as he's only touching/kissing/rubbing/worshipping her feet, I think she can talk herself out of considering it cheating and then they can stay together without her having to be the one whose feet he wants to worship. I mentioned this earlier, but it seems to have been glossed over. There isn't any reason he can't do this one thing (and I highly doubt this is the ONLY thing she won't do with him) with someone else if she is so opposed to it.
51
Regarding the "monogamy isn't natural" nonsense, here are three things that also aren't "natural": driving a car, flying an airplane, taking penicillin. Should we stop doing those things because they're "unnatural"? Monogamy in a relationship comes down to simple adult responsibility. If you don't agree, don't waste your partner's time if he/she's into monogamy & you're not.
And since Hanukkah's this week, I wish everyone a Jewish side hug!
And since Hanukkah's this week, I wish everyone a Jewish side hug!
52
Not everybody is "good at being monogamous". Some people just don't particularly want to fuck other people and one does it for them.
You can cry bullshit all you want, but then you can't get angry at all the monogamous couples crying bullshit at happy threesomes.
I guess my point is: different things work for different people, and if you expect the monogamous people to not ridicule non-monogamous people or insist that what they do is unnatural or against their nature then you should perhaps extend the same courtesy to everyone else.
I love savage love, but im kinda sick seeing my (monogamous) lifestyle disparaged while almost every kink under the sun gets the "if it makes you happy" card. For some people, monogamy is their kink and that should be respected, even if its not yours.
You can cry bullshit all you want, but then you can't get angry at all the monogamous couples crying bullshit at happy threesomes.
I guess my point is: different things work for different people, and if you expect the monogamous people to not ridicule non-monogamous people or insist that what they do is unnatural or against their nature then you should perhaps extend the same courtesy to everyone else.
I love savage love, but im kinda sick seeing my (monogamous) lifestyle disparaged while almost every kink under the sun gets the "if it makes you happy" card. For some people, monogamy is their kink and that should be respected, even if its not yours.
53
I'm shocked @5 and everyone who's expressed agreement! A foot fetish is so easy to negotiate and needn't include toe-sucking or foot-licking if that skeeves the girlfriend out. How much to you want to bet that she's had a pedicure? I bet her foot-fetishist boyfriend could paint her toenails or give her a foot massage while she reads a magazine and it would be fulfilling his fetish. We should ALL be so lucky.
54
Having my feet admired verbally, while I wear high heels makes me feel gorgeous, which is a good start to some great sex; having my toes licked or sucked does nothing for me, but it seems to make my boyfriend happy, and that makes me happy, both emotionally and a bit later, sexually. It's a fairly easy desire to accommodate. And now it's beginning to be more erotic for me because the associations of the overall context of the sex that specific act occurs in have been so pleasurable. But it wasn't easy for me to initially go with it. I didn't feel repulsed so much as self-conscious and foolish. But it meant something important to my bf, so I tried it for his sake. If I had absolutely hated it, after giving it a shot, I would have told him, and I like to think we would have tried a compromise--but I don't hate it.
If it isn't absolutely horrifying to you, I think you should try to please your partner, and at at least see if you can get satisfaction from knowing that you are turning him/her on.
If it isn't absolutely horrifying to you, I think you should try to please your partner, and at at least see if you can get satisfaction from knowing that you are turning him/her on.
56
to Nikki in MN:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0daJoMRm1…
I get to fly back to MN this afternoon. Wish me luck.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0daJoMRm1…
I get to fly back to MN this afternoon. Wish me luck.
57
i can't help wondering how SFF has approached this with his GF. How you talk to someone and persuade someone to try something like this has a big influence on how you feel about trying something, and if you decide to be GGG, how you feel about the act itself. Case in point with me and anal. my first BF was mad to try it, but his method of persuading me ( telling me that women inporn mags did it leading up to what amounted to bribary/blackmail in the end with no real consideration of making it sensuous for me, orgetting me over the inherant, it's dirty, painful, i'm not that kind of girl issues) left alot to be desired, and when I eventually gave in it was a painful,upsetting and degrading experience which I swore never to repeat. Until the guy i'm with now came along.. he made it sexy and put no pressure on me, starting just stroking down there when going down on me, then on to fingers, mutual fantasies, alot of reassurance, patience, and when we actually tried it, when i was totally ready, alot of lube.. ;0) and you know what, i love it now (and would love to bump into BF no.1 and rub that in his face - it didn't end well.. ;0) ) so I guess, the message is, with a little patience, maturity (they're both young by the sounds of it and the confidence to try new things may come with age) and by approaching it very slowly and carefully with definitely no pressure minds can be changed and if you can make it sexy for her in anyway rather than just begging then she might come to love a little foot worship :0)
58
@7: "BTW AHND I cheated on every girlfriend I ever had until I got a bisexual one. It was like the heavens opened up and I could finally be honest about my non monogamous ways. I'm now married to a woman who likes woman as much as I do."
Huh. I guess I didn't get the memo, because I didn't know bisexuality automatically equates non-monogamy. I'm pretty sure there are a fair number of bisexuals out there who like having one partner at a time too. I'm also fairly certain that a lot of straight/gay couples are happily openly fucking pieces on the side.
Good job on implicitly blaming your cheating ways on your girlfriends though. "God, she only likes to fuck men! That means I can't talk to her or have an open relationship. Must ... LIE!"
Thank God you're married. Now no other woman has to deal with your asshole ways.
Huh. I guess I didn't get the memo, because I didn't know bisexuality automatically equates non-monogamy. I'm pretty sure there are a fair number of bisexuals out there who like having one partner at a time too. I'm also fairly certain that a lot of straight/gay couples are happily openly fucking pieces on the side.
Good job on implicitly blaming your cheating ways on your girlfriends though. "God, she only likes to fuck men! That means I can't talk to her or have an open relationship. Must ... LIE!"
Thank God you're married. Now no other woman has to deal with your asshole ways.
59
Yes, people are "wired" to sleep with more than one person. We are also "wired" to pee when our bladders get full, no matter the time or place, but we can learn to hold it. I fear that this non-monogamous movement is just an excuse for people to declare themselves hopelessly horny and try to make people who want commitment look like controlling bitches. Monogamy isn't easy, but it's possible. And sex, even anonymous drunken bar sex, fosters intimacy. Some people feel that that sort of intimacy should be reserved for one's partner. Fantasize all you want, face away from (or the back of) your partner, squeeze your eyes shut, and do your damnedest to imagine someone else. Collect a wide variety of sex toys and name them after your favorite stage and screen stars, or even that hotty at work. But maybe you could try to demonstrate your commitment by NOT actually going out and hooking up. It's not THAT hard. Even the non-monogamous spend 99% of their time NOT having sex with other people, just skip it that last 1% of the time too.
But even if you choose an open relationship, or non-monogamy, or peeing on furniture or whatever, don't try to make the monogamous folks out here, or the house trained ones, look like crap for "denying" who they really are.
But even if you choose an open relationship, or non-monogamy, or peeing on furniture or whatever, don't try to make the monogamous folks out here, or the house trained ones, look like crap for "denying" who they really are.
60
Thanks for the vid, zenbeatnik. Good luck getting here with no delays! Gotta love winter in MN - it's the best 7 months of the year.
That's so dumb! I, personally, have hugged many, many people and have never touched crotch areas with any of them. You can hug without "accidentally touching crotches," for Pete's sake! That's just so silly. A hug, to me and many others, is not a sexual thing.
The only time a "side hug" is not completely silly is when you're posing for a picture.
That's so dumb! I, personally, have hugged many, many people and have never touched crotch areas with any of them. You can hug without "accidentally touching crotches," for Pete's sake! That's just so silly. A hug, to me and many others, is not a sexual thing.
The only time a "side hug" is not completely silly is when you're posing for a picture.
61
It is amusing to read the various versions of the following:
"I have the Thrusting Reeses Monkeys circus show and thong-clad muscle boys in every seven-way I participate in at my uncle's house, but you monogamy people, you guys are really delusional about how unnatural your professed sexual preferences."
"I have the Thrusting Reeses Monkeys circus show and thong-clad muscle boys in every seven-way I participate in at my uncle's house, but you monogamy people, you guys are really delusional about how unnatural your professed sexual preferences."
62
and what about a "side hug" makes it inherently Christian? The person giving the hug? A really stupid "rap" video done by a bunch of wannabe thuggin' white boys? Lord help me, I really hope this crap doesn't catch on. I'm with the girl in the video link; if someone came up to me and tried giving me a "side hug", I'd be a little weirded out and wonder, dude, what the hell?
Ah, the internet just gives people more ways to show the world just how dumb they really are.
Ah, the internet just gives people more ways to show the world just how dumb they really are.
63
59 - I may be mistaken, but I don't think that's the argument the "monogamy isn't natural" people are trying to present.
It isn't about denying who you are and whatnot. For me, it is about acknowledging that monogamy is a choice, not an inherent feature of being human. Monogamy is about refraining from sleeping with other people. People in monogamous relationships refrain from cheating in deference to their partner's feelings. Some people are great at it, and I applaud those who are and to whom it comes easily. To others, it is a struggle to keep from acting on their impulses to sleep with any easy piece of ass offered up to them.
If it comes easily for you, great! Just don't get all uppity when others aren't as great as staying on the monogamy wagon as you are. We're not saying you're "denying who you are" by being monogamous (I happen to be successfully monogamous myself, in point of fact), only that you're better at sticking to you choice to be monogamous than some others.
It isn't about denying who you are and whatnot. For me, it is about acknowledging that monogamy is a choice, not an inherent feature of being human. Monogamy is about refraining from sleeping with other people. People in monogamous relationships refrain from cheating in deference to their partner's feelings. Some people are great at it, and I applaud those who are and to whom it comes easily. To others, it is a struggle to keep from acting on their impulses to sleep with any easy piece of ass offered up to them.
If it comes easily for you, great! Just don't get all uppity when others aren't as great as staying on the monogamy wagon as you are. We're not saying you're "denying who you are" by being monogamous (I happen to be successfully monogamous myself, in point of fact), only that you're better at sticking to you choice to be monogamous than some others.
64
I think it really sucks that people go on Craigs List and make posts with no intention of following through with them. I always support and agree with Dans advice but totally disagree with him telling CAHCF its ok to waste other peoples time for your own personal amusement. Its bullshit. I realize there will always be creepy trollers and pic collecters out there, but I think encouraging it is just stupid.
65
On feet: I am kinky in many ways, but I totally don't "get" the foot thing. The idea of licking someone else's toes or boots is very nasty to me, as I'm hearing a lot of other people say here, but my experience in the kink community is that *most* people who identify as foot fetishists are the ones who want to be on the giving end, not the recieving end. This guy seems to be the same - he says he wants to do his GF's feet, not the other way around. Maybe recieving a toe licking would be too gross for some, but that's not the only option. What kind of person says no to a foot massage? I wish I had a foot fetishist in my life so I could get a happy foot massage every day. Somehow, this seems to fall into the category often pronounced by non-GGG partners: "X would be fine if only you weren't TURNED ON by it. EEeewww!"
On monogamy: Saying monogamy isn't natural isn't the same as saying it's wrong or inferior. A desire to perform toe licking isn't natural either, but there's nothing wrong with it. When Dan says monogamy isn't natural, he's not saying it's bad to be monogamous if that's what you want to do. He's saying it's bad to assume monogamy to apply to all until proven otherwise, because that is not what our natural instincts and biology suggest. Maybe there is a small percentage of the population that truly wants to be monogamous and finds it easy, but that does not mean that they are instinctually, naturally monogamous. I have yet to meet a person for whom biological drives are non-existant. The desire to be monogamous, and the ease with which one practices monogamy, probably have more to do with social conditioning, upbringing and individual personality than what is natural to our instincts. Monogamous people might want to stay with one partner and be faithful, and some of them may find it comes easily. But if a monogamous person ever finds themselves dreaming or fantasizing about someone else, or feeling attracted to someone else, that's their natural instinct coming it. They may find it easy to say no to that instinct, but if it exists, that's telling you what's natural. Your body and your biology occassionally crave a piece on the side, even if your higher mind finds the idea laughable.
But regardless of whether you agree with the above statements, the bottom line is that even if monogamy isn't the norm in the Savage Love column, it's still the norm in society, and monogamous folks bitching that this column picks on them too much strike me much the same as Christians who whine about being a persecuted minority.
#52: 'We are also "wired" to pee when our bladders get full, no matter the time or place, but we can learn to hold it.'
Have to disagree there. There are many, many animals that don't just "let it go" whenever and wherever, but will hold it to do it in a particular spot. Even hamsters will pee in the same corner of their cage every time. Are humans less capable than that?
