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On Bullshit

October 9, 2008

Joe Newton

I feel ridiculous e-mailing you, but I figure that if anyone has heard of all manner of ass-hole behavior during sex, it would be you.

I'm a 17-year-old girl, and I've only had one boyfriend—who was, at the time, 21 and, I thought, perfect. The only thing that's still bothering me is the reason we broke up. After promising that he would never hurt me, and reassuring me that he was SO passionate about contraception, I agreed to have sex with him and lose my virginity. And in the middle of fucking me, he removed the condom without a word! He was hoping I wouldn't notice! I did notice—and I kicked his ass to the curb. He cried, he sent stupid gifts, and still calls. At least he didn't get me pregnant.

How upset should I be about this? Or is this something that horny males do? I'm not traumatized. I could nominate him for "Crappy Boyfriend of the Year," but surely someone else's boyfriend has done worse. I really just don't know how to feel about this.

Just Confused

How upset should you be? Very. Did you do the right thing? Absofuckinlutely.

Hell, JC, you did precisely what I would have urged you to do had I been in the room. Of course, the second-to-last thing a straight girl needs in the room with her when she's losing her virginity to some asshole straight boy is a gay man twice her age desperately trying to get out. But if I had been there, JC, and I realized what was going on, I would've stopped trying to break down your locked bedroom door long enough to give your boyfriend—aka the last thing you needed in the room that night—something to cry about for real.

You consented to intercourse with protection, and that asshole deceitfully initiated unprotected intercourse. When a fucker removes a condom during intercourse—gay or straight, vaginal or anal—it invalidates the fuckee's consent to the fucking. (And what is sex without consent, class?) So your "more experienced" boyfriend sexually assaulted you, JC, and placed you at risk of an unplanned pregnancy—and for what? An ever-so-slightly enhanced orgasm for him?

What.

An.

Asshole.

This isn't something that decent guys do at all, JC, much less "all the time." He's an abusive douchebag, and you're well rid of him. Here's hoping his next girlfriend takes proactive steps to make sure the condom stays securely on—I'd suggest staple-gunning the thing in place.


I'm a 23-year-old bi male mostly attracted to women. I have a fetish for cross-dressing, but only in private, as I live in a town—Tucson—that's small enough that I might get recognized if I went out "dressed." I'm not having any luck finding a woman interested in having a long-term relationship. I've been in a few serious relationships with women in the last few years, and all have been GGG for every kink I threw at them. But when I work up the nerve to float guy-on-guy stuff or me wearing panties, I always get "Ewww, gross!" I've tried online options to no avail. Where can I meet my dream girl who will watch me with a guy while I am wearing a skirt?

Closet Princess Seeking Princess

The women you've dated were up for every kink you "threw at them," CPSP, until you tossed out your actual kinks, the ones you care about, the ones that make your dick rock hard, and then you got ewwwgrossed every time.

Hmm.

I'll bet you're breezy, charming, and funny when the stakes are low and you're discussing kinks that aren't your own. But when it comes time to share your kinks, CPSP, I suspect you get nervous, sweaty, and tense. Because the stakes are much, much higher.

Of course, bisexuality and cross-dressing—as opposed to, say, a thing for feet or high heels (on her)—are going to be higher hurdles for most women. The former because it taps into thoroughly reasonable fears (what if you're gay and not out yet? what health risks is she running if you're out there sucking off other dudes?); the latter because for some women, seeing their boyfriends engaged in what they perceive to be thoroughly unmasculine activities—their asses panty-clad, their mouths cock-stuffed—amounts to a deal-breaking turnoff.

But there are women into your kinks, CPSP; it's just going to take more than one or two internet searches to find one. And there are women who might be willing to go there for you, if they love you enough, but you'll never know if she's the one if you shut down after that first "Ewww, gross!"


I'm a 21-year-old, good-looking, sexually active, single woman. I have never had a boyfriend, but I have many guy friends who tell me that I'm great. Is it that men don't want to date me, or is my lack of putting up with bullshit getting me into trouble?

Alone Again Unnaturally

You don't give me much to work with here, AAU. For instance, examples of the kind of bullshit you're incapable of putting up with might help. Because you know what? Some bullshit is intolerable, AAU, but there's no such thing as a bullshit-free relationship. A long-term relationship is, at its core, two people struggling to put up with each other's bullshit—day in, day out, year after year—in exchange for things intangible (love) and things tangible (sex). And why should anyone put up with your bullshit, kiddo, if you won't put up with theirs?


I saw your offer to respond to all e-mails from people who made at least a $25 donation to the fight against California's Proposition 8. I would like you to consider expanding the offer to include donations to our campaign, also. As you may know, Florida voters have been asked to approve a similar amendment here. Amendment 2 is worse, actually, as it also bans civil unions AND domestic partnerships. But we only need 40 percent of the vote to block it.

We're no joke—we've raised about $4 million and our TV ads start this week. But we need another $500,000 to push this over the top.

Derek Newton, Campaign Manager, www.sayno2.com

You're in, Derek.

The six biggest Savage Love donors to either www.noonprop8.com or www.sayno2 .com will see their letters in print, and everyone who makes a donation of at least $25 to either group—send me your donation confirmation e-mail along with your question—gets a personal reply from yours truly. The cutoff date for eligible letters is October 16. And if my readers in Canada want to play along, too, you're invited to send proof of a donation to someone, anyone, running against Stephen Harper.


mail@savagelove.net

 

Comments (186) RSS

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1
Great answer to Just Confused, Dan. The same thing happened to me when I was 16; I didn't find out until there was come spilling out all over the place, he wasn't wearing a condom, and the condom he HAD been wearing was crumpled on the bed. But I didn't have the smarts that Just Confused had. I hung onto him for another year and, luckily, got neither pregnant nor an STD. Revenge is sweet, however. Now, 35 years later, I have found out through the wonders of Facebook that he's a genuine nutcase, miserable, and totally disconnected from society. Heh.
Posted by sondari on October 7, 2008 at 10:20 PM · Report this
2
I really like your response to "Closet Princess Seeking Princess" here.

...I'm not sure what girls like this call each other most of the time, but among the girls I know, we like to call ourselves "Yaoi fangirls."

I actually like it better than maybe 'fag hag' or whichever other label we're using these days. Or maybe that's just the overly feminine gay anime men clouding my mind with delicious gay japanese porn.
Posted by Sarah on October 7, 2008 at 10:58 PM · Report this
3
I don't buy for a second that "Alone Again Unnaturally" is such a catch if she can't get a boyfriend. Any attractive 21 year old woman is going to have tons of attention from guys. She probably isn't as great as she says she is.

Her saying that she is sexually active might be a tipoff that she only goes for "hot" guys who are happy to jump in bed with her, but who think they can do better when it comes to a girlfriend.

She has "many guy friends" who tell her she is great? I wonder how many of them might be saying that just because they want her goodies.

Finally, her "lack of putting up with bullshit" makes her seem like she might just be a bitch. It might be true like you say that her "bullshit" is serious and shouldn't be put up with, or it could be that not responding to her text quickly enough is "bullshit" that will earn the guy some crazy time.

Lots of men want to use women for sex. Of course there is always a lot of ass-kissing involved. Most women have the sense to tell insincere flattery from genuine praise. Whenever I see "attractive" women who have an outwardly high opinion of themselves but who can't get a boyfriend, usually it means they buy into all this insincere flattery. So they think they are something special, when in reality they are just being manipulated while each guy takes his turn.

In short, if any girl told me what "Alone Again Unnaturally" wrote to you, it would be a huge red flag and I would run for the hills. To sum up, red flags:

1. saying she is good-looking (no humility?)

2. sexually active, single (some people might call that a slut?)

3. never had a boyfriend (by age 21?)

4. "I have many guy friends" (attractive women with all or mostly male friends almost always have terrible personalities.)

5. "who tell me that I'm great" (she is great because guy friends say so? that is her proof?)

6. "Is it that men don't want to date me?" (you mean you aren't even going on dates before the sex? wow! at least make them buy you dinner, lol. is she just a booty call?)

7. "or is my lack of putting up with bullshit" (false choice, it isn't necessarily either, but when a girl says she doesn't put up with bullshit, it usually means she is saying she has a short fuse.)
More...
Posted by kaltes on October 8, 2008 at 2:51 AM · Report this
4
As for Just Confused's ex, if they were both 17 I would say the guy might have just been young and stupid, but since he was 21 and having sex with a 17 year old after obviously bullshitting her into it, he's pretty likely a complete jackass.

If he really cared about this girl and wanted a LTR with her, he never would have done it. Something tells me that if she let him finish before dumping him instead of cutting it short, he might have been off bragging to his friends instead of crying, calling, and sending gifts.
Posted by kaltes on October 8, 2008 at 3:02 AM · Report this
5
well said, kaltes!
Posted by lux on October 8, 2008 at 3:04 AM · Report this
6
Oh man, I just *wish* I could find a nice bisexual cross-dresser in my town. Don't lose hope, Princess! There ARE girls out there looking for someone just like you.
Posted by Andy on October 8, 2008 at 4:10 AM · Report this
7
BI-guys that cross dress are so hot. I haven't found a guy willing to do either for me. If he didn't live clear across the county, I'd track him down.
Posted by PAsister on October 8, 2008 at 4:12 AM · Report this
8
Some words of encouragement for Closet Princess: I'm a straight woman happily involved with a bisexual man. Not only do I love the thought of him with another man, even masturbate to it, I loved actually watching him with another man and hope that the opportunity arises again someday.

We do exist, I promise. Just keep trying and, like Dan said, don't act like it's a huge deal. For me, and many other woman I've spoken to about it, it's not a problem but a bonus.
Posted by zippy on October 8, 2008 at 4:17 AM · Report this
9
Geez Kaltes, got some issues or what? You didn't analyze her letter; all you did was give us a peak into your angry little soul, and it's pretty dark in there isn't it? Maybe the girl just hasn't met the right guy yet is always an option.
Posted by GG1000 on October 8, 2008 at 6:05 AM · Report this
10
Crosssdressing men are so hot. I love seeing a big bulging cock in pink panties.
Posted by Eris on October 8, 2008 at 6:38 AM · Report this
11
The link for www.sayno2.com -- there's an extra space after the 2.
Posted by deborah on October 8, 2008 at 6:49 AM · Report this
12
Just to be fair, and not to condone or excuse: but is there a chance that Just Confused's condom-removing asshole bf was going for the money shot? She doesn't say he re-inserted his dick. And she does volunteer a lack of expertise and experience. Maybe he was intending to cum on her. Just a thought.
Posted by sapien on October 8, 2008 at 6:53 AM · Report this
13
GG1000 -- I've met the woman Kaltes is talking about and he/she's right. Good looking 21 yo girls shouldn't have too much of a problem finding a boyfriend. The letter screamed HIGH MAINTENANCE to me too, partly because of it's "all you need to know is: 1)I'm hot 2)I'm cool and 3)I don't put up with anything" attitude.
Posted by Lalas on October 8, 2008 at 7:23 AM · Report this
14
P.S. If Princess is looking for a woman who'll appreciate a bi guy, he should get himself involved in Fandom (not...related to domination in any way way, for those not in the know), especially slash fandom. He won't meet a girl who DOESN'T want a bisexual boyfriend.
Posted by Andy on October 8, 2008 at 7:27 AM · Report this
15
Goddamn, this crossdressing bi boy is moving to Seattle if things dont work out here at home :D
Posted by Dawn on October 8, 2008 at 7:31 AM · Report this
16
What's Stephen Harper got in his platform against homosexuals? As far as I know, he isn't changing anything.
Posted by someCanadian on October 8, 2008 at 7:38 AM · Report this
17
Amen to what GG1000 said about Kaltes! We just read the same letter and response that you did. Do we need your ugly, judgemental and somewhat wrong spewing to help us understand it better?
Posted by humpytribade on October 8, 2008 at 7:51 AM · Report this
18
Thank you so much for including the Canadian election. I think it's very important that we don't get complacent about Stephen Harper up here.

I donated $25 to a non-conservative party just the other day. You're already getting plenty of emails, I'm sure, and I don't have anything in particular I have to ask you, so I won't claim my privileges.

But still, thanks.
Posted by MichelleZB on October 8, 2008 at 8:42 AM · Report this
19
I suppose we've reached the point where all those little yaoi fangirls I remember have grown up into "adults"; but I'd be hesitant to suggest it. I think a lot of them would find the IDEA of a bisexual boyfriend [and one who crossdresses!] only appealing, not something they're ready to commit to. As the queerer of us into slash and yaoi always point out: a LOT of yaoi is just heterosexual smut with an extra penis, the uke tends to look and act like a girl, and I think more girls really relate to the uke-chracter and desire the seme-character, than the other way around. Sure sure, there's some out there, and I guess we could say there's a lot of girls with a "gay fetish", I just don't want to see it suggested like it's a failsafe.
Princess, and others like him, sure, get into yaoi/slash, show up to some cons, put your ass out there; but don't limit yourself or think that the ladies you find there are made of sterner stuff.
Posted by AJ on October 8, 2008 at 8:48 AM · Report this
20
As a CA resident, I am pretty confident that Prop H8 will die a horrible demise. But getting to help the fight in another state AND getting a reply from Dan? Sign me up for that!
Posted by Lavode on October 8, 2008 at 9:13 AM · Report this
21
A note to the closet princess: As tacky as it may be, you might want to consider checking out any local Rocky Horror nights. My own penchant for boy-on-boy action and boys in panties was first awoken by the beauty of Tim Curry. The princess needs a queer girl who likes cock.
Posted by Kiss my husband on October 8, 2008 at 9:17 AM · Report this
22
Closet Princess, don't give up on finding the right girl for you. We are out there. I can't help with where to find us because I met my husband in college and had never even thought about it till he started feeling around to see how I felt about it. Some of us may not give stuff like that a second thought but will love it just because it's you.
Posted by Anon on October 8, 2008 at 10:07 AM · Report this
23
Closet Princess Seeking Princess,

Ease a woman into it. Playfully grab her bra and panties, put them on, and then "model" for her. If she responds positively, then start another game, like "If We Had a Threesome, Who of the Same Sex Would You Pick and Why Are They Hot?"

Try the online personals like Craigslist. I met a man who is into a certain fetish that I like, too. Turns out I like him for more than just the sex! If you phrase it, "I'm looking for new friends who are into XYZ. Let's talk and meet in public first...", it takes the edge off of "looking for sex." Its like setting up an adult "play date!" LOL I'm in my 30's. I wish I had figured this out at 23!
Posted by MJ on October 8, 2008 at 10:10 AM · Report this
24
Thank you for extending the offer to Canadians donating to anyone other than Harper. I'm still afraid that the non-Conservative vote will be split between the Liberals and the NDP thus putting the Conservatives back in power, but it's better to have them in power on a short leash than in power with a majority.
Posted by prenks on October 8, 2008 at 10:12 AM · Report this
25
Actually, kaltes, she might be clueless that her male friends are hitting on her. Some guys are too subtle for clueless girls [like me]. I generally have to depend on my girlfriends to tell me, "He is totally in to you". I just think the guy is being friendly.

Or maybe I should call it "Thick-Skinned" as my friends do. I have accepted my what-ever-it-is, it sure helps me in the workplace when I'm around total misogynists [I work in construction] - I know that the idiots are being mean and why, but it doesn't upset me.

And as for the letter-writer, she might want to confide in her best male buds that she's a little "confused" about dating guys. She might even want to start looking at them as datable partners and ask one of them if they'd go on a "Test Date" with her [her treat] to see if she's socially awkward. If they accept, then yeah, they are probably into her. If they refuse, then they can still be friends. The best relationships start out as friends, in my opinion.
Posted by schweighsr on October 8, 2008 at 10:14 AM · Report this
26
I think Kaltes has it mostly spot on, except for a little sympathy and benefit of a doubt for poor AAU
Posted by saraphonic on October 8, 2008 at 10:24 AM · Report this
27
I could be just what Closet Princess is looking for!
Posted by Blackwood on October 8, 2008 at 10:26 AM · Report this
28
i too am a woman happily in love with a bisexual man. life is good. don't give up... she's out there somewhere!
Posted by Anna on October 8, 2008 at 10:41 AM · Report this
29
Wow, kaltes, thanks for the rant. It's telling that a three-line email was able to inspire so much anger and venom in you.

You're wrong, you know. A few years ago, it could have been me writing AAU's email, and I wasn't high-maintenance or bitchy. I was inexperienced and a little tightly wound, which led to awkwardness and an inability to get dates. I just needed to learn how to relax, flirt, and find the fun. Plenty of decent people start dating after 21 (and plenty of decent women have male friends). Ease off the judgment, will ya?
Posted by Mary in DC on October 8, 2008 at 10:43 AM · Report this
30
The link to www.sayno2.com above has an extra space in it, so the link's broken. Can't you be more careful about this, Dan? It seems like it happens way too often.
Posted by Heron on October 8, 2008 at 10:48 AM · Report this
31
kaltes is right. Those who slam kaltes should probably be avoided as partners, as they are no better than AAU.
Posted by welcomerain on October 8, 2008 at 11:06 AM · Report this
32
To Just Confused:

What you did was great. It showed courage, a healthy self esteem and self belief. Don't doubt what you did was right.
Posted by david on October 8, 2008 at 11:19 AM · Report this
33
To Just Confused:

What you did was great. It showed courage, a healthy self esteem and self belief. Don't doubt what you did was right.
Posted by david on October 8, 2008 at 11:19 AM · Report this
34
Gals,

I'm a bisexual cross-dresser myself. When is the best time to tell you? Before we ever have sex? Sometime after? Once the relationship is started?

Posted by M on October 8, 2008 at 11:36 AM · Report this
35
Sapien, even if you assume hypothetically that the guy wasn't a selfish douchebag who was about to ram it right back into her, and to hell with her right to know if she's having unprotected sex, I still think that a girl nice enough to sleep with you REALLY deserves to be told that you're going to money-shot onto her. That's one of those things I'd say sure, knock yourself out if asked beforehand, but would not be happy to be surprised with.
Posted by cattheotherwhitemeat@gmail.com on October 8, 2008 at 11:50 AM · Report this
36
There are a lot of girls who are into cross dressers and bi guys. I'm straight as a pin, and I love watching two hot, muscley guys go at it. (In fact, I remain confused about why it's OK for straight guys to love watching lesbians, but women are supposed to think gay love is gross. Not even!) I think most women, particularly in places like Arizona, just buy into what they're "supposed" to like without really thinking about it. It's kind of a knee-jerk thing. Also, maybe they weren't ever in a gymnastics class with a beautiful gay Ukranian gymnast whose boyfriend was equally gorgeous... *Swoon*

Cross dressing, too, if done right, is absurdly hot. It's just that, as hard as it is to find a great partner in general, it's just that much harder to find someone who happens to share your kinks. Keep searching, stay cool, and live well. Hopefully it'll all fall into place.
Posted by Pamela on October 8, 2008 at 11:50 AM · Report this
37
Well done, Confused. Same thing happened to me once. The only thing I regret is not using the tiger claw technique we'd been practicing in the martial arts class I was taking at the time on the little shit. A couple of scars might have deterred him from trying it on some other guy.
Posted by usagi on October 8, 2008 at 11:52 AM · Report this
38
Thank You, Dan! Thank you for including Canada, and thank you for showing your support for anything anti-Harper! Canada loves you.
Posted by NutMeg on October 8, 2008 at 11:54 AM · Report this
39
Closet Princess Seeking Princess:

http://yaoi.y-gallery.net/
Posted by Melissa on October 8, 2008 at 12:27 PM · Report this
40
I think kaltes and welcomerain are being unfair to AAU. Dan's response went as far as her letter justified. Could she be an asshole? Sure. She might just as easily be clueless or insecure (what, only guys can overcompensate?) - or she could just be at a college with a lousy dating scene. I went to a school where there was virtually NO dating - you started a relationship during freshman week and stayed with that person until graduation, or you casually hooked up with someone for a week or two, or you didn't date.

Am I projecting my own experiences onto her letter? Sure. But at least I admit it.
Posted by Sybylla on October 8, 2008 at 12:29 PM · Report this
41
CPSP- I'd watch you.
Posted by squeeks on October 8, 2008 at 1:02 PM · Report this
42
I've always been into watching men get it on . . . only had the opportunity with someone I was dating once or twice, but it's a big fantasy. As to the cross-dressing? I would have said I wasn't into it, but with a man I love (who, incidentally, had a great ass), seeing him in my panties and silky skirts is a major turn-on. I think just the fact that it makes him so happy makes me happy too. So yeah, women who love this exist, but so do women who would say they don't, until the right man shows up in silk panties, fishnets, a raging hard-on, and a smile . . .
Posted by anathema on October 8, 2008 at 1:14 PM · Report this
43
hey kaltes, she said she's good-looking, not drop dead gorgeous and all my friends are great - at least to me... ;-) listen up, alone again: i was also a good-looking 20 yr. old girl with one one night-stand and never a relationship, when I met my first boyfriend. 9 years later, we are still happy together, now married with a kid. and yes, i have a really crappy taste in music (death grunts, anybody?) while he's the ultimate geek. so what, i found out that pc games and dnd are lots of fun.
Posted by ylene on October 8, 2008 at 1:34 PM · Report this
44
I agree with Mary in DC. I could have been AAU when I was 21, except that I'd had ONE real boyfriend when I was 19. After him and until I was 23, I just didn't meet anyone I connected with strongly enough, both emotionally and sexually, for a real relationship. I also went to a small, predominantly female university and was in a very predominantly female faculty. When those things changed, so did my love life.
Posted by bluebutterflygirl on October 8, 2008 at 1:35 PM · Report this
45
I would only suggest checking out yaoi fangirls if you have a strong tolerance for socially awkward nerdy girls.
Posted by Natey Abes! on October 8, 2008 at 2:02 PM · Report this
46
Dan's answer to Confused was spot on with one glaring exception - if she has not already done so she should go and get herself tested for STDs. It is surprisingly easy for women to catch sexually transmitted infections. Jump on it, girl! Otherwise, great advice from Dan!
Posted by Smart Girl on October 8, 2008 at 2:29 PM · Report this
47
GG101, Kaltes was referring to the asshole who took the condom off, not to the woman having trouble finding a boyfriend.
Posted by 2.5 cats on October 8, 2008 at 3:28 PM · Report this
48
Christ Kaltes, get over yourself - and maybe get a girlfriend or a hobby, or something.
Posted by Grifter on October 8, 2008 at 3:36 PM · Report this
49
Confused, you ROCK! I would never have had the metaphorical balls to do that at your age.

Speaking of being much younger, here's another woman who totally relates to AAU. I couldn't seem to sustain a relationship more than 3 weeks for a very long time. Eventually I learned to date more mature guys (and gained some maturity myself) and things started to click.

But, AAU, if you are having casual sex (safely, I hope) because you have a healthy body image and strong libido, more power to you. BUT - if you are having sex because you think it will get you a boyfriend, please rethink. Most of what you will get are nasty hypocritical jerks like Kaltes.
Posted by AlabamaGal on October 8, 2008 at 4:10 PM · Report this
50
Hi CSPS, I am a girl who is not adverse to your kinks so just keep looking. Of course I also have a few of my own that are usually deal breakers too. Ashland, Oregon isn't that big either.
Posted by Azurus on October 8, 2008 at 4:41 PM · Report this
51
All I can say is, while my post was definitely a 'rant', I did not pass definitive judgment, instead pointing out red flags, of which single flags might not be too alarming, but taken together don't paint a pretty picture. She could be a very unlucky great catch, and maybe she is, but it just isn't too likely.

For a girl to be 21, attractive, and so unable to get dates/boyfriends that she is lonely, yet she is sexually active, there is a serious disconnect there. It just doesn't add up. You could either believe that the problem is with the entire male gender, or with her. Which is more likely?

Women who fail at dating have a habit of blaming men instead of taking responsibility themselves.

If a woman wants a fuck buddy, have fun. However, when a woman is clearly unhappy and lonely, and she wants a boyfriend, the fact that she is able to get sex partners but not boyfriends is a major tip off. Men might sleep with anything, but they won't commit to anything. If she wants a BF, can't get a BF, but has sex partners, that tells me she wants more from the guys she sleeps with, but gets rejected. Why? I don't know. Like I said, I can only point out red flags, I can't conclusively say what is wrong with her, only that something probably is.

Posted by kaltes on October 8, 2008 at 5:04 PM · Report this
52
Oh man, I /am/ AAU, practically...

Except I'd have to throw in there the fact that I've come to /know/ I'm picky about guys. I do like guys who are hot, and friendly, and genuine, and interesting, and well, the whole package... That doesn't make me an a-hole -plenty of guys are picky about who they'll commit too.

So sometimes (ok, a lot) I go around grouchy feeling like nobody likes me. But then I remember I'm not interested in plenty of boys at my school, including some of the ones who've been interested in me.

The whole idea about how good-looking girls have boys all over them is nuts though. Sorry. Maybe "total babes" have boys all over them. But I'd say those of us who are merely "above average" have to work as hard to meet someone as the boys do.

Add to that some bad past experiences with guys I've hooked up w/, and the fact I'm more cautious now might make it harder to meet people too.

Good to know many of you have been in AAU's place and feel you're better off now. That gives me some hope, at least...
Posted by em on October 8, 2008 at 5:26 PM · Report this
53
There are about 800 million girls out there that find guy-on-guy action hot (slash communities, for instance), and they are mostly all on the internet. It's seriously not that hard to find one that you could hit it off with, though you might just have to expand your search outside of Tucson. And also be fit, because there is a big difference, sadly, between a hot guy in some pink, frilly panties and a fat, hairy guy desecrating said pink, frilly panties.
Posted by emag on October 8, 2008 at 5:51 PM · Report this
54
Crosssdressing men are so hot. I love seeing a big bulging cock in pink panties.