More...
On monogamy: Saying monogamy isn't natural isn't the same as saying it's wrong or inferior. A desire to perform toe licking isn't natural either, but there's nothing wrong with it. When Dan says monogamy isn't natural, he's not saying it's bad to be monogamous if that's what you want to do. He's saying it's bad to assume monogamy to apply to all until proven otherwise, because that is not what our natural instincts and biology suggest. Maybe there is a small percentage of the population that truly wants to be monogamous and finds it easy, but that does not mean that they are instinctually, naturally monogamous. I have yet to meet a person for whom biological drives are non-existant. The desire to be monogamous, and the ease with which one practices monogamy, probably have more to do with social conditioning, upbringing and individual personality than what is natural to our instincts. Monogamous people might want to stay with one partner and be faithful, and some of them may find it comes easily. But if a monogamous person ever finds themselves dreaming or fantasizing about someone else, or feeling attracted to someone else, that's their natural instinct coming it. They may find it easy to say no to that instinct, but if it exists, that's telling you what's natural. Your body and your biology occassionally crave a piece on the side, even if your higher mind finds the idea laughable.
But regardless of whether you agree with the above statements, the bottom line is that even if monogamy isn't the norm in the Savage Love column, it's still the norm in society, and monogamous folks bitching that this column picks on them too much strike me much the same as Christians who whine about being a persecuted minority.
#52: 'We are also "wired" to pee when our bladders get full, no matter the time or place, but we can learn to hold it.'
Have to disagree there. There are many, many animals that don't just "let it go" whenever and wherever, but will hold it to do it in a particular spot. Even hamsters will pee in the same corner of their cage every time. Are humans less capable than that?
66
@58 - I took your impression about @7's comment ("BTW AHND I cheated on every girlfriend I ever had until I got a bisexual one. It was like the heavens opened up and I could finally be honest about my non monogamous ways. I'm now married to a woman who likes woman as much as I do.") the same way you did at first.
But then I considered that maybe he just didn't elaborate enough, and perhaps he meant that they do 3-ways? Or perhaps she, too, wants the opportunity to have 2-ways with other women?
But yes, your point is well taken: just because someone is bi doesn't mean that they can't be monogamous. Just like if a guy likes red heads and brunettes, he'll automatically be driven to cheat if he can't marry both.
But then I considered that maybe he just didn't elaborate enough, and perhaps he meant that they do 3-ways? Or perhaps she, too, wants the opportunity to have 2-ways with other women?
But yes, your point is well taken: just because someone is bi doesn't mean that they can't be monogamous. Just like if a guy likes red heads and brunettes, he'll automatically be driven to cheat if he can't marry both.
67
I'm monoamorous (one "relationship" partner) but polygamous (many sex partners).
This is much more "natural," if anyone wants to talk evolutionary biology.
This is much more "natural," if anyone wants to talk evolutionary biology.
68
@12: In response to your statement that we men inherit bad karma from our ancestors' actions:
I offer, with the most sincere affection, a raised middle finger on behalf of black men everywhere.
My grandfather's sins aren't mine, and you gleefully propose that I should suffer for them. Yet I don't ask you to suffer for your great-great-grandparents who owned slaves. I don't ask you to grovel in apology for the fact that your grandparents called mine the N-word, wouldn't let them drink from the white folks' fountain, or whatever they did. And you KNOW they did something.
So you should be very, very careful what you wish for. There's no way you haven't reaped the benefits of someone else's suffering and injustice. That's fine, we all have. Social justice comes from being aware of that and acting on it.
But getting off on the hate-fantasy of making other human beings grovel, people who haven't done anything wrong, just because they're the wrong gender? And then running your mouth off about that fantasy in public? That's got nothing to do with social justice...and it's some SERIOUSLY bad karma.
I offer, with the most sincere affection, a raised middle finger on behalf of black men everywhere.
My grandfather's sins aren't mine, and you gleefully propose that I should suffer for them. Yet I don't ask you to suffer for your great-great-grandparents who owned slaves. I don't ask you to grovel in apology for the fact that your grandparents called mine the N-word, wouldn't let them drink from the white folks' fountain, or whatever they did. And you KNOW they did something.
So you should be very, very careful what you wish for. There's no way you haven't reaped the benefits of someone else's suffering and injustice. That's fine, we all have. Social justice comes from being aware of that and acting on it.
But getting off on the hate-fantasy of making other human beings grovel, people who haven't done anything wrong, just because they're the wrong gender? And then running your mouth off about that fantasy in public? That's got nothing to do with social justice...and it's some SERIOUSLY bad karma.
69
Christian side hugs...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_Oj0-spl…
Wow, now that is some kinky shit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_Oj0-spl…
Wow, now that is some kinky shit.
70
Tiger appears to be a sex addict... not a run of the mill human who may find it tricky to not be attracted to someone else everyone once in a while... but someone whose ego and self esteem lend itself to hurtful, destructive behavior.
71
It never ceases to amaze me the large percentage of the public who are idiotic enough to make athletes their role-models. And quite frankly, I would question if Tiger Woods is an athlete in the true sense of the word - the man hits little balls with a stick :-/
Can someone please explain that to me? You are going to put men and women, who are successful simply for having innate (and later honed) physical prowess, as role models for yourselves and children? Why? They aren’t spiritually, morally or intellectually superior in any way shape of form. They just happen to be physically gifted. And while I fully recognize that I can’t do what they do, I would never think to put them on a pedestal for mere physical prowess. It doesn’t make any sense.
I mean take a look at ancient history. Who do we remember? Aristotle, Plato, Tolstoy etc. They are revered for displays of some combination of spiritual, moral or intellectual ability, are they not? Perhaps I am less well educated than I think myself to be, but do we hold any athletes from ancient history in such high regard? I would love to get some information on that, as I am not aware of any.
Tiger Woods doesn’t owe anyone but his family and friends, a bloody thing. Tiger Woods didn’t earn his fortune and fame because of YOU. He earned it because he is gifted at golf. Corporate entities decided to capital on this gift, they presented an image of him to best capitalize on said gift, and now YOU think he owes you anything? The hubris. YOU buy into a corporate manufactured image and then cry foul when all is not what it seems to be? The idiocy.
It won’t happen, but I so hope Tiger Woods would come out and say “Screw you lot, this is my problem; I’ll deal with as I see fit, and the rest of you can plain bugger off”. Bottom line, it is highly unlikely Elin will leave him and even if she did, she signed an iron-clad prenuptial agreement (as declared in the NYT). Infidelity is not the end of the world, and this American pastime of pretending it is, is oh so very childish. Grow up!
More...
Can someone please explain that to me? You are going to put men and women, who are successful simply for having innate (and later honed) physical prowess, as role models for yourselves and children? Why? They aren’t spiritually, morally or intellectually superior in any way shape of form. They just happen to be physically gifted. And while I fully recognize that I can’t do what they do, I would never think to put them on a pedestal for mere physical prowess. It doesn’t make any sense.
I mean take a look at ancient history. Who do we remember? Aristotle, Plato, Tolstoy etc. They are revered for displays of some combination of spiritual, moral or intellectual ability, are they not? Perhaps I am less well educated than I think myself to be, but do we hold any athletes from ancient history in such high regard? I would love to get some information on that, as I am not aware of any.
Tiger Woods doesn’t owe anyone but his family and friends, a bloody thing. Tiger Woods didn’t earn his fortune and fame because of YOU. He earned it because he is gifted at golf. Corporate entities decided to capital on this gift, they presented an image of him to best capitalize on said gift, and now YOU think he owes you anything? The hubris. YOU buy into a corporate manufactured image and then cry foul when all is not what it seems to be? The idiocy.
It won’t happen, but I so hope Tiger Woods would come out and say “Screw you lot, this is my problem; I’ll deal with as I see fit, and the rest of you can plain bugger off”. Bottom line, it is highly unlikely Elin will leave him and even if she did, she signed an iron-clad prenuptial agreement (as declared in the NYT). Infidelity is not the end of the world, and this American pastime of pretending it is, is oh so very childish. Grow up!
72
@70
Sex addiction is a myth created by our sex-negative culture to pathologize people who won't allow their libidos to be controlled by social proscription. Tiger is a very wealthy and famous man who receives frequent offers for sex from extremely attractive women. He is neither a role model nor a morally bankrupt lecher.... he's just bad at covering his tracks.
Most importantly, he's a fallible person who made some mistakes and is doing his penance on a public stage. He's having a bad month, and the idiots who are uninvolved in his life yet still care about this will find some other shiny object to look at soon enough.
Sex addiction is a myth created by our sex-negative culture to pathologize people who won't allow their libidos to be controlled by social proscription. Tiger is a very wealthy and famous man who receives frequent offers for sex from extremely attractive women. He is neither a role model nor a morally bankrupt lecher.... he's just bad at covering his tracks.
Most importantly, he's a fallible person who made some mistakes and is doing his penance on a public stage. He's having a bad month, and the idiots who are uninvolved in his life yet still care about this will find some other shiny object to look at soon enough.
73
Hey @15 -- what makes you think NPR is any better? Last year I happened to have lunch with one of their reporters (whom I won't name here) and told him I stopped going to them for news when they were all over the story about Anna Nicole Smith's overdose and failed to even mention the introduction of a bill in the House of Reps. to impeach Dick Cheney. He gave me some lame excuse about that story "not having legs" and the public not being interested. That, while polls showed that a majority of the US public supported impeachment if it could be shown that Bush & Cheney lied about the decision to invade Iraq. But hey, why should the public be interested in things NPR won't tell us about?
74
It seems a fairly unenlightened attitude, from an evolutionary psychology POV, to suggest that men and women basically cheat for the same reasons.
75
@66: Good point. Maybe I owe Hybrid Vigor an apology. I guess we'll only find out if he clarifies.
76
Aloha y'all,
Take another dare, and google "no to stupak petition." Sign the petition saying you protect and respect women's legal right to choice, and no health care policy has the right to change that choice!
Take another dare, and google "no to stupak petition." Sign the petition saying you protect and respect women's legal right to choice, and no health care policy has the right to change that choice!
77
@66: Although, I gotta say, his comment still rubs me the wrong way in how he says that he couldn't be honest with any of the straight women he dated (he could only "finally be honest" with his bisexual girlfriend).
He could have been honest ... with himself. A straight woman doesn't want you fucking other women? She doesn't want to be in three-ways with you? Dump her. Don't stick around and cheat on her. And he did this at least twice ("every girlfriend I ever had").
He could have been honest ... with himself. A straight woman doesn't want you fucking other women? She doesn't want to be in three-ways with you? Dump her. Don't stick around and cheat on her. And he did this at least twice ("every girlfriend I ever had").
78
I'm pretty sure Dan's use of the term "natural" was not to imply that monogamy is unnatural, or that it doesn't occur, but that it's fallacious to assume that monogamy is the natural state of being for all humans.
Which is true. But god you monogamous people are touchy, maybe you need to get laid.
Which is true. But god you monogamous people are touchy, maybe you need to get laid.
79
@72, sex addiction is real, but it's not what people seem to think it is. I was a sex addict for many years and it wasn't about having fun or getting off. Sex was, back in the day, about conquest and power, not about physical sensations, and sometimes the mind reverts the same way you can smell your dead grandma's perfume and for a moment feel like a little kid again. Sex was about seeing if I could get that guy who was out of my league to do me, if I could get the happily married and monogamous guy to cheat with me, if I could score the dude my hotter and skinnier friend was after. It was a way to feel like I was sexy and attractive. Like when normal people collect free drinks or phone numbers, only it somehow didn't work unless there was sex. I think Tiger is in constant need of having his ego stroked, rather than his dick. face it, the dude looks like a human version of Peanut, the Jeff Dunham puppet. ANd his father trained him like a pet monkey until he got rich and bought him a house. He's a great golfer but he's a fugly guy. But, he married a model and now seems to need hot young girls to do him constantly. It's not about natural urges or variety but about needing to be told, and shown, that he's hot and worthy. He's the school nerd trying to get the prom queen, but he has to do it every time he sees a prom queen.
80
I gotta agree with #5. That's a very reasonable approach. I think we're missing the girl's side of this discussion, and that before we present her a forced choice... do it or else I'll break off the relationship... we should hear exactly what it is that he wants done, and what it means to her to indulge him. For example, does he just want to massage her feet? What the problem?
Or is he demanding that she walk nude except for high heels on his chest while they pose in the front window, and this will replace all the close cuddling sensual activities that SHE prefers... There's a matter of degree here!