Second this.
Posted by VDD on October 8, 2008 at 6:03 PM · Report this
55
Thanks Dan, for adding the donation to anyone running against Stephen Harper to the offer!
Posted by Canadian against Harper on October 8, 2008 at 6:06 PM · Report this
56
Kaltes, chill the fuck out. Stop projecting all your insecurities onto this poor girl. When I was 21 years old, I hadn't had a boyfriend either--and it wasn't because I was ugly, insecure, or a "slut" (fuck you, by the way, for that assessment), but simply because I wasn't ready. Even though I felt ready. Everyone goes through this--some of us bloom later than others. Maybe you'd have better luck with women if you stopped acting like a giant asshole, eh?
Posted by Shannon Murphy on October 8, 2008 at 6:54 PM · Report this
57
"1. saying she is good-looking (no humility?)"

Geez, is she allowed to have any self-esteem? You aren't going to get a boyfriend by thinking you're the least unattractive person alive, either. If you don't think you're good looking, why should anyone else?
Posted by Nicole on October 8, 2008 at 7:14 PM · Report this
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Lay off, Kaltes. Your assumptions about this poor girl are most likely way off base.

There is nothing wrong with honestly assessing your attractiveness. I also don't see the big deal with having mostly male friends. Most of my friends are male, (I also have a boyfriend of 3 years) and I don't consider my personality to be particularly atrocious either. I prefer male friends simply because my experiences with bitchy women such as yourself turn me off to female friendships.
Posted by Ashley on October 8, 2008 at 8:12 PM · Report this
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Ashley, do you think Kaltes is female? See, I'd thought Kaltes was male...
Posted by em on October 8, 2008 at 8:29 PM · Report this
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Wow, Kaltes. You're a real douche. Here's hoping you get the humble Guardian of Sexual Virtue doormat you deserve.

You might want to watch them blanket statements, misogyny and, well, idiocy. You do know where you're posting, right?

Posted by KDot on October 8, 2008 at 9:12 PM · Report this
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Wow. I really, really wish people would drop the word "slut" from the English language, just so people would stop using it so freely. Also, women aren't allowed to have multiple male friends, or they probably have "terrible personalities"? Just...just WHAT?

I'm not saying AAU is some perfect little princess who has no responsibility for her lack of a boyfriend. She probably does have some issues, e.g. unclear communication (as evidenced by her letter). But I am saying that generalizations like the ones Kaltes made are just as unfair as blaming all men for one's own personal dating problems.
Posted by Sarah on October 8, 2008 at 9:22 PM · Report this
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I hate feminine guys in general (if I wanted to date a female I'd go be a lesbian), but the term "face stuffed with cock" when applied to my bf is makin me have some second thoughts. UH.

Kaltes is an extremely feminine guy, someone needs to go stuff a cock in his mouth. I agree with like half of the stuff he says but DAMN that's a wordy way to say "slut", and he puts even the most talkative females I know to absolute shame.
Posted by Emmi on October 8, 2008 at 10:15 PM · Report this
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I'm with GG1000 here. Don't spew your anger here, and anyway, isn't this the last page in the world to judge someone for being a slut? Either you're not paying attention or you're a Savage Love newbie. Good girls get some, too.

I have a theory, anyway, that the hottest of people generally have trouble finding relationships when they're younger, either because people in their early 20s are total assholes (possibly "Alone Again" as well, though most people do grow out of it) or because the really quality guys in their early 20s assume that the hot ones are out of their league. It happened to me, and at 26, the only thing standing in the way of a relationship now is my own fear of commitment. Either I got less hot, or the nice guys have finally realized that treating a woman like a human being is every bit as much a turn-on, in some cases more so, than washboard abs. Though I won't turn those down either.

Hang in there, Alone Again. It gets better.
Posted by tallnlovelynggg on October 8, 2008 at 10:28 PM · Report this
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kaltes you sound like a living in the dark ages asshole. women that are sexually active and not in a relationship are sluts? everyone should have had a boyfriend by 21?
at least let them buy you dinner before you put out? some people have evolved a little since those times, everyones lives do not follow the same rules and its ok to wonder why your not meeting the right guy..
and not all male friends are just there because they want to fuck you, you sound so clueless.
Posted by B.B. on October 8, 2008 at 11:11 PM · Report this
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AAU, if she's having all those problems and is sexually active just needs to maybe ask one or several of the guys she can't date (but have sex with) why they won't be her boyfriend. It's a rather easy question with mixed results. It's good to get a postmortem sometimes. Seriously, no judgment here, but she may be doing SOMETHING REALLY (maybe her room is too messy, or she has 45 cats who knows!) obvious to make them scurry away.
Posted by canard on October 9, 2008 at 12:28 AM · Report this
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i somehow misread alone again unnaturally as saying that she had many gay friends that said she was great and i instantly thought she was chubby. sorry to not contribute anything of value to the discussion.
Posted by random canadian on October 9, 2008 at 12:33 AM · Report this
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@ Alone Again Unnaturally
I'm also 21, I've only ever had one boyfriend, but have always had lots of guy friends-
I finally had the guts to ask a really good guy friend from high school why no one was ever into me--
he said I was incredible, intimidating- that I was so confident that they were afraid I'd just shoot them down. Maybe that's it?
(I wouldn't have shot them down, I was so lonely I probably would have fucked any of them. They had no idea.)
Posted by If only you'd known I'd've... on October 9, 2008 at 12:36 AM · Report this
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To Closet Princess Seeking Princess
There are lots of us out there who love our Bi men. And the cross-dressing is fun especially if you wear the same size as your chick. it is like getting additions to your wardrobe you can "borrow". You know if he is cool on the sharing. Keep the hope alive sweetie and just be positive and stop thinking of it as a kink, I hate that word. It is normal for you and thats all that matters.
Posted by Kay on October 9, 2008 at 5:04 AM · Report this
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while he is a bit of a cock, i feel kaltes makes some valid points
Posted by breakfast on October 9, 2008 at 5:59 AM · Report this
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Sarah and others have beat me to it, but I'd also suggest CPSP look into the prospect of yaoi or slash scenes -- with AJ's caveat: Don't ever treat the online fannish communities as a hook-up forum, because that's sure to get anybody's ass kicked to the curb fast.

Yaoists, boyslove (BL) enthusiasts and slashers are all used to their space being predominantly female, homosocial and hetero, a safe haven for closeted women, if you will, to explore their sexual agentivity in all its pornographic glory. So bi girls and boys alike ought to keep in mind, when they happen to turn their attention from fantasy to RL, that many of the fans are in it just for the fantasy. Getting that wrong not only annoys, but threatens something fundamental to many in the community. And if you don't share the fantasy to begin with? Forget finding yourself a friend, let alone a potential girlfriend.

So if I were CPSP I'd try watching some commercial yaoi anime porn online, or reading some gender-bender slash stories, to see if any of the genres out there gets me genuinely interested.
Posted by Sophie on October 9, 2008 at 6:05 AM · Report this
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I think Kaltes is on the money about AAU. I've known quite a few women who are completely obnoxious and would have said all the same things, except instead of "never had a boyfriend" they would have said something more like "men are all pigs." While I don't think it was fair to criticize being sexually active without being in a relationship, she probably could stand to act more conservative to net herself a relationship beyond booty call.
Posted by falconswan on October 9, 2008 at 8:20 AM · Report this
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To the princess in Tucson, yes, there are tons of people out there who think that bi boys who like to crossdress and femmeboys of all stripes are really, really hot. Most of them, at least where I live, are queer-identified or bi women, and many of them are genderqueers. If there is any sort of bi network in Tucson, that would be a great place to start. The nice thing about this community is that none of them will view bisexuality or crossdressing as a kink; it's just who you are.
Posted by glitterbomb on October 9, 2008 at 8:21 AM · Report this
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Princess, don't lose hope and don't get down on yourself. There are girls that find it attractive. I think it's such a hot idea. A guy and another guy with one in a dress. Yummy! Keep looking, you'll find your girl!
Posted by Princess Charming on October 9, 2008 at 9:11 AM · Report this
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I sense that Kaltes is upset because he feels unnatractive and not like one of the "hot" guys he thinks AAU goes for..
Posted by Rosco's Chicken on October 9, 2008 at 9:30 AM · Report this
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Wow Kaltes, you have some serious issues going on there.

1. Why do you assume the girl is conceited simply because she describes herself as good-looking? A very high percentage of women have body issues; I think we should encourage young women who consider themselves attractive. It's not like she said something like "I'm just too attractive for all of the men I meet."

2. I don't even know where to start here...a sexually active 21-year-old woman is a slut by your definition? Would you say the same about a sexually active 21-year-old guy? "Sexually active" does not necessarily a slut make.

3. I had my first boyfriend at age 22. I know some people who started even later. It doesn't make us freaks...some people just have a harder time finding the right person.

4. Again, angry much? Pretty broad (and unfair) generalization, don't you think?

5. So she can't compliment herself, and she can't repeat her friends' compliments? What CAN she say that you won't pick on: "I'm an ugly person with a terrible personality"?

6. She may have meant over the longer term. I think it's safe to assume she has gone on actual dates.

7. Sure, mentioning a low BS tolerance level could mean that she has a prickly demeanor...but it could also mean exactly what it says. There are some supreme bullshitters out there (but some wonderful men as well!), and it wouldn't surprise me if you were one of them, Kaltes.
Posted by Jess on October 9, 2008 at 9:41 AM · Report this
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"the really quality guys in their early 20s assume that the hot ones are out of their league"

THIS. My fiancé told me that when he first saw me he thought I was WAY out of his league, and he mostly started flirting with me as a joke because he thought he'd never have a chance. Little did he know...

This, the best relationship I've ever had (among a 4-year, a 2-year, and several ~1-year relationships) started with an all-night-long fuckfest with emotional undertones so intense they completely caught both of us off guard. There was certainly no dinner out, just a long history of flirting and a little intoxication. Sometimes it really is a matter of waiting for the right person to come along.

I just HAVE to respond to a couple things kaltes said, though.

>4. "I have many guy friends" (attractive women with all or mostly male friends almost always have terrible personalities.)<

This is flat-out untrue. They could've been the "ugly duckling" who didn't fit in with the other girls early on yet grew up gorgeous; they could just have more stereotypically male interests. God knows I rarely if ever meet other women who are competitive enough to be fun to game with, let alone ones who happen to be attractive.

5. "who tell me that I'm great" (she is great because guy friends say so? that is her proof?)

Who's she going to take at their word - them or you? Is it inevitably insincere when I tell one of my guy friends "holy shit, you look GREAT tonight, you are SO going to get laid" or when they make joking threats if my fiancé were ever to hurt me?

Maybe my difference in opinion here is because I see friendship as something much deeper than mere acquaintance.

AAU sounds like she's probably just still harboring a little bit of awkwardness from her teenage years, or trying too hard. She sounds like she's got middling self-esteem and is trying her damnedest to get that up. I wouldn't call patience a virtue, exactly, but it's damn useful sometimes.
More...
Posted by elly on October 9, 2008 at 10:02 AM · Report this
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Well said, GG1000. How can anyone, in 2008, call a girl a slut because she's sexually active at 21? It looks like Kaltes has got some serious issues with women who take charge of their sexuality.

Alone Again Unnaturally is 21, which is pretty young. I've been told I'm a reasonably attractive man, but I never had a boyfriend until I was 25. Hey, I could hardly get anyone to look at me except dirty old men. All the guys I slept with before then (who weren't that many, I must admit) told me I was the best lover they'd ever had, but they didn't stick around. Why? Maybe they were lying, or maybe it's because I didn't really like myself and I used arrogance as a defense mechanism to hide the fact that I wasn't comfortable in my own skin. Once I got over my hang-ups and gained some real self-confidence, everything went great. In time she'll find out herself what's pushing potential BFs away (if there is something to find out), but as far as I can see, her only real problem is that she seems to expect guys to love her, and that's a major turn-off to many.

A guy who says to a girl that she's great but who won't go out with her is a guy who's happy to have a female friend and fuck buddy without all the relationship trouble. It doesn't say anything about the girl. She just needs to wait until she finds a guy who wants a relationship. As Salman Rushdie once wrote (in Shame): "life is long." Be patient.
Posted by Ricardo on October 9, 2008 at 10:17 AM · Report this
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Tucson is small enough he might get recognized?? He's not trying hard enough.
Posted by BaltoBabe on October 9, 2008 at 10:25 AM · Report this
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In Kaltes defense...

The slut commentary aside (we all have our slutty phases, nothing wrong with it), there is a definite personality archetype similar to the one he describes: relatively attractive, self-absorbed, and inclined to fuel their ego by collecting male "friends" who have no chance but go through the courtship rituals on futile hope. I have slept with a couple of girls like this in lonelier times, and there's no way I would date them then or now. They are simply too insecure and narcissistic, generally owing to their only redeeming feature is being physically attractive enough to warrant a one-nighter, generally paired with a pointed lack of life experience or intelligence. Not saying AAU is one of these personalities, but it's fairly evident they exist, in my experience, prevalently across the US, and that is the personality I believe Kaltes was describing. I'll also add that less attractive, but genuine, interesting, and worldly girls seldom want for a committed relationship from what I've seen (and who I'm inclined to date).
Posted by dudewiththeface on October 9, 2008 at 11:20 AM · Report this
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Closet Princess Seeking Princess is probably looking at the wrong type of girls in Tucson. Tucson is a college town of about 1M people, and about half of the cute girls are college students. They're also mostly very vanilla, inexperienced California girls.

He needs to avoid college bars like Maloney's and hang out in the spicier, local places like the Surly Wench, and to go to the many, many burlesque shows in town (such as Boys-R-Us).

Even if he doesn't find someone immediately, there's a lot of friends to be made that are comfortable with flings into fairyville, and that's where most people will find that special anybody - through a group of like-minded people.
Posted by impulsenine on October 9, 2008 at 11:25 AM · Report this
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of about 1M people, and about half of the cute girls are college students. They're also mostly very vanilla, inexperienced California girls.

He needs to avoid college bars like Maloney's and hang out in the spicier, local places like the Surly Wench, and to go to the many, many burlesque shows in town (such as Boys-R-Us).

Even if he doesn't find someone immediately, there's a lot of friends to be made that are comfortable with flings into fairyville, and that's where most people will find that special anybody - through a group of like-minded people.
Posted by impulsenine on October 9, 2008 at 11:26 AM · Report this
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The word (slut) should never be used, what rite doe's any one have to pass jugement on some one for enjoying sex with more than one partner.
Posted by Joe on October 9, 2008 at 11:51 AM · Report this
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For Just Confused, Dan is right, you did exactly the right thing when you kicked his butt out of your life.
Something similar happened to me a few years ago, and I felt confused as well; I couldn't reconcile his obviously deceitful and dangerous behaviour with what I wanted to believe about him. I had been very clear about my condom requirement, we used one, and suddenly it wasn't on his dick anymore! I was terribly upset for weeks after, then I let it go and went out with him a few more times until he ditched me and broke my heart.
Years later I found out he caught something from a girl with whom he had an unprotected evening with and I can't help but laugh a little.
Is there a way you could charge him with statutory rape? He may not have learned his lesson, and continue to target trusting virgins like you were.
Posted by knowbetternow on October 9, 2008 at 11:58 AM · Report this
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Advice for AAU: if you are waiting around for guys to ask you out or move from hookups to relationships, try asking yourself. You sound confident, and most guys are not going to reject a confident, attractive young woman. The comments above mentioning people being intimidated by others they consider out of their league are spot on in my experience - people are TERRIBLE at estimating "leagues," and sometimes someone just needs to get over the nerves and make a move.
Posted by lilyldr on October 9, 2008 at 1:41 PM · Report this
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I agree with you kaltes on one point; AAU seems a bit overreactive. At 21 AAU it is not the time to panic. I'm 27 with no history of boyfriends and a lot of guy friends who love to dote. If you're like me you don't count a couple of dates as a boyfriend and don't fall for just any guy in a bar. You're plenty young and don't need to worry about having a serious relationship. I believe Dan will agree that getting your rocks off without commitment is perfectly "fun" (especially this early in the game).
Kaltes, sheesh! Lay off the girl. She's not the one that turned you down last week.
Posted by kittyclitty on October 9, 2008 at 3:37 PM · Report this
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A big bunch of kudos to lilyldr for saying exactly what I was hoping to read here. There are a ton of guys who aren't the swaggering macho type (in terms of confidence), and are really hoping that a girl like AAU will make the first move. The man of her dreams could be hanging around with her every night, and be too self-conscious to find out if she'd be interested.
Posted by Resident Weevil on October 9, 2008 at 3:47 PM · Report this
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I am so sorry JC! What a major bummer for your first time. My heart goes out to you. I hope you receive whatever love and tenderness you need to cushion you from not having been treasured. If this helps, I'm a 30 year old female, and sex has been getting consistently more real and more enjoyable with time, experience, and self-understanding, which you seem to have a great dose of.
Posted by SKC on October 9, 2008 at 3:53 PM · Report this
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I just want to say I'm so sorry about what happened to you, Just Confused. You were deceived and assaulted while losing your virginity. I'm so sorry. He is an asshole and truly should have his dick chopped off, for letting a young, inexperienced woman give herself to him, and then disrespecting her by assaulting her and risking pregnancy. HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE PERSON. I just want to say I lost my virginity in a similar way and it took me a long time to recover, but I did, and there were sweet, wonderful men in my future.

Good for you for sticking up for yourself. I didn't. You're mature for your age. Keep demanding the respect you deserve, until you find a man who gives it to you.

As for the guy you kicked to the curb... let him cry. Enjoy it, if you can. Never sugar-coat the truth to him, of what a douche he is and how he fucking left a huge wad of shit in your memory, but you're moving right on. What a narcissistic baby. Part of the reason he's crying, you should know, is that he no longer controls you. he thought he was in control. The longer he cries, congratulate yourself on teaching him the lesson he deserves and needs. Good luck!
Posted by delta on October 9, 2008 at 4:38 PM · Report this
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1. to em:

Yes, being "too picky" is one reason a girl can be attractive and yet hopelessly single. Another way to say this is that a girl like that is hoping to get lucky by meeting a guy who for some strange reason will settle for her. When you say "hot, and friendly, and genuine, and interesting, and well, the whole package..." yet you admit you are only an "above-average" girl, I think you are just being greedy, and you deserve to be single. Men care even more about looks than women, so an above average looking girl holding out for a committment from a hot man is bound to stay single.

Sometimes women need to understand that a lot of men who wouldn't give them a second glance if they were looking for a girlfriend, would nonetheless be happy to hook up with them. I know "hot" guys with great looking girlfriends who cheat with "above average" or even average girls! When girls get big heads thanks to sleeping with guys who are out of their relationship league, they get a big gap between what they want and what they're offering.

2. to Shannon Murphy:

I don't need any more luck with women. I do just fine, thank you. Maybe you weren't ready 21, but AAU clearly has been ready, which is why she is distressed enough to mail in to Savage Love.

3. to Nicole:

I didn't say she had no humility, I pointed out a red flag. It is possible that she is SMOKIN HOT and being modest, but people who toot their own horn which she did repeatedly, often aren't that great. A red flag is a warning, not a final judgment. It means there MIGHT be a problem. Dan eviscerated a guy who wrote a similar letter some time ago, basically calling the guy an asshole. You women probably cheered Dan on for that one.

4. to Ashley:

Well when people are writing to an advice columnist who publishes the letter and advice publicly, they are inviting judgments and observations from the public.

I've met a few women who don't have female friends. I could pretty well put these women into two groups: tomboys and bitches. When I see women accusing other women of being catty, drama, or bitchy, it usually means the accuser is the one causing it, because she is the common factor. There are rare exceptions, as always.

5. to KDot:

You make me laugh. Girl power! ;)

6. to Sarah:

Women who let themselves be used for sex when they want something more might be called sluts by men depending on the number of different men involved. Women who are happily have sex with no strings and no regrets are not sluts to men, but plenty of other women would certainly call them that.

Also, learn to read. I wrote "attractive women with all or mostly male friends" not "multiple" male friends, which isn't unusual at all. I should have said "all or nearly all" though.

7. to tallnlovelynggg:

"Don't spew your anger here"? Good advice, I wonder if all the women spewing anger over my post would follow it? LOL, yeah right!

8. to B.B.:

Everything you wrote is called a "straw man" argument. Look it up. Basically you changed the substance of everything I wrote to make it seem retarded. Good job.

9. to breakfast:

Haha that was a good one. ;)

10. to falconswan:

Well I am not critical of any woman being sexually active without relationships if that is what she likes, far from it, I'd be happy to encourage more of it! Put female viagra in the water supply and knock Dan off his high horse about all the fun gay men get to have that straight men only dream about.

But when you have a woman who is settling for less than what she wants and is unhappy as a result, that is a problem for her.

11. to Rosco's Chicken:

There is no way to know how "hot" AAU rates, or where her hotness cut-off is. Maybe she would f*ck me, maybe not, but I wouldn't f*ck her. I'm certainly not jealous of the men she sleeps with, though. I don't use women for sex, and I wouldn't care if a woman like AAU "rejected" me because I wouldn't touch her with a 10 foot pole to begin with.

12. to Jess:

I didn't assume anything, I just pointed out possibilities. Didn't call anyone a slut, let alone a freak. Some women start late, and good for them, but they don't write in to Savage Love complaining that they can't get a man.

I'm not angry at all, actually. There isn't any hostility in anything I've written, unlike many of those who responded to me, including you. Thanks for the personal attack, Jess! ;)

13. to elly:

Yep, sometimes random hookups can turn into serious relationships. Probably not the BEST way to look for a LTR, but it can happen. It is certainly more fun than sexless dating.

I stand by the "women with all male friends" red flag, as it is well known and well justified. I didn't get into details about it, but yes there is a "tomboy" exception, and while it holds true in general, hence the red flag, there are always exceptions.

14. to dudewiththeface:

I don't think she is the type you mention, which I agree exists because I know a few, because those girls who keep male hangers-on around are strong and manipulative. I don't think AAU is either. I think she is the one who gets manipulated, which is why she put in the defensive "not putting up with bullshit" line.

15. to kittyclitty:

I don't have to worry about girls turning me down, but in a more interesting side-note, you seem to fit in the "type" that dudewiththeface mentioned. A lot of guy friends who dote? Fits the bill.
More...
Posted by kaltes on October 9, 2008 at 6:13 PM · Report this
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to CPSP:

cross-dressing men with male-on-male interests are completely sexy!! and there are other women out there who will agree with me. tucson has a great alternative scene, with some equally kinky or GGG girls. don't be discouraged, just have some patience and the right resources to find what you want.
Posted by words of encouragement on October 9, 2008 at 7:01 PM · Report this
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Kaltes-
I feel insulted by some of the points in your various posts, as I'm sure AAU does as well. Do not discount the possibility that AAU is simply a confident, attractive woman who men feel intimidated by.

I am an attractive woman. In my late teens, I went through a phase where I had a number of short flings. Most of my friends are male, and they all think I'm absolutely wonderful. I didn't find a real boyfriend until I was nearly AAU's age. I didn't put up with any bullshit, and I did wonder at times whether there was something wrong with me .

I am confident, and have a good body image, I am not full of myself. And yes, some people did call me a slut. I have a friendly, if assertive and somewhat geeky personality. My male friends love that they can relate to me as one of them.

I suppose I could've switched majors, started spending more time on my hair, plucked my eyebrows and gotten more female friends. I could've denied my sexual urges and refused to have sex with anyone who wasn't a "boyfriend". I could've found new hobbies that were less geeky. I might've found a boyfriend quicker. But then I wouldn't be myself

It took me a few years longer than average to find a boyfriend, but for the past couple years I have been in a wonderful, loving relationship with a man who appreciates me for who I am. The irony is, we wouldn't be dating if I wasn't that cute little larper girl he'd gotten into an argument about theoretical physics with.

Posted by Keljen on October 9, 2008 at 7:45 PM · Report this
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Love that you're in touch with Canadians! Stephen Harper has stated that he will not revisit the gay marriage laws here, but the guy seems to bend to whatever will keep him in power... so who knows what could happen if he got a majority. Thank goodness things are good for now. I wholeheartedly support the Californians and Floridians in their respective movements.
Posted by joe schmo on October 9, 2008 at 7:59 PM · Report this
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Closet Princess,
Just another reassurance to add to the pile. I also am a woman in a relationship with a bi, cross-dressing, man. We've been together for 5 years (we met at university). And he's been with his primary girlfriend for about 3 now (they met through mutual friends).
There are a lot of women who find your particular kinks super hot. When you bring the topic up don't let it be a big shameful reveal. Just present it as something that you enjoy and would enjoy even more with their help.
Good luck.
Posted by m. on October 9, 2008 at 9:00 PM · Report this
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Yikes, kaltes. Even Dan couldn't analyze much with that little info. I know plen-ty of amazing, undeniably hot 20-somethings who have no luck dating (some are still virgins). It's usually a mix of being around too many college dudes, a generation of people who 'don't date' and a generation of guys who expect anal on the first date.
Posted by Kiki on October 9, 2008 at 9:26 PM · Report this
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I read Dan every week & am considered to be 'in the know', but now I'm confused - when was anal removed from the 'first date' itinerary?
Posted by hitterintheshitter on October 9, 2008 at 10:42 PM · Report this
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kaltes,

The whole "men care more about looks than women do" thing is a huge wad of generalizing bullshit. Plenty of women are very visual in terms of what turns them on. Some men are less so.

So on the idea men are allowed to try and seek above them in terms of looks, but women who do the same should expect to get used/treated badly? Bullshit. That's just a result of our sexist culture -but nothing fair about that.

That being said, it's not like I actively try to seek above myself in terms of leagues or anything. I just go after people who I'm attracted to. I really don't know how others perceive me all the time, in terms of how attractive they find me or whatever. But, I've found hooking up is far more satisfying for me with someone who visually turns me on. And yes I have thought out and made the decision that I would rather have uncommitted sex with someone who turns me on as opposed to lousy sex with someone who'll dote on me but who I'll look at and just go *eh*.
Posted by em on October 10, 2008 at 12:01 AM · Report this
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(because that's not fair to either of us)
Posted by em on October 10, 2008 at 12:02 AM · Report this
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Also Kaltes,

I also think it's very important to make the point here that assholery is not limited to "hot" guys. I've known various sorts of assholes, and I have to say the one I would consider the worst was, in my opinion, quite homely, and quite attracted to me, to boot...