Or is he demanding that she walk nude except for high heels on his chest while they pose in the front window, and this will replace all the close cuddling sensual activities that SHE prefers... There's a matter of degree here!
81
chi_type@14-you obviously haven't been reading Dan for very long. I have never heard or read him saying that allowing an extra person into your relationship is required to be GGG. In fact, I know he has said that threesomes or openness are above and beyond the call of duty for a GGG partner, along with poo play (and other stuff I can't remember.)
So many people seem to be getting their panties in a wad over the monogamy statement. I know in many places Dan has said that monogamy is possible, though it's not easy. For those few of you who find it "easy", you're lucky. Many people find it difficult, even when they achieve it.
In evolutionary terms, women are "hard wired" to be more selective, since the consequences for her were much more lasting than for the male. The last half-century or so of effective birth control are not nearly enough to undo the millennia of hard-wiring.
So perhaps it is "easier" for women to be monogamous. That doesn't mean women don't cheat, only that they may find it "easier" to be monogamous than men do because of how we are wired.
So many people seem to be getting their panties in a wad over the monogamy statement. I know in many places Dan has said that monogamy is possible, though it's not easy. For those few of you who find it "easy", you're lucky. Many people find it difficult, even when they achieve it.
In evolutionary terms, women are "hard wired" to be more selective, since the consequences for her were much more lasting than for the male. The last half-century or so of effective birth control are not nearly enough to undo the millennia of hard-wiring.
So perhaps it is "easier" for women to be monogamous. That doesn't mean women don't cheat, only that they may find it "easier" to be monogamous than men do because of how we are wired.
83
Hmm, Mr. Savage. Perhaps you've become tainted in your profession, this happens. The entire human population is not wired to cheat. Your extreme generalization is pathetic; but, I realize many humans are also pathetic. And ... your podcast exists for this reason. Cheers.
84
dear #5 (Fairness goes both ways):
I believe what you're describing is called "Irreconcilable differences." Or, that's what it WILL be called when they hit divorce court.
I believe what you're describing is called "Irreconcilable differences." Or, that's what it WILL be called when they hit divorce court.
85
You know, I haven't had my toes sucked in a long time (because they're stuck in shoes all day... the prep time alone, sheeesh!) but it feels pretty awesome. I think if this young girl made a decision to really give it a try, and not bring all the "if I do this, I'm demeaned" Gloria Allred crap into bed with them, she'd like it. How bout starting in the tub? He could scrub em up, foot massage, oil up her feet and then... foot job? Sounds fine to me.
Oh, and by the way, 57, UK Girlie? That was friggin HOT! I think you should email it to boyfriend #1. But I have a question... how DO you deal with the smell of anal? Anyone?
Oh, and by the way, 57, UK Girlie? That was friggin HOT! I think you should email it to boyfriend #1. But I have a question... how DO you deal with the smell of anal? Anyone?
86
@82, sure, we shouldn't necessarily do everything we're wired to do. But to either A)deny that we're wired certain ways, or B) pretend it's easy to ignore said wiring are both futile and ignorant.
88
@87 - here you go- Chrisian Side Hug
According to Stuff Christians Like, there’s no “exact scripture reference” banning normal hugging. But the Side-Hug does significantly lower the “risk of two crotches touching,” which has got to be in the Bible somewhere. Here’s how you do it:
Instead of face to face, you go side to side, putting your arm around the person and your hip against their’s. Still having a hard time mastering it? Pretend you’re taking a photo and you’re both looking at the camera together. The side hug, or A frame as it is also called, is safe for the whole family, friendly and above all holy
According to Stuff Christians Like, there’s no “exact scripture reference” banning normal hugging. But the Side-Hug does significantly lower the “risk of two crotches touching,” which has got to be in the Bible somewhere. Here’s how you do it:
Instead of face to face, you go side to side, putting your arm around the person and your hip against their’s. Still having a hard time mastering it? Pretend you’re taking a photo and you’re both looking at the camera together. The side hug, or A frame as it is also called, is safe for the whole family, friendly and above all holy
89
Thank you Kevin for your more nuanced response. So for Gloria I'll clarify. I'm 40 years old now and have been a serial monogamist my whole life. I liked being in a relationship but I also liked strange. So yes, I was not honest with my relationships and yes I was an asshole but we're also talking about my 20's. Once I found a bisexual girlfriend WHO DIDN'T MIND SHARING ME, the heavens opened up. I realized that here was a whole different way of approaching a relationship. One in which I could be honest with my significant other and not have to cheat. Completely changed my life and now I'm married to an incredible woman who I can be honest with. BTW I thought it went without saying that just because you're bisexual doesn't mean you're non-monogomous. My bad.
90
It's not about being "good" at being monogamous, whatever that means. It's about that being my natural state. Why does mentioning that make some people infer some sort of butthurtedness on my part?
My only butthurtedness in this comes from people trying to tell other people what is natural for them is not natural - self-righteous monos spouting off at polys, undeservedly smug polys spouting off at monos - why? It's stupid.
If it's natural for you, if it's what feels right, if it is what comes naturally for you, if it's not hurting anyone, what's not natural about it? Just because someone finds they're not naturally monogamous doesn't mean we don't exist. That's a rather ignorant assumption.
I have to roll my eyes at the overly reactive who assume someone being calmly, but firmly, what they are has anything to do with being overly sensitive. Stop projecting.
I'm pleased and happy for my poly or non-monogamous friends when they find happiness, and I expect the same care from them. *shrugs* For me, when I'm in love, I am not interested in actually having sex with anyone else - or forming the same romantic bond with anyone else - but my partner. It's just not there for me. Why would someone assume that I would only get irritated by people telling me I'm unnatural if I was too sensitive, vs just wanting people to extend to me the same respect I extend to them?
Yep, as a bi woman, I got tired of being told I didn't exist, and I feel the same as a naturally monogamous human. What's wrong with speaking up about other people's strident ignorance?
My only butthurtedness in this comes from people trying to tell other people what is natural for them is not natural - self-righteous monos spouting off at polys, undeservedly smug polys spouting off at monos - why? It's stupid.
If it's natural for you, if it's what feels right, if it is what comes naturally for you, if it's not hurting anyone, what's not natural about it? Just because someone finds they're not naturally monogamous doesn't mean we don't exist. That's a rather ignorant assumption.
I have to roll my eyes at the overly reactive who assume someone being calmly, but firmly, what they are has anything to do with being overly sensitive. Stop projecting.
I'm pleased and happy for my poly or non-monogamous friends when they find happiness, and I expect the same care from them. *shrugs* For me, when I'm in love, I am not interested in actually having sex with anyone else - or forming the same romantic bond with anyone else - but my partner. It's just not there for me. Why would someone assume that I would only get irritated by people telling me I'm unnatural if I was too sensitive, vs just wanting people to extend to me the same respect I extend to them?
Yep, as a bi woman, I got tired of being told I didn't exist, and I feel the same as a naturally monogamous human. What's wrong with speaking up about other people's strident ignorance?
91
good (vanilla) discussion!
dan, would love to read your guide to monogomy/ non-monogomy -- say in book form -- with advice for every kink (and successfully mixing every combination of monogomy/non-monogomy tendencies). we need a sensitive how-to guide us these days. potential massive seller and good happy holiday read i say...
dan, would love to read your guide to monogomy/ non-monogomy -- say in book form -- with advice for every kink (and successfully mixing every combination of monogomy/non-monogomy tendencies). we need a sensitive how-to guide us these days. potential massive seller and good happy holiday read i say...
92
With all the tolerance flying around for every motherfucking thing under the sun, why so little tolerance for those who are most happy being monogamous? Do you really not think they're out there because you haven't personally encountered them? I absolutely agree that an awful lot of people aren't happy being monogamous and so should never make commitments to be so; but some people really really are. And I'm tired of the old "we are hardwired to do it" rationale for everything from war to rape to imperialism to horndoginess. We're hardwired to shit in the backyard, but most of us aren't comfortable doing it unless it's our inalienable fetish. Sexuality is a product of culture, the eggheads are saying these days, and monogamy's not being sold by anyone cool. But that doesn't mean it doesn't feel good, and natural, to lots of people
93
I thought the Christian Side Hug(TM) was to avoid breast-to-chest contact between non-married men and women? My pastor does the side hug with women, not men (he's male).
There was a guy who was a full-frontal hugger, and it made me really uncomfortable, like a type of frottage or something. Kind of like Jim Gaffigan's joke about it being wrong to hug your mother-in-law and say "OOOOoo, that feels SOOO right!"
There was a guy who was a full-frontal hugger, and it made me really uncomfortable, like a type of frottage or something. Kind of like Jim Gaffigan's joke about it being wrong to hug your mother-in-law and say "OOOOoo, that feels SOOO right!"
94
With everyone commenting about how they'd be disgusted to be on the recieving end of a full-on foot fetish...let me say that I'm in a LTR and I'm a female. I would KILL to be the object of a man's foot fetish. My current guy just isn't into feet-and it sucks. I'll ask him to rub my feet and he'll do it for a little bit, but it never turns sexual. I was with a guy that would suck my toes and it drives me wild. If I could be w/ a guy that was turned on by my feet-and wanted me to get pedis-wow...that would be amazing. It feels SO good. But I agree w/ another poster...the only time it would make me uncomfortable is if my feet weren't squeaky clean. But I'm GGG so if he (or she) was into it, then I am too!
95
Also, I should've never clicked on the video about Christian side hugs. Now that IS some silly shit. And even worse, its stuck in my head. RRRRRRR (LOL)
96
Dan's observations on the unnaturalness of monogamy have grown tiresome with time but not nearly as tiresome as the huge emphasis on the Massive Importance of sexsexsex. Or more specifically, the apparent Manifest Destiny of all human beings to have hot perfect sex all the timetimetime.
I'm no prude. I've gone through very kinky phases, fairly slutty phases, monogamous phases, honestly non-monogamous phases and even CPOS phases. I've been in a masturbation "phase" since I was 12. Currently sex with others is not that important to me. It' just sex for god's sake.
On another note... I think the twin conceits of "natural" and "unnatural" are not particularly applicable to beings that have transcended, EVOLVED, as far as humans have beyond the basic life model of stay-alive-and-reproduce. We have that whole existential dilemma to consider:
Philosophy. Philanthropy. Ambition. Integrity. Morality. Ambiguity. Cruelty. Rationality. The ability to produce plastic from natural materials. Awareness of impending doom (death). Hatred. Love. Ennui and so on....
What's natural/unnatural got to do, got to do with it?
I'm no prude. I've gone through very kinky phases, fairly slutty phases, monogamous phases, honestly non-monogamous phases and even CPOS phases. I've been in a masturbation "phase" since I was 12. Currently sex with others is not that important to me. It' just sex for god's sake.
On another note... I think the twin conceits of "natural" and "unnatural" are not particularly applicable to beings that have transcended, EVOLVED, as far as humans have beyond the basic life model of stay-alive-and-reproduce. We have that whole existential dilemma to consider:
Philosophy. Philanthropy. Ambition. Integrity. Morality. Ambiguity. Cruelty. Rationality. The ability to produce plastic from natural materials. Awareness of impending doom (death). Hatred. Love. Ennui and so on....
What's natural/unnatural got to do, got to do with it?
97
My feet are pretty gross right now, so you could persuade me with a pedicure. Good idea, #11!
Maybe she thinks her feet/feet in general are gross. The thought worshiping makes her uncomfortable/confuses her But maybe she should try it, JUST ONCE.
It doesn't matter if foot worshiping is vanilla or kinky. That isn't the point. There could be a myriad of reasons why she isn't into it. So what, you have to feel comfortable doing all things "vanilla"? (what is vanilla, anyway, really?)
But yes. Try it. Let him do it. Once. You may like it :)
Maybe she thinks her feet/feet in general are gross. The thought worshiping makes her uncomfortable/confuses her But maybe she should try it, JUST ONCE.
It doesn't matter if foot worshiping is vanilla or kinky. That isn't the point. There could be a myriad of reasons why she isn't into it. So what, you have to feel comfortable doing all things "vanilla"? (what is vanilla, anyway, really?)
But yes. Try it. Let him do it. Once. You may like it :)
98
I absolutely fucking loathe when people say "monogamy isn't natural". Fuck you. If it weren't natural we wouldn't be doing it and neither would any of the other species of animals who mate for life. Just because some people can't keep their legs crossed doesn't mean it's natural to cheat; it means that they can't keep their dick in their drawers. If people want to be poly or swingers, that's fine, don't care, not my life. But saying that my desire to be with one person forever is unnatural is frankly downright insulting.