I also wonder whose opinion SHOULD we trust, do you think, to determine whether we're attractive? Guy friends? Guys who want to date us? Female friends? Female strangers? Because, I've gotten a pretty wide variety of opinions on my looks, anything from "you're cute" to "you're very beautiful and unique looking." I'd imagine part of that is due to the subjective nature of visual appeal, and part of that is due to varying levels of honesty and intent -but really now, from where are we allowed to adopt our self-image? Hotornot.com? Whether or not we could be a contestant on America's Next Top Model?
Posted by em on October 10, 2008 at 12:23 AM · Report this
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Agreement with Sarah, CPSP - Find yourself a geek, especially a geek into anime! There are plenty of hotties out there, as long as you don't mind the fact that she'll probably like dressing up in costume as a guy from time to time and potentially making out with other girls doing the same.

Google search for some anime events in your area, and listen for the following phrases by the ladies - 'shounen ai' (show-nen-eye), 'yaoi' ('yah-oi' or 'yowee', depending on how badly they mispronounce it), slash, or BL. All of these basically mean "homosexual romance", which is as popular as lesbians with straight men among most anime-loving women. Sure, not all of them are into it, but a lot of them are even if they don't admit it. Be honest that you have no idea about this subculture but display a genuine interest in learning, and be sure to ask for their opinions on "what's good".
Posted by Kels on October 10, 2008 at 1:38 AM · Report this
100
1. Kiki: Guys who 'don't date' and expect anal on the first date are supremely arrogant. They are a small minority of men, but a large minority of "HOT" men. Women who date these men get what they deserve.

hitterintheshitter: You are my hero. Hilarious :D

2. em:

First, yes, men do, on average, care more about looks than women do. That means they place higher VALUE on looks and are willing to trade lots of other things in order to get a good looking girl, which is why people say that men like bitches. They don't, but men will put up with bitches as long as the bitch is hot.

Conversely, women don't have much to offer hot men if they aren't hot themselves. The biggest thing they can offer is convenience, hence the booty call. So women who like to date hot men, but who are not hot themselves, usually end up as booty calls.

You admitted that, A LOT, you are unhappy/grouchy because you feel nobody likes you. You also said that you've had bad past experiences with the guys you've hooked up with. Clearly, the status quo is not working for you.

You present a false choice between having uncommitted sex with a hot guy, or having lousy but committed sex with a non-hot who you aren't attracted to.

Your attitude is like someone who walks into a car dealership and says "I want a FERRARI, but I only have $1,000!" The dealership would tell you that you can't buy a Ferrari for that, but you could rent one for an hour. So that is what you do, you rent the Ferrari for 1 hour, have a blast, then spend the rest of your time sad that you can't afford a car.

You can't afford a Ferrari, and you can't land any of the guys you are attracted to. If you really want to take steps to improve your life, here is what you do:

Step 1. Take a hard, even cruel, look in the mirror and make a sober assessment of your flaws as well as your good traits.

Step 2. (1) take steps to improve yourself to get into a position where hot men might want more from you than uncommitted sex, AND/OR (2) change you attitude so you stop looking down on men who have every bit as much to offer as you do, so you can broaden your dating pool enough to have a shot at meeting someone you, GASP, might really like, and who would actually reciprocate your feelings for a change. If you don't think the women who are happy now did some combination of (1) and (2), you are kidding yourself. Notice the woman who found a great guy said he got her into Dungeons & Dragons? Somehow I doubt your sex partners thus far have been part of the D&D playing crowd.

I never said hot guys are assholes. Just because a hot guy enjoys fucking you but doesn't want to commit doesn't make him an asshole. He is only an asshole if he knows you want more but he manipulates you and strings you along without any intention of giving you more.

To gauge how attractive I am, I (1) look in the mirror, (2) ask people who I feel I can trust and who won't bullshit me, and (3) pay attention to the actions, not words, of the women I date. Attraction does vary to some degree, but when you talk to enough people you will start hearing a lot of the same things about what your good/bad traits are.

Or you could send me a picture. rofl jk
More...
Posted by kaltes on October 10, 2008 at 3:22 AM · Report this
101
Kaltes:
"you mean you aren't even going on dates before the sex? wow! at least make them buy you dinner, lol. is she just a booty call?"

There is a word for women who require dinners, gifts, and money before having sex. They're called whores. I can't see why any man would want to date one?!
Posted by nahal on October 10, 2008 at 4:35 AM · Report this
102
I concur that Just Confused's ex is a complete jackass(and she is so, so innocent). I've never known a guy who would surreptitiously take off a condom in the middle! That's fucked up.

However, I get the feeling that Alone Again Unnaturally is lacking social skills. It is totally a warning sign that she's 21 and sexually active but NEVER been in a relationship. In my experience people who want relationships can usually find one, even the completely fucked up ones. So she's doing something really wrong, like settling for whatever male attention she can get. But I totally support Dan's advice- she really didn't give enough details for us to figure out what's going on.
Posted by starfireming on October 10, 2008 at 7:14 AM · Report this
103
The system's different here, Dan, and I need some clarification:

First, Harper's running in a specific riding. Do I donate to one of his opponents, or someone from a different party? For instance, I'd donate to my local Green, but she's running against some douchebag named Van Meerbergen (our conservative).

And furthermore, there are animals that are worse than Harper. Canada has a Christian Heritage Party (http://www.chp.ca/en/index.html). Might I suggest that these misogynist homophobes be exempt from your offer?
Posted by Father Shaggy on October 10, 2008 at 7:34 AM · Report this
104
I'm sure you don't need my kudos, but well said on the top email.

Also mad props to that girl for being so strong as to just end it like that.

A skill i surely wish i possessed.
Posted by Christopher on October 10, 2008 at 9:23 AM · Report this
105
"Conversely, women don't have much to offer hot men if they aren't hot themselves."

Now that's really fucked. I'm starting to agree with the others who say you've got issues, kaltes. I'm pretty damn sure I wouldn't want much to do with a guy who thought all any woman (hot, me, etc.) had to offer was her looks. And I've known plenty of men who consider other things important.

Second of all, you're wrong about the D&D bit. I like geeks. I've slept with geeks. They just happen to be hot geeks. Not perfect male-models, but hot to me. I bring you back to my point about it being nearly impossible to honestly assess your own looks, or anyone else's, because of the subjective nature of such things. If I ask someone who really goes for some physical trait I don't have, I'm going to get a different response than from someone who really tends to like some physical trait I /do/ have.

"Attraction does vary to some degree, but when you talk to enough people you will start hearing a lot of the same things about what your good/bad traits are."

I think I know what my good and bad traits are, as far as popular opinion goes. That doesn't do much to tell me how I rank, in general, amongst other people. I can't believe you "go around and ask enough people" as you say you do. Most people don't do that -which really does start to point, I think, to some of this being you having issues and projecting...
Posted by em on October 10, 2008 at 10:24 AM · Report this
106
21 isn't that old to never have had a LTR. At 21, I was attractive, sexually active, and well liked by my guy friends but it would be 3 more years before I was seriously involved. My history of not putting up with bullshit, knowing what I liked in bed, and enjoying the company of the opposite sex made the next 10 years much more fun when I was dating more "seriously". Good luck to AAU- you've got plenty of time.

Also, I wish my current LTR was into men and cross dressing. Maybe I should move to Tuscon?
Posted by emla on October 10, 2008 at 11:15 AM · Report this
107
this is for CPSP:

I want you to know that there are woman out there who are ok with being in a long-term relationship with a bisexual man who is into cross dressing... I am a woman who is in that exact relationship right now. I just want to share a few things about the way we've handled our relationship that I believe has made it strong and healthy.

1- We are monogamous when we are apart and this keeps me feeling safe. When he has been intimate with other guys it is something that we discussed beforehand and I was there. It happened naturally and he made sure i was comfortable the entire time. Anything I was not comfortable with did not happen.

2- We are both very candid and open about what turns us on and take things slowly (with both his fetishes and mine).

3- We are also candid about things that would be dealbreakers -- which can be an even harder conversation than talking about what turns us on.

I really think the most important thing in any relationship is honesty and trust. So when you talk to your girlfriend, you need to show her that you want her first and foremost. These other desires are important too, but I think that allowing your sexualities to develop together creates an even higher level of intimacy. In the end, if it freaks them out or isn't for them, that's fair enough - you will find someone who will be into it.

Last thought - I never fantasized about men in panties, but my boyfriend looks (and feels) hot in them. that turns me on.
Posted by ruby on October 10, 2008 at 1:23 PM · Report this
108
I, too, am involved with a bi-sexual, cross-dressing man. Don't give up hope, he didn't find me until he was 33; you're only 23. I know that seems like "forever", but don't settle; it'd only make you miserable.
Posted by JodieG on October 10, 2008 at 1:58 PM · Report this
109
em, why are you getting so engaged with kaltes? you know he's just gonna get your goat.

And I have to disagree- most guys are not gonna refrain from asking a confident/attractive woman out. There may be certain men who think they won't measure up, but by and large confidence isn't intimidating. Unless she's SO confident she's intimidating everyone around her, which I really doubt. Plus, no one who's realistically evaluating themselves is THAT confident.

I really want to hear back from AAU. I want details!
Posted by starfireming on October 10, 2008 at 2:25 PM · Report this
110
kaltes

There is never any excuse for taking a condom off in the middle of sex, even if you're a dumb as a brick 17 year old.
Posted by d.knitster on October 10, 2008 at 4:04 PM · Report this
111
to nahal: Women who require DATES before sex are not whores.

to em:

Yay, more twisting of my words. I never said looks is the only thing women had to offer, but that hot men put so much emphasis on looks (since they are hot themselves) that women who are not hot don't have much to compensate with. By contrast, men can compensate with things like money, success, power, being funny, etc. Men, especially hot men, simply don't value these things as much for girlfriends and sex partners.

Assessing your own looks is not rocket science. You make it sound like quantum physics. Please. All it takes is being a little honest with yourself. It isn't an exact science. You said you were above average. Good enough. Why belabor it?

I don't take a poll of everyone I meet, but of course once in a while the topic will come up with a female friend and we will compare notes. I don't start those conversations, because I already have a good idea of where I'm at. I never talk about my looks with other guys.

starfireming:

The notion that men are afraid of "confidence" is absurd. Women don't "intimidate" men, men just use that language because they are avoiding using the word they are really thinking about, which is "bitch". Men avoid very assertive women because they see them as probably being bitches. If a woman is very outspoken, and is not also very reasonable/fair, I am going to look at her as more trouble than she is worth in terms of dating, because there are plenty of nice women out there who won't give me the headaches that the "confident" woman would have.

Confidence is fine, but when a woman starts acting more masculine and less feminine, that is when most potential suitors are going to lose interest.

to d.knitster:

I'm not saying it isn't wrong. It is, but there is a difference between a guy who does something stupid and realizes his mistake, and a guy like we had in this case who is beyond hope of redemption.
More...
Posted by kaltes on October 10, 2008 at 4:43 PM · Report this
112
"Men avoid very assertive women because they see them as probably being bitches."

"Confidence is fine, but when a woman starts acting more masculine and less feminine, that is when most potential suitors are going to lose interest."

Let me get this straight... so when women start acting as confident as men, they are "bitches." Good to know. I think a lot of women savvy enough to read Savage Love would not want to date you.
Posted by em on October 10, 2008 at 8:07 PM · Report this
113
I could have been AAU a few years ago too.

Although I think kaltes is a sexist jackass with serious issues with women's sexuality, I do agree with him on one point. I used to have hook-ups with guys who were more attractive then I was, but never dated them long-term. As soon as I stopped picking out the hottest guy at the party/bar, I had much better luck. Attractiveness differentials do make a difference.

That said, if you're a picky person and you don't put up with bullshit, it becomes a lot more difficult. Some people are serial monogamists...they'll just date the next-best-thing until someone else comes along. But some of us aren't like that, and if a person can't carry on an intelligent conversation about philosophy, or science, or whatever, we get bored and can't fake interest/affection.

I'm pretty lucky - after years of dating at most intermittently, I met my now-husband and fell madly in love. It was when I had intentionally altered the ways I looked at guys and had come to terms with my own insecurities (aka was starting to be happy being single). But you know what? I was still picky, and I didn't settle for bullshit.

So my advice to AAU is:

-Look at your standards. Do they reflect what actually makes you happy?
-Give everyone a chance (at a date, that is, not sex). You'll find out what you really want in guys, and at worst you'll have funny stories.
Posted by emster on October 10, 2008 at 9:44 PM · Report this
114
While I agree with kaltes' sentiments regarding AAU in spirit--she doesn't give us much to work with, so I wonder what she's hiding/editing out--it's all awfully harsh. Aside from the fact that I take personal offense to point #4, that one just seems to come out of nowhere... or spite?

That said, right on, Dan. Your advice--particularly to JC is perfect. Geez. And I thought I'd dated some rotten dudes.
Posted by Lora on October 10, 2008 at 10:22 PM · Report this
115
"Where can I meet my dream girl who will watch me with a guy while I am wearing a skirt?"

I know several bi-sexual women who would dig watching two guys together. Personally I think the panties would be a bonus in a situation like that. Boys in skirts can be sexy; so why no two boys in skirts? That might just be me and my friends but I assume it would be true for other women too.
Posted by BomberB on October 10, 2008 at 10:49 PM · Report this
116
Kaltes is right on. Look how many females were pissed off when they saw themselves in the first comment. So, they were called out of their sugar coated self image, and it actually made them angry enough to go on a virtual witch hunt. Kaltes hit a nerve, and hit it well, looking at all the backlash. Kaltes never insulted the chick, but received a number of insults from sluts posing as 'independent women'. Oh yeah, I'm probably just another dude living in a dark world who can't get a date...nope. Straight GGG married female with 2 grown daughters.
Posted by melapis on October 10, 2008 at 11:46 PM · Report this
117
Guys pulling off condoms behind your back are completely unacceptable. Happend to me too and left me with a cocktail of STDs. This is a warning to all assholes out there: Next time you can either run really fast or I'll turn your junk into ground meat with my soon to be aquired rifle.
Posted by D on October 11, 2008 at 12:04 AM · Report this
118
to em:

Sorry em, you still don't have it straight. I used the words "very assertive", didn't say anything about mere confidence, they are two different things. However, some people try to mislabel arrogance and aggressiveness as "confidence" as a way of putting positive spin on their behavior.

Men generally do not find "alpha" women attractive, and women generally don't find "beta" men attractive, including you.

to emster:

It is hilarious that you pretty much completely agree with me, but nonetheless can't resist the cheap shots and personal attacks. It looks like you learned from your mistakes (albeit the hard way), and finally found happiness.

Let's not mince words though: in the minds of women like em, you lowered your standards. You stopped hooking up with the hottest guy at the bar, to name one. You say you were still picky, but you had to become LESS picky, aka more REASONABLE and open-minded, or you never would have been able to meet the guy you are with now.

Once girls like em follow in your footsteps, they will have a chance at love as well. If not, well they could always get cats.

to Lora:

The #4 one, a red flag for attractive women with all or nearly all male friends, is well known. It is a huge red flag. I didn't just make it up myself. Attractive women with bad personalities can maintain male friendships using their sexuality as a crutch, but obviously can't do that with other women. So it is a pretty common thing to see attractive women with bad personalities wind up with all or nearly all male friends.

to melapis:

Thanks, nice to hear from you. I raised questions that struck a nerve with some women, and ended up getting the "republican guest on The View" treatment from the fine ladies here, lol.

Dan himself has wound up in hot water several times for doing similar things over the years, although my quickly typed unedited rant doesn't hold a candle to his columns. The best was when Dan laid a masterful trap for exactly the kind of women who tore into me:

He first printed a letter from a woman with an overweight husband, who no longer felt attracted to him. A few weeks later, he printed the exact same scenario, except reversed, with the man no longer attracted to his overweight wife. His advice to that man was downright cruel towards the wife, prompting a deluge of hate mail from women.

Dan then revealed his trap. He did not write that advice after all. It was stitched together from all the women who wrote in to give their two cents to the woman who wasn't attracted to her husband! The women demanded the fat husband get into shape or get dumped, but when Dan applied their advice to the fat wife, all hell broke loose. He called the women sending him hate mail out on their hypocrisy, and demonstrated his excess of brains and balls that make this column so great.

I don't dislike women, far from it. Thing is, my advice on this topic just happens to be a bitter pill, which can't really be sugar coated, so the women want to kill the messenger.
More...
Posted by kaltes on October 11, 2008 at 12:45 AM · Report this
119
You kind of turn my stomach Kaltes. You are so eager to throw this word "slut" at this woman who you don't even know. Dan was right, there's not a lot of information in her letter, and you go off assuming that because she is sexually active and not in a relationship that all the "guy friends" she refers to are sleeping with her.

"Some people might call that [being single and sexually active] a slut." "At least make them buy you dinner first?" (So in your world having sex for pleasure is slutty but trading sex for a night out or presents is not?) "Lol is she just a bootie call?"

It sounds like someone has a thing for "outwardly attractive women" and then tries to tear down the object of his desire because these women won't sleep with him. I'm just saying...
Posted by The other girl on October 11, 2008 at 4:32 AM · Report this
120
@ Closet Princess - I urge you to check out Desert Dominion, the local BDSM club in Tucson. There are plenty of like-minded folks there who not only cross-dress but might be just the woman you are looking for.
Posted by hilz on October 11, 2008 at 10:18 AM · Report this
121
I'm not Bi but I am a life-long crossdresser who is still searching for the GGG woman who will accept and participate in this aspect of my life. I'm in my early 50s and the women in my age group don't accept it. The few women that I've tried getting into deeper relationships with have all ran screaming in the other direction when I told them.

Nice to see there are accepting women out there. I wish some of them were in my part of the world (RI)
Posted by mbc on October 11, 2008 at 10:47 AM · Report this
122
I could have been AAU a few years ago too.

Although I think kaltes is a sexist jackass with serious issues with women's sexuality, I do agree with him on one point. I used to have hook-ups with guys who were more attractive then I was, but never dated them long-term. As soon as I stopped picking out the hottest guy at the party/bar, I had much better luck. Attractiveness differentials do make a difference.

That said, if you're a picky person and you don't put up with bullshit, it becomes a lot more difficult. Some people are serial monogamists...they'll just date the next-best-thing until someone else comes along. But some of us aren't like that, and if a person can't carry on an intelligent conversation about philosophy, or science, or whatever, we get bored and can't fake interest/affection.

I'm pretty lucky - after years of dating at most intermittently, I met my now-husband and fell madly in love. It was when I had intentionally altered the ways I looked at guys and had come to terms with my own insecurities (aka was starting to be happy being single). But you know what? I was still picky, and I didn't settle for bullshit.

So my advice to AAU is:

-Look at your standards. Do they reflect what actually makes you happy?
-Give everyone a chance (at a date, that is, not sex). You'll find out what you really want in guys, and at worst you'll have funny stories.
Posted by emster on October 11, 2008 at 2:54 PM · Report this
123
to The other girl:

Yes, some people, mostly women, would call a woman that wants a BF, but settles for sex, especially as someone's booty call, a slut. I didn't call her a slut.

The "at least make they buy you dinner first" is a saying I have heard from several different women. I did not invent it myself. It is a tongue in cheek way of saying "don't be too easy".

You critics are really terrible at your dime store psychology, and you attempts to make ad hominem attacks and change the subject onto me personally are pathetic, especially since you don't realize what huge hypocrites you are, doing all the things to me that you take exception for my allegedly having done them to AAU.

As far as keeping score, how is this: Men who can't get laid and women who can't get relationships are seen as failures in the eyes of society, whereas men who can get relationships and women who can get laid aren't seen as anything special. Why? Figure it out.

to emster: don't just copy/paste your posts, write something new. Calling me a sexist jackass over and over again gets old.

by emster on October 10, 2008 at 9:44 PM
by emster on October 11, 2008 at 2:54 PM

Posted by kaltes on October 11, 2008 at 4:54 PM · Report this
124
*Coff* Tell closet princess looking for a princess to come and talk to me in NYC. I *love* a man in a skirt and panties, and I adore bisexual men.
Posted by Wendy Blackheart on October 11, 2008 at 10:29 PM · Report this
125
"Oh yeah, I'm probably just another dude living in a dark world who can't get a date...nope. Straight GGG married female with 2 grown daughters."

Melapis, you're right, you're not a sexist dude. However, you Are a woman who was raised in a previous generation, culturally speaking, where standards for men and women were somewhat different, who considers the fact she's married and has kids a status symbol to boot (otherwise you wouldn't have mentioned it, right?) So, I consider that about as bad...

"The "at least make they buy you dinner first" is a saying I have heard from several different women."

So? Then those women are sexist, like you. It's not like all women agree on issues.

And who said anything about me hitting on the hottest guy on the bar? I go after guys I find attractive. I don't go after guys I don't find attractive. I don't think it gets much simpler than that...
Posted by em on October 11, 2008 at 11:21 PM · Report this
126
I frequent some yaoi forums, and my impression is that most yaoi fangirls (including me) do not like it when one of the guys in a pairing is too effeminate or cross-dresses. The main appeal of yaoi is seeing two attractive guys go at it, and not necessarily to self-project oneself onto an effeminate uke. The cross-dressing thing is kind of a turn-off.
Posted by xig on October 11, 2008 at 11:37 PM · Report this
127
Re the AAU/kaltes drama. Ho. Ly. Shit. What an unnecessary clusterfuck. While I think the "slut" comment was out of line, it seemed to me kaltes' basic point was "Well, shit lady, if the amount of effort you put into this letter to Dan is anything like the amount of effort you put into finding/maintaining a relationship, no wonder you don't have a boyfriend." The letter REEKS of entitlement (not the healthy kind).
Posted by khyros on October 12, 2008 at 9:18 AM · Report this
128
You are so right on about Just Confused. Thank you for calling it a sexual assault right out. 1-800-656-HOPE is a National Sexual Assault Hotline in case Just Confused or any other survivors want someone to talk to.
Posted by Jackie on October 12, 2008 at 12:03 PM · Report this
129
to em:

You really embarrass yourself in attacking melapis. She brought up the fact that she was married with kids as to controvert the stupid attacks from people like you that people who disagree with you are lonely male losers.

So all the women who disagree with you are sexist? You really are clueless, em, good luck with growing up, and have fun in that dark tunnel you put yourself in with your unrealistic expectations, the good guys out there certainly aren't missing out.

Until then, I'm sure plenty of 'attractive' men will get a kick out of the NSA sex until they get bored of you. ;)

to khyros:

You are right that her letter reeked of entitlement, and this was a jumping off point for many of my red flags. AAU comes across as one of those women who acts like she is all that on the outside, but cries on the inside. I almost feel sympathy for them, but when you think about it, they are just very self-centered and stupid, hardly sympathetic traits.

I didn't call her a slut, I merely pointed out that some people would possibly consider her as such, but I do consider women who want boyfriends but settle for sex to be just as pathetic as beta males who dote on and let themselves be used by attractive women in the vain hope of getting a shot at sleeping with them someday.

These people don't get respect, least of all from the people who are using them.
Posted by kaltes on October 12, 2008 at 1:13 PM · Report this
130
my comment has to do with "my mother died.".. a story for Dan,
There was once in a hospital in San Francisco an old woman who was dying like your mom but with out the family around,. She too had an oxygen mask and could not breathe need suctioning, and her death rattle was to last for hours if not days.

The yound resident ordered morphine to be given "subq." a dose of 2 to 10 Mg ,a large range..
The nurses on that night, the charge nurse and the night nurse in connection with the resident, with out saying it but all gave it IV instead so the dose hit all at once instead of a small amount..
She drifted off peacefully a few minutes after.. a bunch of crazy "death angels" shooting unsuspecting people up with stuff. No, just real compassion in the world. I wanted to share that with you to give you some peace.
Posted by santa clause on October 12, 2008 at 3:57 PM · Report this
131
Eris, et al are sooo right. I love shopping for panties for my man. There's not a much hotter thing than seeing or sucking his cock through lace or ruffles. Crotchless panties are exquisite and the best of both worlds. I can't wait to watch suck cock while I use a strap on in him. To PAsister, don't give up. Mine used to live in PA. Real Woman
Posted by Real Woman on October 12, 2008 at 5:49 PM · Report this
132
Cross-Dressing Princess: Have you tried to me people locally on FetLife? It's like Facebook for kinksters, and you can advertise your kink preferences upfront.

As a woman with a Cross-Dressing Princess of my very own (same age, too), let me tell you: there are women out there who are into what you are into! Don't lose hope!

Posted by lotl on October 12, 2008 at 6:00 PM · Report this
133
It makes me want ot cry how many seemingly level-headed women go second guessing themselves over whether they did the right thing by dumping a guy for being an abusive manipulative rapist ('cause JC is NOT the only one!) And is it telling that a lot of them have to ask, if this is just normal guy behavior? Or just their own insecurity?

I would have guessed the latter. But then a letter the very same page talks about being unwilling to put with bullshit. Even if your first assumption is that she is a bitch, doesn't the context even make you blink, wonder if there is the slight possibility that "bullshit" might mean something like, sneaking off a condom during sex? Maybe not, but we just don't know, as Dan pointed out. But how many responders are ready, not just to bash this woman, but also to bash anyone who suggests there is even a possibility that she might not be a bitch. Wow.

Fear of being called a bitch, incidentally, is one of the things that makes women think they have to put up with abusive "normal guy behavior"

Posted by mjd64 on October 13, 2008 at 6:23 AM · Report this
134
IMHO, for all you young ones out there..here is a good rule book for dating.

Girl's Age / Guy's Max Age.

anything under 25 / your age + 1;
anything over 25 / the "classic 2x + 7 rule" where X = girl's age.


Posted by me on October 13, 2008 at 9:54 AM · Report this
135
oops meant 2x MINUS 7
Posted by me on October 13, 2008 at 9:55 AM · Report this
136
Dan: I'm SUPER confused by both the letter from Just Confused and your response to it. She says her boyfriend took off the condom, but at no point does she say he tried to re-insert after doing that (though you seem to assume that was the case). If he took off the condom to jerk himself to climas, that's still safe sex isn't it? And in most recent porn I've seen the guy always takes off the condom to bring himself to climax and then that's the end, they don't re-insert. What's unsafe about that? Thanks.
Posted by Super Confused on October 13, 2008 at 11:37 AM · Report this
137
Super Confused,

This is where context and deductive reasoning comes in. The guy cried, sent gifts, and won't stop calling. That seems like pretty guilty behavior to me. Also, give JC a little credit: do you really think she would have been so mad if he merely pulled out to jerk off?