99
Charlie at #59, I'd much rather have my partner go out and fuck other women (and we're happily non-mono, so he does) than go to such great lengths not to focus on the fact that, when he's fucking me, he's fucking ME. Fantasy can be fun, but when you "face away from (or the back of) your partner, squeeze your eyes shut, and do your damnedest to imagine someone else," that doesn't do shit-all to demonstrate your emotional intimacy or your commitment.
100
Yawgmoth, very few animals actually mate for life, and a lot of the species that we used to think were monogamous actually turn out to be very much not. Cheating is rampant in the animal kingdom and is natural.
Besides, why do you care so much if monogamy is natural or not? Natural doesn't mean good, or moral, or what-not - plenty of bad things are natural, and plenty of good things aren't. If you like monogamy, find a willing partner and go for it.
Besides, why do you care so much if monogamy is natural or not? Natural doesn't mean good, or moral, or what-not - plenty of bad things are natural, and plenty of good things aren't. If you like monogamy, find a willing partner and go for it.
103
Not everybody is wired to cheat. I'm not. I love my husband and have no real sexual interest in anyone else.
105
Foot fetishism is frequently not just about the feet. Maybe she's uncomfortable with the power dynamic aspect of it? I've always tried to be GGG, though I do have limits. I figure if someone needs something I can't give, we can part ways and find a better match. In relationships where the kinks involved power stuff, though, like foot fetishism or bondage, I found there were other problems. In one instance, he couldn't keep the power stuff in the bedroom and it turned into an unhealthy (abusive?) relationship. In the other, as the relationship waned, he grew sexually selfish and uninterested in sex that didn't fulfill his fetishes and desires. This is not because of the fetishes, and I recognize that, but she might not. Maybe she's tried it and it didn't work out, like others have said, or maybe she knows someone or read about someone who tried it and it went badly, and she said, "That'll never happen to me--I'll make sure of it." Who knows? Ultimately, Dan is right. Communication is key, but if it's something you need, and something she can't give, it's time to move on.
I am also inclined towards monogamy. I've never once been tempted to cheat. Ever. I've been dating for only nine years, so maybe that will change some day, but I figure if I was going to be tempted, I'd have been tempted by now. This is not due to lack of sex drive, or because other people aren't attractive. I simply have no desire to have sex with anyone else. At all. I don't expect that from my partners, but I do expect honesty and monogamy. I know that's hard to find, but I'll keep looking until I do.
I am also inclined towards monogamy. I've never once been tempted to cheat. Ever. I've been dating for only nine years, so maybe that will change some day, but I figure if I was going to be tempted, I'd have been tempted by now. This is not due to lack of sex drive, or because other people aren't attractive. I simply have no desire to have sex with anyone else. At all. I don't expect that from my partners, but I do expect honesty and monogamy. I know that's hard to find, but I'll keep looking until I do.
106
I, for one, do not cheat. It makes me feel like a piece of shit to lie to my wife, either of my girlfriends, or any of the occasional hook-ups that come my way. Plus, I just don't have time for it. Some amazing things can happen if people are open to being caring, honest, and loving. Difficult? Yes. Worth it? Yes!
Also I believe that "natural" in the sense of the cheating/multiple partners discussion could also be "pervasive" or "nearly universal". Semantics do not change facts (unless you are in the Grand Old Party, then they dictate reality).
Also I believe that "natural" in the sense of the cheating/multiple partners discussion could also be "pervasive" or "nearly universal". Semantics do not change facts (unless you are in the Grand Old Party, then they dictate reality).
107
And...Holy Shit! Thanks to Dan for bringing the Christian Side Hug to my attention. I just watched the video. I am guessing somehow that this is not a joke...It looks just delusional enough to be Xtian rap. Did Jesus CSH, yo?
108
Power stuff in having my toes licked, sucked and gently bitten until I orgasm ? I don't get it.
How can there be a power dynamic in asking to have those acts happen on my clean feet, when it's vanilla if it happens on my pussy ? I'm not tying my partner or anything. He's not a foot fetishist, I suppose I am, right ?
How can there be a power dynamic in asking to have those acts happen on my clean feet, when it's vanilla if it happens on my pussy ? I'm not tying my partner or anything. He's not a foot fetishist, I suppose I am, right ?
109
If the girlfriend who did not like the foot fetish worked it right, she might start to like it.
"Sure, you can massage my feet, after a full body massage!"
"Sure, you can massage my feet, just do the dishes first!"
"Sure, you can play with my feet, right after you put those new pumps you bought me on them!"
I get no sexual pleasure from having my feet played with, but damn if it doesn't just feel good and relaxing. I would love to find a partner into a foot fetish.
"Sure, you can massage my feet, after a full body massage!"
"Sure, you can massage my feet, just do the dishes first!"
"Sure, you can play with my feet, right after you put those new pumps you bought me on them!"
I get no sexual pleasure from having my feet played with, but damn if it doesn't just feel good and relaxing. I would love to find a partner into a foot fetish.
110
Agree with 96. If truly consenting adults want to do it, it doesn't involve non-adults, or deceit, coercion, yada yada yada, who are we to pronounce on what's natural? Like anyone really knows what that is. And spare me the Wild Kingdom logic, while you're at it. I don't give a rat's ass what rats do with their asses. Why anyone thinks that seriously comes to bear, pardon the expression, on what human beings choose to do is another reason to sincerely believe in the dumbing-down of America.
Breaking free of fascist thinking about sexuality doesn't count for much if you then turn around and become fascist about what you've decided is "normal." This is includes monogamous behavior and, as 96 points out, the fact that a lot of people's lives don't revolve around sex. Low libidos are normal, too, and they don't imply anything about the person any more than other manifestations of sexuality.
Breaking free of fascist thinking about sexuality doesn't count for much if you then turn around and become fascist about what you've decided is "normal." This is includes monogamous behavior and, as 96 points out, the fact that a lot of people's lives don't revolve around sex. Low libidos are normal, too, and they don't imply anything about the person any more than other manifestations of sexuality.
111
I would ask the chick with the foot fetish BF just what it is she finds so horrible.
When I was younger and uneducated about such things, I thought it would be disgusting to indulge a fetish because I assumed it would only be about the fetish itself and no longer be about me or us.
I have learned it doesn't have to be that way. It can just mean that there is an extra erogenous zone to play in.
When I was younger and uneducated about such things, I thought it would be disgusting to indulge a fetish because I assumed it would only be about the fetish itself and no longer be about me or us.
I have learned it doesn't have to be that way. It can just mean that there is an extra erogenous zone to play in.
112
Rule #1 of ultimatums: you have to mean it. You'd have to seriously rather not be with your gf than go without the fetish. Its also quite likely that while she might have done it in order to make her wonderful mate happy, she wouldn't do it for someone who holds the relationship hostage. Someone like that isn't as worth making compromises for, in a lot of people's views. But I would bet after 4 years he's tried the "can't you just do it for me" approach and it hasn't worked, so its probably time.
I also wish Dan would stop using science that doesn't exist to prop up his views. "Monogamy isn't natural" is so much bogosity I lose a lot of respect for anything Dan says. I have no respect anti-gayers who say 'x isn't natural because they say so', for the same reason, they're talking completely out of their ass just to try and justify something.
I also wish Dan would stop using science that doesn't exist to prop up his views. "Monogamy isn't natural" is so much bogosity I lose a lot of respect for anything Dan says. I have no respect anti-gayers who say 'x isn't natural because they say so', for the same reason, they're talking completely out of their ass just to try and justify something.
113
#96: "I'm no prude." Maybe you're an exception, but every person who has ever felt the need to say this throughout human history has, in fact, been a prude.
"On another note... I think the twin conceits of 'natural' and 'unnatural' are not particularly applicable to beings that have transcended, EVOLVED, as far as humans have beyond the basic life model of stay-alive-and-reproduce." Any species that "evolved" beyond staying alive and reproducing would swiftly die out. Also, every other species on earth today has had exactly as long to reproduce as we have.
Worth mentioning, because the (meaningless and un-biological) idea that humans are "more evolved" than any other species is often behind the notion that monogamy should come easy to us.
"On another note... I think the twin conceits of 'natural' and 'unnatural' are not particularly applicable to beings that have transcended, EVOLVED, as far as humans have beyond the basic life model of stay-alive-and-reproduce." Any species that "evolved" beyond staying alive and reproducing would swiftly die out. Also, every other species on earth today has had exactly as long to reproduce as we have.
Worth mentioning, because the (meaningless and un-biological) idea that humans are "more evolved" than any other species is often behind the notion that monogamy should come easy to us.
114
I dated a guy with a foot fetish for a year and a half, and we broke up for reasons completely unrelated to sex. I was not into feet at all, but as long as he tried not to tickle them we were fine. Having my toes sucked did nothing, just felt wet and kinda gross, and then they got cold once the saliva started drying. Having a dick smashed between my insteps didn't hit my hot spots but then, I didn't do it for me. I had no problem with the foot thing and I'm still convinced that the reason our sex life, at least the parts that did hit my hot spots, was the best of my life was because he was getting what he needed too. I did all sorts of things in that relationship that I would never bring up first, and I assume he did too. Nothing objectionable, just nothing that turns me on. Being GGG is not hard unless they want something you feel actively uncomfortable with. If my husband revealed to me that he had an unlubricated anal sex fetish, I might have to argue against that one. But foot rubs, instep fucking, and toe sucking? Mild stuff. Plus it helped me with the guilt I tend to have during oral sex. I always feel like I take too long and am wasting the other person's time. But with a foot fetish partner, your toes can rub on his cock while he goes down on you, so it's reciprocating and not as "selfish". But then, that only helps with my hang up.
115
I agree that the foot fetish GF should probably at least be willing to try, but I wonder what else there is to the story that's missing. I know if I was dating a girl that was interested into that, I wouldn't want it. For one, it doesn't really do anything for me (though I'm willing to indulge in things that doesn't do much for me), and two, I'd probably end up kicking her in the face because my feet are very fucking ticklish. Safety first. To say she's selfish off the bat without knowing anymore is jumping the gun a bit.
116
@98, there's a difference between monogamy and a species mating for life. If the human species mated for life in the same sense that some species do, we'd never feel attracted to anyone but the one we lost our virginity to. Species that mate for life really do mate for life. No step parents or break ups. One partner ever, species wide. The fact that we can consciously choose to immitate that behavior does not classify us as a species that mates for life. My great grandmother remarried after my great grandfather died. She mated for their lives, but not for here. Get it?
117
SFF, 23 is young to be settling down with and settling for a person who doesn't share your tastes. You would always wonder how it could and should have been different.
118
For those questioning the possibity of a power dynamic being the problem, you've got it reversed. It's not "I want to worship your feet because I'm in charge" -- it's her being placed on top, and she may not want to be there.
119
Helgaleena has happy feet now that she has quit neglecting them in order to have 'kissable toes'... just saying.
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http://www.darkroastpress.com try our flavor
120
Two quick points - anal sex isn't a "fetish". Look up the word.
And the other - it's kind of condescending to call someone's foot fetish "tame", "boring", "no big deal", etc. I dated a guy with a foot fetish and we were together for a *long* time before he "came out" about it. Each relationship he enters is at risk with this revelation of kink, just like any other kink.
And the other - it's kind of condescending to call someone's foot fetish "tame", "boring", "no big deal", etc. I dated a guy with a foot fetish and we were together for a *long* time before he "came out" about it. Each relationship he enters is at risk with this revelation of kink, just like any other kink.
121
#35, love the name! I agree 100% with you comments, why the double standard? Makes my blood boil!
As far as monogamy is concerned, every individual is oh, I don't know individual!
Dan, thanks for the thought provoking columns, my life broadened considerably when I found you!
As far as monogamy is concerned, every individual is oh, I don't know individual!
Dan, thanks for the thought provoking columns, my life broadened considerably when I found you!
122
#35, love the name! I agree 100% with you comments, why the double standard? Makes my blood boil!
As far as monogamy is concerned, every individual is oh, I don't know individual!
Dan, thanks for the thought provoking column, my life broadened considerably when I found you!
As far as monogamy is concerned, every individual is oh, I don't know individual!
Dan, thanks for the thought provoking column, my life broadened considerably when I found you!
124
I think the world is completely insane and brainwashed sometimes. I see this Tiger Woods thing on the news for the first time at work and I say, "wait--she beat the crap out of him with a golf club?" and the hens around the table are saying he "deserved it." I make the point that beating someone so that he will want to be faithful to you is batshit insane, and the hens tell me "yeah, so he won't do it again."