A lot of guys pull out to finish. It is safer than leaving it in, even with a condom, because you risk breaks/leaks. It is also just more fun to hose the girl down as long as you try to avoid hitting her face or hair (unless she is into that, but few women are).

Matter of fact, if a guy pulls out to finish all over a girl's tummy and chest, and she freaks out and recoils and/or has a negative reaction, that is a big GGG violation and grounds for dumping.

Note to women: if you expect a guy to literally mash his face up against your sticky vaginal secretions, open his mouth and immerse his tongue in them, and to do it for an extended period of time, then you should be willing to do the same for a guy.

And no, ladies, your vaginal secretions do not taste like heaven. While it varies greatly from woman to woman, and some women have a pretty decent flavor, you don't exactly see people lining up to pour vagina syrup on their pancakes, or marinate their steaks in vaginal sauce. You women need to understand that unless you are vomit-inducingly bad, as GGG men we will tell you that your pussy tastes incredible and we would like to have it for breakfast lunch and dinner. We do this because we want you to be happy and enjoy the sex. We have enough common sense to know that if we told you that you were simply tolerable down there, you'd get really insecure and get a negative attitude about oral sex. So to be GGG, men need to stay positive about oral sex even when you might be having a bad day down there. If we are in a LTR and you want complete honesty, a good guy will say "today wasn't your best day, but I still loved it" and it will be the truth.

So when we do all that, and then you act like we are spraying you with radioactive waste because we pull out to finish on your tummy/tits, is a HUGE slap in the face. Here we are, with our chins still wet from your sticky fluids, and you have the nerve to act as though OUR sticky fluids, which are merely being deposited on your torso, far from your nose and mouth, are somehow revolting. Are you kidding me?

Now, I wouldn't tar all women with this: only a small minority of women behave this way.

When a man is ejaculating, what the woman does during and immediately afterwards can completely ruin the whole experience, or can make him think you are the coolest girl in the world. You need to remember that men crash into their "refractory" aka "sex disgusts me" period soon after they come. Your behavior can either make this a brutal and unpleasant crash, or if you keep a great attitude, he will be ready to go again in no time, and he will love you for it.
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Posted by kaltes on October 13, 2008 at 2:29 PM · Report this
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The alone unnaturally woman does sound like she has her own issues that might make her undesirable, but there is nothing wrong with a woman sleeping around if she enjoys it, kaltes. I bet you only called her a slut because she is a woman; that is what we call Misogyny.
Posted by Jae on October 13, 2008 at 5:40 PM · Report this
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The best way I ever found to meet other bisexuals (and non-bisexuals who are into bisexuals) was to find a bi support/social group. Most of the bi girls I know love watching and/or participating in guy-on-guy action. You will also make friends and find a bunch of people who understand you and appreciate you for who you are, rather than the respectable facade you project. Good luck, mate!
Posted by DexX on October 13, 2008 at 9:42 PM · Report this
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OK, kaltes, now I think you're just trying to rile us up. Refusing to let a guy come on your chest when asked? Maybe a violation of GGG, maybe not, depending on the circumstances. But being upset when someone suddenly shoots all over you without warning? Unless a woman has suddenly shoved her vagina onto your face and smeared her bodily fluids all over, it is not at all the same. Ignoring all the subtler issues and coming from a purely practical POV, it's messy, and I don't think it's anywhere near as common a practice as oral sex so I wouldn't expect it with a new partner.

Also, whoa, random rant much? Please, tell us more about your sex life.
Posted by Sophia on October 14, 2008 at 1:00 AM · Report this
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mbc:

Have you tried looking for bi ladies in your "age group"? Glitterbomb has a point: we bi girls are a good bet for crossdressing men because we're categorically into both femininity and masculinity -- and often find it all the hotter when there's a mixture of both.

mjd64:

I've been ignoring the kaltes-related tl;dr thread of conversation, but your first paragraph struck a deep cord in me and I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiment.

The "are all guys this way?" part was the most excruciating thing for me too, as I read Dan's column. Because ultimately, unless a woman is prepared to live her whole life like a nun or go lesbian against her own orientation, the fear of "all men being this way anyway" can act as a powerful browbeating mechanism forcing her to "take" tons of bullshit while knowing full well how unjust it is. Words like "slut" -- along with the whole ideology that lives behind it -- try to do the exact same kind of browbeating and I abhor it.

But then again, in today's age we don't have to stick to the assholes of our neighborhood... We can go find saner men in other parts of the world, and there are people like Dan reminding us that we can. viva to the 21st century.
Posted by Sophie on October 14, 2008 at 6:10 AM · Report this
142
I just got my absentee ballot for FL. And I was surprised to see the prop 2 thing. It hasn't been spoken about at all! Kudos to you for bringing it up!
Posted by meisha on October 14, 2008 at 8:36 AM · Report this
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Jae,

If there was nothing wrong with sleeping around, why do nearly all the women who do it, lie about it?

I didn't call AAU a slut, and I never said there was any problem with a woman having sex as long as that's what she really wanted.

Sophie,

If a woman chooses to put up with serious bullshit, she has no one but herself to blame. It is her fault, and her fault alone. Even if the guy is an asshole, it is not his fault if the girl is stupid enough to stay and keep taking it. Women stay with jerks and assholes all the time. Women stay with serial cheaters. It isn't because society browbeat them into it.

If you are truly afraid that all men act 1 way, or you think you need to flee to other countries to find the "good" men, then you need some common sense.
Posted by kaltes on October 14, 2008 at 10:36 AM · Report this
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blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahx1000
for the effing love of DAN SAVAGE, why can't we all just get along? Just a thought, tis all.
Posted by Teleios on October 14, 2008 at 11:53 AM · Report this
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Thanks for not forgetting us canucks Dan!

Anxiously watching election results coming in.
Posted by Rob from Toronto on October 14, 2008 at 12:44 PM · Report this
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Dan, thank-you thank-you for your efforts on Prop 8. This was in Monday's LA times and it stopped me in my tracks.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gaypriest13-2008oct13,0,2646781.story

A quote from Father Geoffrey Farrow in a sermon coming out (literally) against Prop 8.

"I know these words of truth will cost me dearly," he said. "But to withhold them...I would become an accomplice to a moral evil that strips gay and lesbian people not only of their civil rights but of their human dignity as well."

The priest was subsequently stripped of his salary and benefits, and ordered to stay away from all church communities he had served.

So very sad. Please donate to NO on Prop 8. Bigotry hurts everyone.
Posted by George Gillies on October 14, 2008 at 4:23 PM · Report this
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Thanks, mjd64

"Until then, I'm sure plenty of 'attractive' men will get a kick out of the NSA sex until they get bored of you. ;)"

Kaltes, did you forget the part where I said I'm perfectly self-aware and more content to have NSA with a guy I find attractive than a relationship with someone I don't? Of course if I was less picky about who I'd commit to I would have had a committed relationship already -I said it myself in my first post and don't need guys like you to tell me that. That's true for tons of men and women alike, though... Bottom line is, there are also a slew of factors you don't know, I guess you could say "intimacy issues"... but I'm far from clingy and I haven't exactly expressed a desire to anyone for more committment yet, so I can't say for sure no one would have. Same thing with AAU, there is so much you (and I) don't know about her.

"Even if the guy is an asshole, it is not his fault if the girl is stupid enough to stay and keep taking it. Women stay with jerks and assholes all the time. Women stay with serial cheaters. It isn't because society browbeat them into it."

Bullshit, kaltes. I had a good friend whose first bf, who acted chivalrous outside the bedroom and took her on dates, raped her multiple times, and she didn't even realize that's what it was because of the lack of widespread accurate info about sex, legal rights, and the fact most men can, in fact, "help themselves," in this country. So many women who grow up in families with abusive fathers don't think they can expect any better from men as adults -so they settle for a similar deal. Heck, my FATHER was abused as a child, and it seriously messed up his dating life. So it's not just women this sort of thought pattern extends to -it's just more common with women than men b/c more women have bad experiences that lower their expectations of men than vice versa...

More...
Posted by em on October 14, 2008 at 6:16 PM · Report this
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I am from Tucson and am only living elsewhere for work - I want to go home!

I find it hard to believe that Princess is having a hard time finding someone into his fetish in Tucson. It's a pretty liberal city with a decently sized gay/bi population; I mean just walk down 4th avenue any evening during the week! I'm sure that he can find a woman into his kink. He must be looking in the wrong neighborhoods...
Posted by WinterBauval on October 14, 2008 at 7:17 PM · Report this
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Not having a boyfriend by age 21 is not a red flag. I didn't have a boyfriend until I was 23 and am a happy, well adjusted person in a long term relationship with a very good sex life. Please don't judge. Dating late does not indicate your fitness for a relationship or your attractiveness.
Posted by AnneNeville on October 14, 2008 at 7:52 PM · Report this
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to em,

I also remember the part where you said "So sometimes (ok, a lot) I go around grouchy feeling like nobody likes me." and "Good to know many of you have been in AAU's place and feel you're better off now. That gives me some hope, at least..." so clearly you aren't happy with the status quo.

Sorry em, if your friend for RAPED on multiple occasions, and didn't realize that it was RAPE at the time, she wasn't raped. If you get raped, you are going to know. If it doesn't involve slipping the person drugs, physical violence, or serious threats of violence, it is not really rape. I also think that if a woman LIKES a guy and KEEPS DATING HIM it is pretty obvious that he isn't repeatedly raping her.

I have friends who have dealt with traumatic experiences, and they all still manage to know the difference between right and wrong, rape and non-rape, abuse and kindness. You can't claim that just because something bad happened to someone in the past, or they come from a different culture, that their brain shuts off and they can't be held responsible for their own choices.

This is a free country. People choose to stay in bad relationships. That choice is nobody's fault but their own. If they take responsibility for their poor judgment, then they can learn from it and make better choices in the future. On the other hand, if they blame their stupidity on others, they will do the same shit over and over again.

And yes, men stay in bad relationships sometimes too. The answer is usually very simple. Listen to the song "Crazy Bitch" by Buckcherry.

To AnneNeville:

It is not a red flag under certain circumstances, but it was a red flag given the rest of what AAU wrote. If you wanted a relationship well before 21 and couldn't get one till 23, that's a red flag. On the other hand, if you were one of those girls who didn't want a relationship for religious reasons, because of your parents, or because you wanted to focus on your education, etc, that's different.
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Posted by kaltes on October 14, 2008 at 9:38 PM · Report this
151
Jesus, Kaltes, grow a set. When I'm an ass it's my own damned fault, not hers. And when a man rapes his girl it's called domestic violence, not "her fault."

Stop being a mossback and a troll.
Posted by Blake on October 15, 2008 at 8:17 AM · Report this
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Blake,

Grow a set? Why don't you learn to read and stop twisting my words. If someone is in a bad relationship and they choose to stay in it, THAT is their fault.

Only an idiot, like you, would say that the girl is responsible for the man's behavior. Everyone is responsible for their own behavior.
Posted by kaltes on October 15, 2008 at 11:30 AM · Report this
153
There's an old saying that goes something like 'Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free'... AAU might learn something from that one. Not saying there's anything wrong with premarital or any other kind sex (it's all good as long as it's consensual). But why would someone want to long term date someone who is a bed hopping whore? And just because someone's willing to stick it in doesn't mean your attractive (inside or out) have you ever looked at couples in wal-mart? *Shudders*
Posted by Tempystbelle on October 15, 2008 at 11:43 AM · Report this
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kaltes,

I think you are going to hell for that comment, and I'm not even sure if I believe in one.
Posted by every sane person on October 15, 2008 at 4:14 PM · Report this
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If there is a hell, then you can go ahead and try to tell the devil that all the bad choices you made in life were everyone else's fault and see how that works for you.
Posted by kaltes on October 15, 2008 at 4:50 PM · Report this
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Dan---I'm glad that you mentioned that a guy taking of his condom during sex IS a violation and an assault. I'm 26 and this recently happened to me as well by a guy I had been dating. When you agree to have sex, it does mean under the agreed upon conditions (e.g. condoms at all times). To break that agreement is very very shitty. In my case, I ended up with a case of HPV and some emotional trauma to boot. By advice--get tested and never talk to him again. He probably thinks what he did wasn't even wrong (the guy who did it to me thought we could still be friends!)...

Anyhow, this is more than just being a crappy boyfriend. This guy is totally a victimizing piece of schite.
Posted by litgirl on October 15, 2008 at 11:27 PM · Report this
157
Dear Closet Princess...