Uh--yeah. This is the mentality I work with. And apparently, this is the bats;hit sociopathy of some of the people who read the Stranger.
Are you all out there beating the shit out of each other in order to fix your relationships (fetishes aside) and telling yourselves that this is your karmic reward for millenia of sexism? Because I feel totally sorry for you, if this is what your life is like.
Rationality goes along with honesty, and, believe it or not, it works with love MUCH better than some bullshit idea of romance. Having a happy life is the point, sociopaths. Not "winning."
Uh--yeah. This is the mentality I work with. And apparently, this is the bats;hit sociopathy of some of the people who read the Stranger.
Are you all out there beating the shit out of each other in order to fix your relationships (fetishes aside) and telling yourselves that this is your karmic reward for millenia of sexism? Because I feel totally sorry for you, if this is what your life is like.
Rationality goes along with honesty, and, believe it or not, it works with love MUCH better than some bullshit idea of romance. Having a happy life is the point, sociopaths. Not "winning."
125
As much as I love Dan, I'm a little sick of this "everyone must accept non-monogamy" line I keep hearing. Just because one partner wants sex more often (or 'a little variety') than the other does not mean every partner should willingly accept that.
There are a lot of issues with non-monogamy that I would not want in a relationship. One, time- the time a man spent looking for new sex partners is time he wouldn't be spending with me, his friends, his job, or his hobbies. There's a limited number of hours in the day. Two, disease- condoms simply do not cover all diseases (plus they break, so if there's a man and woman involved, there is a risk of pregnancy), and multiple sex partners mean multiple tests and the possibility of disease. Third, the actual breakup of the relationship caused by new sex partners. It's not just about "The One" or "endless love".
I know people who make non-monogamy work. And that's great for them. But it's not for me, and people should not be pressured into accepting it because their partner is somehow entitled to fuck other people. Like Dan said, a foot fetish is just a small private thing, so why not just indulge your partner if you love them- but I feel non-monogamy is a much bigger deal than a foot fetish.
There are a lot of issues with non-monogamy that I would not want in a relationship. One, time- the time a man spent looking for new sex partners is time he wouldn't be spending with me, his friends, his job, or his hobbies. There's a limited number of hours in the day. Two, disease- condoms simply do not cover all diseases (plus they break, so if there's a man and woman involved, there is a risk of pregnancy), and multiple sex partners mean multiple tests and the possibility of disease. Third, the actual breakup of the relationship caused by new sex partners. It's not just about "The One" or "endless love".
I know people who make non-monogamy work. And that's great for them. But it's not for me, and people should not be pressured into accepting it because their partner is somehow entitled to fuck other people. Like Dan said, a foot fetish is just a small private thing, so why not just indulge your partner if you love them- but I feel non-monogamy is a much bigger deal than a foot fetish.
126
I have not seen a post on monogamy that deals with the emotional issue. We don't know if animals have the same emotions as us so it's not a very relevant comparison. My husband after 15 years wants to be with other woman, have "variety". Knowing him as well as I do, I know that he would never be able to have sex without the risk of being emotionally involved. That's the problem, you risk connecting with another person and you have a wife and kids at home counting on you to be there. Even if everyone agrees, how do you garantee you won't fall in love?
127
SFF should find a person that appreciates his fetish. That would have been me 20 years ago. If she isn't into it now, trust me it only gets worse. I can't even get the hubby to rub my feet let alone do anything kinky with them. Run and find your "soul" mate.
128
Why is everyone more interested in Mr. Woods' apparently excessive dance card than in Mrs. Woods having apparently committed assault with a deadly weapon?
Ok- He cheated and that sucks, that hurts- leave him, forgive him,stay and make him pay for his errors for the rest of his days, whatever but NOTHING justifies assaulting your partner.
Ok- He cheated and that sucks, that hurts- leave him, forgive him,stay and make him pay for his errors for the rest of his days, whatever but NOTHING justifies assaulting your partner.
130
I love that Dan is working in a reference to the "Christian side hug", and I appreciate that he's including it in a list of scary kinks like choking and shit. I still laugh when thinking about that vid put up here on Slog a week (or two?) ago.
131
Dan, you have run "foot fetish not being indulged" complaints more than once, and it's always a guy with the fetish complaining. You always come down like the proverbial ton on the partner. You might want to ask a question, though. Is the man treating his partner like a pair of feet that happen to have a girl attached? If she does indulge him, does he immediately obsess and demand more? I was once in this situation and I figured, well, what the hell, it's harmless and SHAZAM, there went the sex life into nothing but feet. YAWN. When someone tells you their partner's being completely, incomprehensibly unreasonable, please remember it takes two to tango, and there's a good chance the unself-aware letter writer is dancing hard as well. I doubt it was "no, not feet, not ever" straight out of the box, it probably became "no more feet, no way, you haven't gone down on me in six months!"
HNM, not getting to completely indulge your sex drive is the price you pay for a solid relationship, OK? It's not some major existential conflict that your soul can't abide; it's something most people in committed relationships live with every day. You'll survive, trust me. A solid relationship is a hell of a lot harder to find than sex. If you can't, please end your relationship with what sounds like a jewel of a girl so some decent guy who understands reality and commitment can treat her right.
HNM, not getting to completely indulge your sex drive is the price you pay for a solid relationship, OK? It's not some major existential conflict that your soul can't abide; it's something most people in committed relationships live with every day. You'll survive, trust me. A solid relationship is a hell of a lot harder to find than sex. If you can't, please end your relationship with what sounds like a jewel of a girl so some decent guy who understands reality and commitment can treat her right.
132
I gotta put this out there - feet gross me the fuck OUT! anybody's feet. I am morally opposed to sandals - I don't wanna see everybody's skanky toes! and pedicures?? GAH! the thought of some stranger missing with my feet in a bowl of hot water that have had other nasty feet in it - not to mention attacking my toes with used instruments - makes me want to HURL. And I am fiendishly ticklish to boot, so it wouldn't work. I'd consider myself GGG, but feet are a no-go for me. (and toe sucking/licking? I would NEVER EVER kiss that person again!)
*shudders indelicately*
I think I'd say find some female friend of ours, give her a pedi monthly, and then come home and do ME all night. :)
*shudders indelicately*
I think I'd say find some female friend of ours, give her a pedi monthly, and then come home and do ME all night. :)
133
Oh the poor abused and persecuted monogamous. ..you poor people, you're such a fucking abused minority. Shut the fuck up and read Dear Amy if Dan pisses you off so much, but the empirical evidence and logic are really on Dan's side on this one. Get over it already you fucking whiners.
134
Has SFF talked to his girlfriend about why she won't indulge his fetish? She may be a selfish bitch, or she may have a good reason. I'm pretty open to a range of sexual activities, but one thing I cannot stand to have fingers stuck in my vagina. Anywhere else, fine, but not there. I had some bad experiences in the gynecologist's office when trying to get pelvic pain treated, and since then, the thought of fingers in my vagina freaks me out. I'm anxious just thinking about it while writing this. SFF needs to make sure his girlfriend doesn't have a good reason for refusing to indulge his fetish- maybe she's had bad experiences in the past. As Dan has pointed out, if you can't talk to someone about sex, you shouldn't be having it.
135
Shout out @68 Lucas!@!@!@!
Thank you @105. BTW @108, Zukomi said "Foot fetishism is frequently not just about the feet," not "is NEVER just about the feet." It sounded like Zukomi's experience. If your experience was different, @108, and it worked for you, then sweet. Thanks @118; this has more often been my experience.
@128: COMPLETELY. America is F@$K'D UP. Glorify violence, yet obsess about repressed sexual fantasies...We can do better.
Thank you @105. BTW @108, Zukomi said "Foot fetishism is frequently not just about the feet," not "is NEVER just about the feet." It sounded like Zukomi's experience. If your experience was different, @108, and it worked for you, then sweet. Thanks @118; this has more often been my experience.
@128: COMPLETELY. America is F@$K'D UP. Glorify violence, yet obsess about repressed sexual fantasies...We can do better.
136
BTW yes Happy Hannukah, folks. And best of luck avoiding America's Consumerist Holiday. Go have yourselves some nice, juicy full-frontal (hugs).
137
Savage means that "cheating is natural to HIM",is what he means;and that it's difficult for HIM not to cheat.People are always talking about themselves,personally,not anyone else.
138
The most sensitive part of a woman's body is her feet.Foot massages by the opposite sex are extremely sexually arousing.-or they can be.And very pleasurable,relaxing.Just a thought;maybe his girlfriend is afraid to "let go",relax,or feel that much sensation.Or,prudish.("No,I don't believe in that!")
139
This column is supposed to be "Savage Love"but it usually ends up being about"Savage Sex".Nothing wrong with people liking sex,but,to listen to S.,sometimes,there is nothing else BUT SEX in a relationship,and the big goal is to satisfy that,even if it hurts your loving partner.The problem with cheating,is,once you start,you might fall in love with the new person,and the partner gets kicked to the curb,along with the partnership.Have we learned anything from watching politicians cheat on their wives,in front of the whole country?Most wives would like to NOT KNOW,if the old man cheats once,on the side,cause they need to save face.
140
The foot fetish thing: the girlfriend clearly finds it a turn off, and quite possibly will lose respect/sexual feelings towards the boyfriend if he insists on indulging it. I know I would be totally, permanently turned off a guy who revealed he was into adult diapers for example. Unfair? Maybe. But undeniable. Feet I haven't considered. But honestly, yes, I think I'd lose respect for someone who needed to fetishise something like a foot. Or a shoe. Or anything else that isn't more specifically a sexual organ. Breasts/legs/genitals/curves - fine. But not feet.
At any rate, clearly this couple is not really compatible long term. Not because he has a fetish, but because of this: "I'm at a stage in my sexual growth where I need to experience my fetish."
What a whingey, indulgent, self-help piece of crap. Who here went through a "process" of "sexual growth"? Most of us lost our virginity, went through a few partners, maybe learned a few tricks along the way. That's it. It just happens. "I'm a at stage..." etc sounds like frankly he's looking for ways to become more hardcore in his fetishes.
And Charlie: no one could have put it better than you. Monogamy is a valid choice. It's also to some extent a sacrifice of thrills, adventure, and sexual variety. Not a big sacrifice though, assuming you and your partner are sexually imaginative and generous. But what you gain, in terms of commitment and intimacy with a long-term partner, is worth that sacrifice.
The Tiger thing? There were two issues here. Either a guy genuinely falls in love with another woman, can't bear to leave his wife, and has a long-term affair/"second wife" or mistress French-style. Or a guy has a big libido and ego and feeds it with a long string of lapdancers and strippers and party girls. What goes on tour stays on tour. But it didn't with Tiger, did it? He enjoyed lengthy relationships and relationship intimacy with at least a dozen different women. It was far more than just sex and a high libido. No wonder his wife is devastated.
More...
At any rate, clearly this couple is not really compatible long term. Not because he has a fetish, but because of this: "I'm at a stage in my sexual growth where I need to experience my fetish."
What a whingey, indulgent, self-help piece of crap. Who here went through a "process" of "sexual growth"? Most of us lost our virginity, went through a few partners, maybe learned a few tricks along the way. That's it. It just happens. "I'm a at stage..." etc sounds like frankly he's looking for ways to become more hardcore in his fetishes.
And Charlie: no one could have put it better than you. Monogamy is a valid choice. It's also to some extent a sacrifice of thrills, adventure, and sexual variety. Not a big sacrifice though, assuming you and your partner are sexually imaginative and generous. But what you gain, in terms of commitment and intimacy with a long-term partner, is worth that sacrifice.
The Tiger thing? There were two issues here. Either a guy genuinely falls in love with another woman, can't bear to leave his wife, and has a long-term affair/"second wife" or mistress French-style. Or a guy has a big libido and ego and feeds it with a long string of lapdancers and strippers and party girls. What goes on tour stays on tour. But it didn't with Tiger, did it? He enjoyed lengthy relationships and relationship intimacy with at least a dozen different women. It was far more than just sex and a high libido. No wonder his wife is devastated.
141
I believe Dan's advice was accurate about SFF and his foot fetish. If his fantasies aren't fulfilled, he will become a cpos. It would only be his fault is he didn't do something about it before it made him become a cpos. I have a PhD in human psychology and I agree with his response. I enjoy how blunt this guy is! I really enjoy your column Dan Savage.
142
I have a question for those of you who successfully manage non-monogamy: assume you have the "one relationship partner, many sex partners" model going on. What happens if your relationship partner gets emotionally hurt by one of his or her lovers on the side? I know that relationship isn't supposed to have the emotional connection yours does, but getting your feelings hurt - maybe just a little - can be a hazard of even the most casual sexual relationships. So, do you end up having to comfort your partner when he or she gets dumped on? Or at least having to put up with a sulky mood until your partner gets over it? Or do you expect him or her to hide the feelings?
This is an honest question, no kind of judgement. I don't know how this works for people and I'm just curious.
This is an honest question, no kind of judgement. I don't know how this works for people and I'm just curious.
143
Tiger Woods's wife didn't actually go after him with a nine iron. She was trying to help him get out of the car. "Wife beats husband with golf club" makes a funnier SNL sketch and late-night topten than "Wife pauses in middle of spouse fight to help spouse exit ruined vehicle," but in this case it's had the side effect of completely misinforming the public if even writers like Mr. Savage think the story is real.
Yes, it is messed-up for the media to condone spousal abuse, regardless of the gender of the abusing spouse, but what we should be wondering about is why we're reacting to something that DIDN'T HAPPEN.
Yes, it is messed-up for the media to condone spousal abuse, regardless of the gender of the abusing spouse, but what we should be wondering about is why we're reacting to something that DIDN'T HAPPEN.
144
I've always thought saying monogamy wasn't natural was just an excuse by people trying to get out of trouble. It really is simple if you want to have more than one partner at a time don't get married.
145
Every open relationship I've ever known involved one person who was happy to have it all ( dedicated mate/the chance to date) and another person or two who were going along with it but really not the least bit happy with it. (And the former was invariably a pretty selfish a-hole). Ergo I can't help thinking about it as something that sounds great in theory but most of the time, in actual practice, you probably can't really have the best of both worlds. The vigorously nonmonogamous still want the kind of deep relationship that comes with exclusivity; the deeply attached monogamous still want variety. But hell, isn't that the way most things in life are? Most people can't manage to have millions of dollars and lots of leisure time, too. If the bucks are that important you, you're going to make sacrifices to get them. If never having to do anything you don't wanna do is that paramount, you're going to have to give up some material comfort. Yeah, you can tweak it somewhat, but most of the time life means making trade-offs and dealing with it.
146
polyamory/monogamy; foot fetishists; "the smell of anal" ?!?!
@144 - Mike1222, tell yourself what to do. Please don't assume you know what's best for me. My marriage to my husband is none of your business. We are non-monogamous and married and it works for us. Our marriage, our rules.
@142 -Magpie, I can't speak for anyone's relationship but my own. I have had an emotional connection to my other partner(s). Like any relationship, there are emotional risks. Yes, I comforted my sweetie when another person "dumped on" them. Even when I was RELIEVED that the offending person had left the scene. (One person was mean to one of my guys, one person tried to convince one of my guys to leave me - bzzzt, wrong answer!)
@94 - XoXo, ME, TOO! I adore having my feet attended to. Maybe I'll have to audition for that position! :-)
@ 85 - Portland Scribe, oh, I hope you are kidding about "the smell of anal"! If the anus being penetrated smells funky, it's because it's not clean enough. Find yourself Tristan Taormino's book about anal sex for women. (Or contact me to purchase a copy.) There's a LOT to know about anal, it can be way fun!
@144 - Mike1222, tell yourself what to do. Please don't assume you know what's best for me. My marriage to my husband is none of your business. We are non-monogamous and married and it works for us. Our marriage, our rules.
@142 -Magpie, I can't speak for anyone's relationship but my own. I have had an emotional connection to my other partner(s). Like any relationship, there are emotional risks. Yes, I comforted my sweetie when another person "dumped on" them. Even when I was RELIEVED that the offending person had left the scene. (One person was mean to one of my guys, one person tried to convince one of my guys to leave me - bzzzt, wrong answer!)
@94 - XoXo, ME, TOO! I adore having my feet attended to. Maybe I'll have to audition for that position! :-)
@ 85 - Portland Scribe, oh, I hope you are kidding about "the smell of anal"! If the anus being penetrated smells funky, it's because it's not clean enough. Find yourself Tristan Taormino's book about anal sex for women. (Or contact me to purchase a copy.) There's a LOT to know about anal, it can be way fun!
147
@27, I agree with you. I'm monogamous, and I prefer things this way simply because there's probably 80% less drama in my life this way. I also have been cheated on in the past, and I don't like the feelings that came with it. I am hardwired to not accept that my mate has chosen to go to someone else for something that I could provide. If I haven't been providing, what are the circumstances? There are always ways around relationship issues if you just talk, and not assume.
Tiger Woods. The only thing that baffles me about that whole situation is why he even bothered to get married in the first place. If you didn't want a monogamous relationship, why did you marry her? Did she pressure you? Make threats? That's no better than cheating, so it seems to me that they could very well both be in the wrong here.
Either way, this whole thing could have been headed off at the pass if they had both been honest with each other, no matter how much it hurts.
Tiger Woods. The only thing that baffles me about that whole situation is why he even bothered to get married in the first place. If you didn't want a monogamous relationship, why did you marry her? Did she pressure you? Make threats? That's no better than cheating, so it seems to me that they could very well both be in the wrong here.
Either way, this whole thing could have been headed off at the pass if they had both been honest with each other, no matter how much it hurts.
148
SFF's girlfriend is missing an important opportunity. He could be giving her pedicures and foot massages every night. That would make them both feel good. What's wrong with that? It's not like he wants to poo into her mouth or something.
149
I happen to think some humans are "wired" for monogamy..I was in a 23 yr relationship and never cheated or wanted to (and am as sure as it is humanly possible to be that he never did either). Now that I am "single" for the first time since age 19, (due to his death a few yrs ago) I find I am just not cut out for the whole one-night-stand/casual sex thing...I've had plenty of offers and chances, but it just doesn't do it for me. I realize I HAVE to have some deeper connection to a partner AND while I am totally fine with the idea of an honest, safe, open relationship, I could never go there..it is just against my nature. Guess I am a goose (one of the many species who mate for life...we had a gander when I was a kid whose mate was killed and we tried several times to replace her to no avail..he just ignored or attacked them and lived the rest of his days a mean, bitter old beast!...I hope my fate is more promising, lol)
150
P.S. the key is in people knowing and being honest about THEIR "wiring"...yes, some of us ARE wired to cheat, and if so, we need to accept that and structure our lives around the fact so as not to leave a swath or destruction in our wake.
151
@147 but there is something you can't provide a cheating lover - someone else. Every hole might feel the same in the dark, but you aren't a redhead and a brunette and a blonde, you aren't asian and white and black and hispanic and arabic, you aren't tall and short and thin and fat. We don't expect anyone to only have one friend ever - we see those people as weird, in fact. We don't expect people to only eat one type of dinner ever - macaroni for every meal would be boring. Yet society often expects a person to be 100% fulfilled by their spouse/lover/partner/whatever, for as far as 80+ years? Macaroni can be your most favoritestestest meal, but you're probably going to be eyeballing some chicken salad after a few years of just macaroni. It can be the same with people, too, you know.
And for the record, I'm a guy who is utterly grossed out by feet. Toes in particular. I would rather eat shit or fuck a dog than suck on some toes. So all you people talking about how it's not really that bad? For some people, it can be. Ultimatums are BS, but if I were given one I'd have to say goodbye. I can be GGG in almost any area except that, and for all we know, so is this woman. Maybe she'd be willing to spank him, change his diaper, peg him, pick up strange so he can beat it furiously later for him, but this one thing is just over the limit. Everyone's got different limits.
And for the record, I'm a guy who is utterly grossed out by feet. Toes in particular. I would rather eat shit or fuck a dog than suck on some toes. So all you people talking about how it's not really that bad? For some people, it can be. Ultimatums are BS, but if I were given one I'd have to say goodbye. I can be GGG in almost any area except that, and for all we know, so is this woman. Maybe she'd be willing to spank him, change his diaper, peg him, pick up strange so he can beat it furiously later for him, but this one thing is just over the limit. Everyone's got different limits.
152
Somehow missed this early, so...
@132, will you marry me? We can happily wear socks together forever. ;)
@132, will you marry me? We can happily wear socks together forever. ;)
153
#17/regina1975: "While I am more than happy to indulge my partner if I can, I am completely, utterly, and 100% repulsed by toe-sucking, toes in private places, heel-licking, you name it. My memories of a previous boyfriend's attempts at this behavior still sicken me (not that I think there is anything wrong with it, on the contrary, I think it's absolutely harmless, but it's just not my thing). While I am perfectly comfortable with clean, well manicured, non-stinky feet in an ordinary context (I even give great foot-rubs), feet completely gross me out in a sexual context."
This attitude -- obviously shared by SFF's girlfriend -- seems to be pretty typical of women. I can guarantee that a MUCH higher percentage of men than women are into feet in a sexual context (and perhaps also in just admiring them aesthetically.) Why what is, I'm not sure, especially since, in most cases, guys probably just want to suck their woman's toes, or lick their woman's feet. They're likely not expecting or demanding reciprocation.
If I was with a woman who had nasty, gnarly toes, I'd probably be turned-off at the idea of sucking them, but why on earth would I be repulsed if she really got off on wanting to suck mine?
I've been intimate with about 30 women. Of those, I wanted to suck the toes of only about half and most of them didn't want me to do it. One of them loved the feeling and really got off on it. Not a single one of those women wanted to suck my toes (and my feet aren't gnarly.)
I think this ties in with what Dan said in a column about ten years ago: "It's a sad fact that men are more likely to be kinky than women." I'd be curious if there's one kink (besides, perhaps, fantasy vampirism) that women are more into than men.
Personally, I think that men have a lower "gross threshold" than women do, and that it's probably due to nature more than nuture. I think that women tend to view things like toe sucking, armpit licking, butt licking, peeing -- and, at the more extreme end, shitting (something that I find disgusting) -- as more gross than men do. Just look at all the videos out there of women peeing, that lots of men are looking at. Are there lots of videos of men peeing that women are looking at? I doubt it.
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This attitude -- obviously shared by SFF's girlfriend -- seems to be pretty typical of women. I can guarantee that a MUCH higher percentage of men than women are into feet in a sexual context (and perhaps also in just admiring them aesthetically.) Why what is, I'm not sure, especially since, in most cases, guys probably just want to suck their woman's toes, or lick their woman's feet. They're likely not expecting or demanding reciprocation.
If I was with a woman who had nasty, gnarly toes, I'd probably be turned-off at the idea of sucking them, but why on earth would I be repulsed if she really got off on wanting to suck mine?
I've been intimate with about 30 women. Of those, I wanted to suck the toes of only about half and most of them didn't want me to do it. One of them loved the feeling and really got off on it. Not a single one of those women wanted to suck my toes (and my feet aren't gnarly.)
I think this ties in with what Dan said in a column about ten years ago: "It's a sad fact that men are more likely to be kinky than women." I'd be curious if there's one kink (besides, perhaps, fantasy vampirism) that women are more into than men.
Personally, I think that men have a lower "gross threshold" than women do, and that it's probably due to nature more than nuture. I think that women tend to view things like toe sucking, armpit licking, butt licking, peeing -- and, at the more extreme end, shitting (something that I find disgusting) -- as more gross than men do. Just look at all the videos out there of women peeing, that lots of men are looking at. Are there lots of videos of men peeing that women are looking at? I doubt it.
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#132/Snappher: "I gotta put this out there - feet gross me the fuck OUT! anybody's feet."
And I can't help it, that attitude makes me laugh (and 100-to-1 says you're a woman.) I can see being grossed out by the feet of some people, perhaps even most people...but ALL feet? A woman's feet that are nicely-shaped and pedicured are beautiful and sexy. They're just as much of a work of art as a lovely pair of hands. And I'm sure there are gay men that feel the same way about the feet of some men.
And I can't help it, that attitude makes me laugh (and 100-to-1 says you're a woman.) I can see being grossed out by the feet of some people, perhaps even most people...but ALL feet? A woman's feet that are nicely-shaped and pedicured are beautiful and sexy. They're just as much of a work of art as a lovely pair of hands. And I'm sure there are gay men that feel the same way about the feet of some men.
155
#147/Amyranth: "Tiger Woods. The only thing that baffles me about that whole situation is why he even bothered to get married in the first place. If you didn't want a monogamous relationship, why did you marry her?"
My guess is that guys like Tiger want both: they want to be married (for the sake of having kids, for stability, or for some other reasons) but also want to continue to fuck other women. And if a man is honest with a woman and says, "Sweetheart, I really want to marry you but I can't promise to be monogamous" then, in probably 99% of the cases, she'll say "Adios", so of course he's going to promise to be faithful.
I could be (and would willingly be) proven wrong but I think that a study would show that men and women who are very desirable (handsome high-status men and hot sexy women) and are married cheat more than married men and women who are not that desirable. Why? Because I believe that cheating is largely a function of opportunity. Sure, personal ethics plays a role -- I'm sure there are very desirable husbands and wives who get a lot of offers but never give in to temptation, just as there are fat & homely husbands and wives who cheat -- but I think, in general, the more desirable you are and the more temptation you get, the morely likely you are to cave.
My guess is that guys like Tiger want both: they want to be married (for the sake of having kids, for stability, or for some other reasons) but also want to continue to fuck other women. And if a man is honest with a woman and says, "Sweetheart, I really want to marry you but I can't promise to be monogamous" then, in probably 99% of the cases, she'll say "Adios", so of course he's going to promise to be faithful.
I could be (and would willingly be) proven wrong but I think that a study would show that men and women who are very desirable (handsome high-status men and hot sexy women) and are married cheat more than married men and women who are not that desirable. Why? Because I believe that cheating is largely a function of opportunity. Sure, personal ethics plays a role -- I'm sure there are very desirable husbands and wives who get a lot of offers but never give in to temptation, just as there are fat & homely husbands and wives who cheat -- but I think, in general, the more desirable you are and the more temptation you get, the morely likely you are to cave.
156
#151/falconswan: "And for the record, I'm a guy who is utterly grossed out by feet. Toes in particular. I would rather eat shit or fuck a dog than suck on some toes. So all you people talking about how it's not really that bad? For some people, it can be."
While it's typically women who feel this way about feet, you're evidence that it's not limited to them. You'd really rather eat shit than suck on toes? I highly doubt that, given that choice in reality, you'd choose to eat shit but, assuming you really would, it's fascinating to me that someone can find feet and toes THAT horribly repulsive. Did your grandmother constantly rub her smelly feet in your face when you were young or something? Did a pair of feet steal all your toys? Or kill your pet dog?
While it's typically women who feel this way about feet, you're evidence that it's not limited to them. You'd really rather eat shit than suck on toes? I highly doubt that, given that choice in reality, you'd choose to eat shit but, assuming you really would, it's fascinating to me that someone can find feet and toes THAT horribly repulsive. Did your grandmother constantly rub her smelly feet in your face when you were young or something? Did a pair of feet steal all your toys? Or kill your pet dog?
157
#22: No animal is virtually monogomous? Heh ... I always thought the Handed Gibbon Hylobates Lal and Siamang Hylobtes Syndactilus were examples of primates that are monogamous.
http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~palombit/Pal…
Then you also have animals that are "obligate monogamous", such as beavers. Beavers are monogamous; however, the only reason why they are, is because the cooperation between both parents is necessary for the survival of the offspring. Beavers need a division of labour between mama and papa, in order for their offspring to live (what the hell is a baby beaver called?) Marking their territory, maintaining their dam, raising their young, defending themselves from threats ... it's too much for one beaver to handle, so they mate for life.
I do not know how to end this comment, so I will just point out how pretty gibbons are: http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2163/1735…
http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~palombit/Pal…
Then you also have animals that are "obligate monogamous", such as beavers. Beavers are monogamous; however, the only reason why they are, is because the cooperation between both parents is necessary for the survival of the offspring. Beavers need a division of labour between mama and papa, in order for their offspring to live (what the hell is a baby beaver called?) Marking their territory, maintaining their dam, raising their young, defending themselves from threats ... it's too much for one beaver to handle, so they mate for life.
I do not know how to end this comment, so I will just point out how pretty gibbons are: http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2163/1735…
158
Sure there are plenty of people who are monogamous and happy to remain so. 90% of them are in a relationship with someone who isn't.
159
#142, not all of us have the "one romantic partner, many sex partners" thing going on. I have two romantic partners and some other FWBs. We all comfort each other through breakups or other stress. That's what friends (and boyfriends) are for!
160
Yeah, here's someone else saying let's all respect one another's preferences and not hurl judgmental epithets like 'natural' and 'unnatural' at one another - columnist included.
161
Not being judgmental, merely some observations.
Civilization also isn't natural or easy, but it is one of things that sets us apart from the animals (human and otherwise). It requires sacrifices and delayed gratification. I'm just trying to put things into perspective. There should be things more important than sex in a person's life. There are angels and demons in everyone, our ability to control the latter is what makes us human beings, not merely homo sapiens.
Civilization also isn't natural or easy, but it is one of things that sets us apart from the animals (human and otherwise). It requires sacrifices and delayed gratification. I'm just trying to put things into perspective. There should be things more important than sex in a person's life. There are angels and demons in everyone, our ability to control the latter is what makes us human beings, not merely homo sapiens.
162
Okay. So there are a ton of comments, but I wanted to say one thing about the foot fetishist... What if his girlfriend has terribly ticklish feet? I don't know about anyone else, but if someone sucked on my toes, I think I might break their nose with a knee-jerk tickled reaction. If my partner were into it, I'd want to try somehow, but I would still worry about accidentally kicking them in the teeth.
Just a note. I don't know the whole story or anything. But it doesn't seem fair to assume that she's being selfish.
Just a note. I don't know the whole story or anything. But it doesn't seem fair to assume that she's being selfish.
163
It may be because I've never been in love, but there is no way I would ever let anyone lick/ suck on my feet. I feel like I would vomit right on them. But I can't even look at people wearing sandals, that is how much of an aversion to feet I have.
164
As a man with a foot fetish (and someone who was unhappily married for years), I have to agree with Dan on this issue. It is as hard wired into what turns me on as my sexual preference. I don't go so far as to need to suck on toes, but my woman having well groomed toes and allowing me to give her foot massages regularly are part of the bill. If a woman didn't think that was acceptable, she just isn't for me. I dated a woman for a short period of time who picked at her toenails. She also had an aversion to hosiery. I realized this was how she was and I couldn't or wouldn't change it, so I dumped her. She just wasn't "the one". Sorry but that's how it is.
165
Hey Faggot,
Did you mean all humans are wired to cheat or not? Assuming you meant all when you said 'people' followed by 'we':
SO,
Monogamy isn't natural... for everyone??? People are wired to cheat? Cite (a study, not People magazine and not yerself) or it doesn't exist.
I agree a vast majority of humanity is constantly looking for a better / newer / hotter mate and that many can claim certain instincts and darwinistic theories propel their libidos to change the sex channel every now & then: HOWEVER, I fully believe that just like some creatures in the animal kingdom mate for life, so do some select portions of humanity.
I have a couple of friends, and they've been models-of-monogamy together for more than 2 decades, now. They set an example for those around them about how love/relationships aren't to be phoned in or taken for granted, but improved upon, worked on, weekly. Yet, they are effortless about it. More than a few of us are fucking envious. They grow constantly and learn incessantly and seem to those of us in awe that they actually fall more in love as the years pass. Fucking saps. Yet, I would wish no two people to have more happiness and great years than them, and I sincerely hope they decide to raise a brood someday of equally well-adjusted, and truthfully loving progressives. SOME people are wired that way, too.
Just like how US Presidents don't HAVE to be dickhead old white men from Mayflower bloodlines, I'm grateful more than just one whitewashed, bitter, bitchy version of 'relationship truth' exists. It gives hope.
People cheat because monogamy isn't natural and we are wired to cheat. That doesn't make cheating right, of course; people should honor their commitments, and blah-de-nine-iron-blah. But we shouldn't encourage people to make commitments we all know they're unlikely to keep. The end.
Oh, and....
Can't SFF get himself a cyberskin foot and everybody's (moderately) happy?? Or take a hotfoam casting of HER foot?
Tiger who?
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Did you mean all humans are wired to cheat or not? Assuming you meant all when you said 'people' followed by 'we':
SO,
Monogamy isn't natural... for everyone??? People are wired to cheat? Cite (a study, not People magazine and not yerself) or it doesn't exist.
I agree a vast majority of humanity is constantly looking for a better / newer / hotter mate and that many can claim certain instincts and darwinistic theories propel their libidos to change the sex channel every now & then: HOWEVER, I fully believe that just like some creatures in the animal kingdom mate for life, so do some select portions of humanity.
I have a couple of friends, and they've been models-of-monogamy together for more than 2 decades, now. They set an example for those around them about how love/relationships aren't to be phoned in or taken for granted, but improved upon, worked on, weekly. Yet, they are effortless about it. More than a few of us are fucking envious. They grow constantly and learn incessantly and seem to those of us in awe that they actually fall more in love as the years pass. Fucking saps. Yet, I would wish no two people to have more happiness and great years than them, and I sincerely hope they decide to raise a brood someday of equally well-adjusted, and truthfully loving progressives. SOME people are wired that way, too.
Just like how US Presidents don't HAVE to be dickhead old white men from Mayflower bloodlines, I'm grateful more than just one whitewashed, bitter, bitchy version of 'relationship truth' exists. It gives hope.
People cheat because monogamy isn't natural and we are wired to cheat. That doesn't make cheating right, of course; people should honor their commitments, and blah-de-nine-iron-blah. But we shouldn't encourage people to make commitments we all know they're unlikely to keep. The end.
Oh, and....
Can't SFF get himself a cyberskin foot and everybody's (moderately) happy?? Or take a hotfoam casting of HER foot?
Tiger who?
166
@63: twat flavored asshats of plegm! Monogamy can be something other than 'refraining' from dropping trou at the slightest flirt or wink: some people are actually distracted by their one true love enough that 'restraint' isn't needed! It's not 'refraining' at all, it's perhaps ignoring. Nor do they "do it for the kids", they simply live a monogamous life. Dare I say, NATURALLY.
Also, your anti- co-dependency subtext of 'worrying about your partner's feelings' isn't always part of monogamy either: some worry about their own... (whaddya call 'em...?) ethics. Pride. Personal choices. Honor. Promises.
Open your mind enough to see that some people in humanity aren't ruled by libido, fear or whim, but by conscious intelligent thought and reason, or gawd forbid, honesty & emotion. Your (and Dan's) "sticking to your choice" line sounds just like the claim many churches make about homosexuality supposedly being a phase/choice, rather than a way some people are wired.
Oh and...
@22, @81, et al: Some facts for you: over 90% of avian species are socially monogamous and 10% are also sexually monogamous. 3% of mammals are sexually monogamous and 15% of primates are socially monogamous. Based on observation as well as genetic testing of offspring. So, while still a minority, monogamy exists quite frequently in the animal world. Add also: British Spiny Seahorse, Fairy-Wren, Corvus corax, and the gay penguins at the Central Park Zoo.
Also, your anti- co-dependency subtext of 'worrying about your partner's feelings' isn't always part of monogamy either: some worry about their own... (whaddya call 'em...?) ethics. Pride. Personal choices. Honor. Promises.
Open your mind enough to see that some people in humanity aren't ruled by libido, fear or whim, but by conscious intelligent thought and reason, or gawd forbid, honesty & emotion. Your (and Dan's) "sticking to your choice" line sounds just like the claim many churches make about homosexuality supposedly being a phase/choice, rather than a way some people are wired.
Oh and...
@22, @81, et al: Some facts for you: over 90% of avian species are socially monogamous and 10% are also sexually monogamous. 3% of mammals are sexually monogamous and 15% of primates are socially monogamous. Based on observation as well as genetic testing of offspring. So, while still a minority, monogamy exists quite frequently in the animal world. Add also: British Spiny Seahorse, Fairy-Wren, Corvus corax, and the gay penguins at the Central Park Zoo.
167
The foot guy should JO to foot porn, and withold sex from the GF and see how she likes being denied satisfaction=D
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@126 Oh, I guarantee that I WILL fall in love with other people. Exclusivity of any kind isn't necessarily a facet of romantic love for everyone. I know couples/moresomes who've made polyamory work for decades! Monogamy is a form of commitment, but so is polyamory. I agree that people who attempt to guarantee their partner that they won't fall in love with anyone else they're fucking/dating are probably delusional.
@142 I comfort my partners when they are upset for any reason. It could have to do with work, family, health, or yes, other partners. It's called being supportive and I'm happy to do it!
@142 I comfort my partners when they are upset for any reason. It could have to do with work, family, health, or yes, other partners. It's called being supportive and I'm happy to do it!
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@140: 'The foot fetish thing: the girlfriend clearly finds it a turn off, and quite possibly will lose respect/sexual feelings towards the boyfriend if he insists on indulging it.' That's a good point. Even a GGG lover who indulges in their partner's fetish may just lose their attraction to them based on it, whether they want to or not (just as the partner can't help but be turned on by it). Which is probably why this dude should find someone into it if it truly makes him happy. Because chances are, as with most hetero relationships, it's easier for hi to get off than for her – hampering that dynamic even further isn't a great idea.
170
'The foot fetish thing: the girlfriend clearly finds it a turn off, and quite possibly will lose respect/sexual feelings towards the boyfriend if he insists on indulging it.'
Whatever! I'm a guy and I used to find cunnilingus a turn-off and disgusting. I adopted a similar aversion tactic with my girlfriend: I knew she wanted it, but I didn't do it, and she was too polite to push the issue.
Thankfully, I saw the error of my ways and got over it. Otherwise, I'd be going against one of Dan's cardinal rules ("Oral comes standard.")
I think it's less to ask of someone to put their feet in someone's mouth or on someone's genitalia than it is to demand that they put their mouth on someone's junk:
You put your tongue on a guy's dick, the guy puts his tongue on your pussy, what's so bad about putting your foot on his dick? Jeez...
If she has a problem with it, then that deserves to be respected. If she's TOTALLY AND 100% NOT INTO IT, then they should break up. But honestly, I think that this aversion is something that could be worked through if taken slowly.
Whatever! I'm a guy and I used to find cunnilingus a turn-off and disgusting. I adopted a similar aversion tactic with my girlfriend: I knew she wanted it, but I didn't do it, and she was too polite to push the issue.
Thankfully, I saw the error of my ways and got over it. Otherwise, I'd be going against one of Dan's cardinal rules ("Oral comes standard.")
I think it's less to ask of someone to put their feet in someone's mouth or on someone's genitalia than it is to demand that they put their mouth on someone's junk:
You put your tongue on a guy's dick, the guy puts his tongue on your pussy, what's so bad about putting your foot on his dick? Jeez...
If she has a problem with it, then that deserves to be respected. If she's TOTALLY AND 100% NOT INTO IT, then they should break up. But honestly, I think that this aversion is something that could be worked through if taken slowly.
171
@143, Tiger Wood's wife didn't chase him with a 9 iron, causing him to wreck his car. What happened was that he crashed in his driveway without any precipitant. All four doors, on both sides, were irretrievably damaged and he was temporarily paralyzed by the low speed crash, so obviously, she had to smash in a window so she could drag the large man out of his vehicle herself, as yanking an incapacitated person out of a vehicle onto the ground is the safest course of action for them. Then, his paralysis resolved, and they went inside. Got it?
172
My lover has serious stiletto heels & foot fetishes. Doesn't do a thing for me. But he loves it so much that I couldn't possibly say no and it turns him on so much that I reap the rewards.
Having said that, there are a couple of sexual things I absolutely could not do or watch. These are deal-breakers for me and if a lover absolutely has to have these, it can't be with me.
Having said that, there are a couple of sexual things I absolutely could not do or watch. These are deal-breakers for me and if a lover absolutely has to have these, it can't be with me.
173
@155......just curious, do you think that being "good looking" gives you the right to be unfaithful because you have more opportunity?
174
I HATE IT when people reverse gender/race/whatever roles like you can just do that without changing anything important about the situation. (Remember when everyone was saying, "If Sonia Sotamayor had been a white man . . ."? Yeah, that was really stupid.) We don't react in the same way to the wife with the golf club because MEN BEAT THE SHIT OUT OF WOMEN far, far more than the reverse. It is not the same thing when you reverse gender roles in situations related to domestic violence. At all. Was Tiger's life or person ever really in danger? I doubt it. The same is not true for a hypothetical woman in the reverse situation.
175
I am also a male with a foot fetish and Dan's advice was partially correct: she should go ahead and let him indulge even though it doesn't do anything for her but I also agree with other posters in that if she finds his foot fetish completely disgusting, then they should part ways.
I've known I had this fetish since puberty, which allows me to screen potential mates based on their affinity for letting me indulge. That guy should have known, after one week let alone four years, that she's not into it. He should have moved on then. I've learned this about women and my foot fetish: there are probably 10 women who love getting foot massages, toes sucked, and giving footjobs to every 1 who detest it. When I meet someone and things go serious, I "test the waters" if she lets me go down on her feet and toes. If she recoiles, then it's usually "nice to know ya". You'll always know as soon as you move your hands down to give her a massage. Watch her reaction. Body language speaks the most here. I don't care if she's Brangelina and can suck a grapefruit through a garden hose. No toes, no thanks.
If you're a woman with a man with a foot fetish, but you don't find it disgusting (and at the same time it doesn't get you off) then let him go at it. You can read a magazine or watch TV while you get the best foot massage you've ever had. And let him suck on your toes - I've converted several women from the "I don't care for it" to "must have my toes sucked". My advice: during missionary, as soon as you are about to climax, stick your toes in his mouth and ride the monster wave.
I've known I had this fetish since puberty, which allows me to screen potential mates based on their affinity for letting me indulge. That guy should have known, after one week let alone four years, that she's not into it. He should have moved on then. I've learned this about women and my foot fetish: there are probably 10 women who love getting foot massages, toes sucked, and giving footjobs to every 1 who detest it. When I meet someone and things go serious, I "test the waters" if she lets me go down on her feet and toes. If she recoiles, then it's usually "nice to know ya". You'll always know as soon as you move your hands down to give her a massage. Watch her reaction. Body language speaks the most here. I don't care if she's Brangelina and can suck a grapefruit through a garden hose. No toes, no thanks.
If you're a woman with a man with a foot fetish, but you don't find it disgusting (and at the same time it doesn't get you off) then let him go at it. You can read a magazine or watch TV while you get the best foot massage you've ever had. And let him suck on your toes - I've converted several women from the "I don't care for it" to "must have my toes sucked". My advice: during missionary, as soon as you are about to climax, stick your toes in his mouth and ride the monster wave.
176
Dear Foot Fetish Guy:
Your girlfriend probably doesn't want you licking her feet because she thinks it's gross. She doesn't feel her feet are attractive, and she doesn't feel that they are clean.
Here's my advice. Buy her a really nice pedicure. Then- run her a nice bubble bath.
Make love right afterward. Tell her her feet look amazing with the polish and that they are so clean and pretty- and you really want to make love to them right now.
Show her how much you love her by kissing her toes. Progress to licking or sucking on them, or whatever you want to do.
Take it slow, so that you don't alarm her. You are basically just getting her to feel comfortable with it.
Take this advice from me, because I am a girl- and I don't find my feet particularly attractive.
Oh- and don't forget the rest of her as well. You should make it a whole-body experience!
Your girlfriend probably doesn't want you licking her feet because she thinks it's gross. She doesn't feel her feet are attractive, and she doesn't feel that they are clean.
Here's my advice. Buy her a really nice pedicure. Then- run her a nice bubble bath.
Make love right afterward. Tell her her feet look amazing with the polish and that they are so clean and pretty- and you really want to make love to them right now.
Show her how much you love her by kissing her toes. Progress to licking or sucking on them, or whatever you want to do.
Take it slow, so that you don't alarm her. You are basically just getting her to feel comfortable with it.
Take this advice from me, because I am a girl- and I don't find my feet particularly attractive.
Oh- and don't forget the rest of her as well. You should make it a whole-body experience!
177
On the Tiger Woods/spousal abuse thing...
I see a substantive (and not gender-based) difference between assaulting someone in the context of an ongoing relationship, and assaulting someone in the context of a nasty breakup (even if it is followed by reconciliation).
The former is... perverting the presumed love and trust of a relationship by introducing violence. The second is merely overreacting to whatever stimulus instigated the breakup (usually the abuse-ee being a PoS in some way).
It's a bit like the difference between punching your friend in the stomach, or punching the guy who stole your lunch money in the stomach...
I see a substantive (and not gender-based) difference between assaulting someone in the context of an ongoing relationship, and assaulting someone in the context of a nasty breakup (even if it is followed by reconciliation).
The former is... perverting the presumed love and trust of a relationship by introducing violence. The second is merely overreacting to whatever stimulus instigated the breakup (usually the abuse-ee being a PoS in some way).
It's a bit like the difference between punching your friend in the stomach, or punching the guy who stole your lunch money in the stomach...
178
So as usual I had to go look up a term mentioned in one of your columns. "The christian side hug" is quit possibly the most interesting term to date. I had high expiations of something to do with penis to ear penetration. But oh to my surprise what lengths the Conservative Christians will go to, complete with “Rough Rider” rappers and gun shots. I’m just wondering if anyone out there has developed a fetish for it. It would be fitting for such an over-bearing-conservative - Christian "movement" to spark a true kink for such intentional non-touching or hugging as it were. What’s next my conservative Christian Rough Rider rapper friends? My I suggest taking away all forms of physical interaction and insisting on "air interactions" circ Demolition Man staring Sylvester Stallone and Sandra Bullock. Oh wait, those types of interactions don’t work; just like only teaching/preaching abstinence!
Thank God for Dan Savage!
Sincerely,
Brandy, stright from the bible belt
Thank God for Dan Savage!
Sincerely,
Brandy, stright from the bible belt
179
Honestly, why do we care about Tiger Woods cheating on his wife? Unless you are his wife, child, relative, close friend, or one of the 13 women who he cheated with, then this doesn't affect your life whatsoever! If he was just another regular Joe that cheated with so many women then the story might've still happened to make the news, but people would have stopped talking about it a long time ago.
Now I'm a man that doesn't think that being monogamous is impossible and we are all capable of being so, but monogomy can eventually become monotonous if we are not willing to try new things(sexual & non). However, if one knows within oneself that he/she can't resist the temptation of cheating on someone they supposedly love then it's best to break things off first.
I'm 23 now, and I was also in a 4 year relationshp that lasted until I was 22. My ex and I had an amazing sex life and we were open with eachother to try different things. However, I often fantasized of doing other things with other women while having sex with her. Although this started to happen more and more, I never cheated on her. Not only do I think it's wrong, but karma's a bitch and I'd be hurt if someone I loved did that to me.
I also happen to like women's feet as long as they're clean, pretty, well manicured, soft and smooth, and don't have a bad odor. I actually grew up thinking I was wierd for having this fetish and afraid to try it, because I had never really heard of many people who were into feet like that. That was until I looked it up online and found tons of FF sites. I tried it out on my girl and she really liked it, especially when I sucked on her toes while bangin' her back out. That would drive her insane!
So with all that said, it just depends on how open we are with eachother and how important certain things are in our relationships. If there are certain things that two people may not agree on to the point where it takes a toll on their relationship, they may just not be compatable for eachother. Hopefully they can figure this out before they spend several years together.
As I stated earlier, I have never cheated on any woman. I have been single for over a year and have had a number of flings, but I'm completely honest with them and they know that it's just a fling. When I find someone who I feel a deeper connection with, then I will exculsively be with that person.
Peace Yall!
Devin, TX.
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Now I'm a man that doesn't think that being monogamous is impossible and we are all capable of being so, but monogomy can eventually become monotonous if we are not willing to try new things(sexual & non). However, if one knows within oneself that he/she can't resist the temptation of cheating on someone they supposedly love then it's best to break things off first.
I'm 23 now, and I was also in a 4 year relationshp that lasted until I was 22. My ex and I had an amazing sex life and we were open with eachother to try different things. However, I often fantasized of doing other things with other women while having sex with her. Although this started to happen more and more, I never cheated on her. Not only do I think it's wrong, but karma's a bitch and I'd be hurt if someone I loved did that to me.
I also happen to like women's feet as long as they're clean, pretty, well manicured, soft and smooth, and don't have a bad odor. I actually grew up thinking I was wierd for having this fetish and afraid to try it, because I had never really heard of many people who were into feet like that. That was until I looked it up online and found tons of FF sites. I tried it out on my girl and she really liked it, especially when I sucked on her toes while bangin' her back out. That would drive her insane!
So with all that said, it just depends on how open we are with eachother and how important certain things are in our relationships. If there are certain things that two people may not agree on to the point where it takes a toll on their relationship, they may just not be compatable for eachother. Hopefully they can figure this out before they spend several years together.
As I stated earlier, I have never cheated on any woman. I have been single for over a year and have had a number of flings, but I'm completely honest with them and they know that it's just a fling. When I find someone who I feel a deeper connection with, then I will exculsively be with that person.
Peace Yall!
Devin, TX.
180
I'm a little late to this conversation. Although I have a strong foot fetish, I have to agree with #5, above. About 95% of women feel the same way about that as she does and all I ask is for them to dump the guy they're dating as soon as he confesses his fetish. You're not going to change him and it's not nice for women to string them along for a string of expensive dates hinting you might give in one day when you have no intention of it. In this modern age of interwebtubes, he can easily hook up with one of those rare women who will indulge him.
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