Tucson has (or did when I was still there) a very active pan-fetish club. All are welcome, and everyone adheres to the BDSM code of silence outside of club environs. That is, when you meet on the street, you get a "hello, how are ya?" but no-one brings up the kink. Since it's pan-fetish, everyone is welcome, you don't have to be into the BD or SM parts. I moved away about a year ago, but we had several crossdressers and lots of ladies (and gents!) who love 'em. Including me! Take my advice, go to a Desert Dominion Munch and meet the crowd! Seriously, I met them right when I was beginning to explore my submission and I met a lot of caring pervs who were willing to treat me well even as they beat & boffed til I cried! http://www.desertdominion.org/
Posted by happy pervette on October 16, 2008 at 7:38 AM · Report this
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"Just Confused", you're my Hero! Props on doing the difficult thing, even though it was TOTALLY the right thing!

To "Alone Again Unnaturally", it sounds to me like she's just super-picky. Coupled by having a bunch of (close?) guy friends, that could make it seriously difficult to meet interested/brave enough men for an LTR. Now, I'm not saying all standards should be negated, but maybe she should give the benefit of the doubt to those guys who are ballsy enough to approach her while she's out with the boys. Of course, there is always the option of not waiting around and making the first move with someone she's interested in before being relegated to the dreaded "friend zone". (Don't laugh, it can be a problem for girls as well). Though, Dan's advice of putting up with SOME "bullshit" has to be taken seriously to heart....
Posted by me on October 16, 2008 at 10:23 PM · Report this
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Kaltes:

"1. saying she is good-looking (no humility?)"

l'm wondering exactly why one cannot say they are good-looking without it meaning they lack humility. l'm good-looking, but that doesn't mean l'm beautiful, and it certainly doesn't mean l'm somehow perfect as a result. l think it IS a measure of confidence if someone can say this, and l think it's fairly clear the rest of her letter demonstrates humility.

"2. sexually active, single (some people might call that a slut?)"

Jesus Christ. Thanks for joining the ranks of assholes who think women should actively deny themselves the joy of sex and wear a fucking chastity belt til marriage while men get to rock out with their cock out whenever the breeze blows the right way.

"3. never had a boyfriend (by age 21?)"

This is a valid red flag. lt seems that, based on the tone and content of her letter, she may lack the confidence to make a move. lf there's any kind of self-deprecation going on, it's probably obvious to those who might otherwise approach her.

"4. "I have many guy friends" (attractive women with all or mostly male friends almost always have terrible personalities.)"

This is laughably spurious, and diminishes any intelligence you might have by a mile.

"5. "who tell me that I'm great" (she is great because guy friends say so? that is her proof?)"

No, it's not proof. lt sounds like she doesn't think she's all that great if she relies on the encouragement of other men to tell her she's attractive or fun. A red flag, but l think it's clear she's deserving of a little sympathy, not your disdain.

"6. "Is it that men don't want to date me?" (you mean you aren't even going on dates before the sex? wow! at least make them buy you dinner, lol. is she just a booty call?)"

lf you regularly jump to such conclusions, l have to wonder how YOU get a date. Or do you only criticize others to this degree when they aren't there to defend themselves? There is no reason to assume she's not been on a few dates, but going on one date, and dating over time are two different things.

"7. "or is my lack of putting up with bullshit" (false choice, it isn't necessarily either, but when a girl says she doesn't put up with bullshit, it usually means she is saying she has a short fuse.)"

l'm sorry....are you a woman? Or do you just consider yourself He Who Knows Everything about them? Your perspective is limited to your experience, Kaltes, and what it looks like your experience is is that you've had one too many women stomp on your heart and are joyfully projecting all your bitter bullshit onto this girl. Give her a break, and maybe back the hell up and acknowledge maybe you're a little too sure of how much you know about women. You've got a long way to go, baby.
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Posted by freikja on October 17, 2008 at 12:54 PM · Report this
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Yeah Kaltes, I can't imagine that you could be a long term reader of this column and still be clinging to your so unabashedly slut bashing ways. Some people might call you an asshole. Grow up.
Posted by bubblex on October 17, 2008 at 3:24 PM · Report this
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"I didn't call her a slut, I merely pointed out that some people would possibly consider her as such, but I do consider women who want boyfriends but settle for sex to be just as pathetic as beta males who dote on and let themselves be used by attractive women in the vain hope of getting a shot at sleeping with them someday."

Technically, you didn't call her a slut, no; you pointed out that some might call her that. That doesn't change the fact that it was one of your personal red flags, which implies that it's something *you* would take into consideration.

On the latter part where you are essentially saying that women who are single but settle for sex are pathetic, that seems to support the general 'slut' theme. That's part of the problem; you seem to be reiterating a point you claim you didn't make by still insulting women who have sex while not hooked up with whomever they're sleeping with. Let's say l'm single and want a boyfriend; must l rush madly into anything that might resemble a relationship in the event that l'm horny so that l might please your arrogant assumption that l'm not simply "settling" for the sex that comes my way? What if l'd like to take my time getting to know people and date while still satisfying my carnal desires? And what in the hell ever implied that just because l am having sex with someone l may not want a relationship with, that l am somehow "settling"? Who says the guy and the sex aren't fucking awesome, but l just don't want a relationship with that particular man? That's not settling; it's a pleasant mutual fuck with someone l find attractive who isn't quite what l'm looking for in a boyfriend.

There's no way you're sliding out of this state of judgment you've voluntarily put yourself in, and your general misogyny, while cleverly deceptive, is still glaringly obvious.
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Posted by freikja on October 17, 2008 at 3:53 PM · Report this
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P.S. Hey, Em, you and l seem to be on the same wavelength. lf you feel like it, you're welcome to contact me through PM on the Forums here. Unless you're already on there and posting under a different handle in which case l probably like you already.
Posted by freikja on October 17, 2008 at 4:23 PM · Report this
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Wow this isn't even the active column anymore and people are still piling on, well far be it from me to leave you hanging!

to freikja:

As I said before, it doesnt mean she has no humility, just that she might not have it. I don't think a lack of confidence is AAU's problem. Unrealistic expectations would be a lot closer.

"Laughably spurious"? Your whole post is laughably spurious. I think you grossly misread AAU. She is puffing herself up, not coming to Dan on her knees in humility. People who write in to Savage Love are willingly exposing themselves to the public, and all the positive and negative comments that entails.

Of course, you are a massive hypocrite like most others who have criticized me, because your little dime store psychological bullshit attempt to psychoanalyze me is exactly what you are trying to criticize me for supposedly doing to AAU.

to bubblex:

Actually I've read Savage Love dating back to the 90s. Some people ALREADY HAVE called me an asshole bubblex, as you have read, so bonus points for pointing out the obvious.

to freikja:

One post not enough for you? Yeah, it is a red flag if a girl comes out and says she is sexually active outside of relationships, because that MIGHT mean she has many different partners, making her a SLUT. Yes folks, a woman who sleeps around with a bunch of guys is a slut. I didn't make that rule, society did. Deal with it. On the other hand, she might have very few or just 1 sex partner, in which case she wouldn't be a slut. Hence the red flag. Red flags are WARNING signs of POSSIBLE problems.

And yes, if a woman really wants a relationship, gets rejected, and settles for sex from the man she wanted the relationship with, that is pathetic.

Your example, a woman who is happy with just having NSA sex, is something I already addressed. As you can see, you are agreeing with what I wrote over a week ago:

"If a woman wants a fuck buddy, have fun."
Posted by kaltes on October 8, 2008 at 5:04 PM
"Well I am not critical of any woman being sexually active without relationships if that is what she likes, far from it, I'd be happy to encourage more of it! ...
But when you have a woman who is settling for less than what she wants and is unhappy as a result, that is a problem for her."
Posted by kaltes on October 9, 2008 at 6:13 PM

If you believe that the guy and the sex are "FUCKING AWESOME", and you want a relationship, you trying to say you don't want one WITH HIM is a load.
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Posted by kaltes on October 17, 2008 at 9:42 PM · Report this
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""Laughably spurious"? Your whole post is laughably spurious. I think you grossly misread AAU. She is puffing herself up, not coming to Dan on her knees in humility."

Exactly how do you know this?

"People who write in to Savage Love are willingly exposing themselves to the public, and all the positive and negative comments that entails."

And? That gives us insight into her situation that we don't have how?

"Of course, you are a massive hypocrite like most others who have criticized me, because your little dime store psychological bullshit attempt to psychoanalyze me is exactly what you are trying to criticize me for supposedly doing to AAU."

Oh, you noticed that, did you? Irritating, isn't it?

"One post not enough for you?"

I put up a post apologizing for the triple post. I don't know why it's not there now, but it was unfortunately beyond my control.

"Yeah, it is a red flag if a girl comes out and says she is sexually active outside of relationships, because that MIGHT mean she has many different partners, making her a SLUT."

Oh, get off your judgmental high horse. First, it MIGHT mean that she does. MIGHT. Secondly, WHO GIVES A FLYING FUCK. If she's safe, who gives a shit who she sleeps with, and how does that make it your business?

"Yes folks, a woman who sleeps around with a bunch of guys is a slut. I didn't make that rule, society did. Deal with it."

And you perpetuate it. At least take some responsibility for your part in that. Although it's nice you finally admit that it was your judgment, not just you putting it out there as some random possibility based on what others might think.

"Hence the red flag. Red flags are WARNING signs of POSSIBLE problems."

Thank you for the enlightening lesson in dating, oh wise one.

"And yes, if a woman really wants a relationship, gets rejected, and settles for sex from the man she wanted the relationship with, that is pathetic."

Ah. Now there's clarification to this that wasn't there before. You were saying that if she settled for sex, period, she's pathetic. Now it's settling for sex from the one she wanted the relationship WITH. l won't judge it as pathetic, because l think we've all been in that position at some point; if not, we've probably at least wished for something, anything, from the person we care for, and that's just human. l don't know that l'd characterize it as healthy, though, l'll agree with that.

"Your example, a woman who is happy with just having NSA sex, is something I already addressed. As you can see, you are agreeing with what I wrote over a week ago:

"If a woman wants a fuck buddy, have fun."

"Well I am not critical of any woman being sexually active without relationships if that is what she likes, far from it, I'd be happy to encourage more of it! ...
But when you have a woman who is settling for less than what she wants and is unhappy as a result, that is a problem for her.""

Okay, I do agree with that. As this week's Savage Love points out, using someone for something other than what you want is unfair, no matter who's doing it. However, you encourage NSA sex for women who are down for that quite shortly after you label that woman a slut. How do you reconcile these two statements in a reasonable manner?

"If you believe that the guy and the sex are "FUCKING AWESOME", and you want a relationship, you trying to say you don't want one WITH HIM is a load."

Why? Why must I have a relationship with a guy I enjoy, but am not necessarily looking for a relationship with? This has happened with me plenty. He may not fit the specifics I'm looking for, but that doesn't mean he's not a great guy with whom I have great sex. Great sex doesn't guarantee a great relationship, nor does it always define the connection and qualities I'm looking for. It also is quite possible that HE isn't looking for a romantic relationship, but our mutual attraction allows for us to have an enjoyable NSA one. I think it's pretty funny that you seem to be informing me of who I should and shouldn't be having a relationship with, based on your spotty reasoning as to why.
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Posted by freikja on October 18, 2008 at 3:14 PM · Report this
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to freikja:

"However, you encourage NSA sex for women who are down for that quite shortly after you label that woman a slut. How do you reconcile these two statements in a reasonable manner?"

First, because I did not 'label' her as a slut for the reasons I've given already. Second, because NSA sex for women is all well and good provided they do not sleep around with lots of different partners. Then it just becomes dirty.

"Why must I have a relationship with a guy I enjoy, but am not necessarily looking for a relationship with? This has happened with me plenty."

You used the words "fucking awesome" to describe the guy. I do not believe that any guy who meets that rather extreme description would not fit what you are looking for.
Posted by kaltes on October 19, 2008 at 1:22 PM · Report this
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"If it doesn't involve slipping the person drugs, physical violence, or serious threats of violence, it is not really rape."

Dude, you honestly believe this?
Posted by Ninja Robot Pirate on October 20, 2008 at 7:17 PM · Report this
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this reminds me of this time when i was about to screw a girl. we were both bombed, and she would only have sex if i wore a condom. well, i hate wearing a condom, so i ripped one open and pretended to put it on. man, was she pissed when i came inside her. but boy did it feel good
Posted by belisarius on October 22, 2008 at 11:52 AM · Report this
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I agree with GG1000. Kaltes, "sexually active and single" (some may call that a slut). Do yourself a favour and remove that word from your vocabulary....No such thing as a slut. It is ok to be sexually active and single. Damn, if everyone who fit that criteria were "sluts" then that would leave little room for self-righteous, wet-behind-the-ears, youngsters like you to feel big about yourselves.
Food for thought: What do all those people who travel the world and move around alot do for a sex life if they are indeed, single and sexually active? How do we go about fitting into your puritanical view of the world? Do tell, honey....Do tell.
Posted by bubble on October 30, 2008 at 7:55 AM · Report this
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Kaltes, in your rebuttal to Sarah, you wrote "women who allow themselves to be used by men." And then you went on to say that men will judge women. Seriously? Has it occurred to you that is doesn't matter what men think? That's right. If men started thinking sex is sex and stopped judging women then people like you would have an eye-opener. You sound really young and insecure but there's a whole world out there of people enjoying sex where the word "slut" doesn't even come into it. It is illogical.
You need to start listening and stop arguing. You can't change your outlook and grow from your experiences if you keep arguing logic and reason. You'll figure this out when you're older or at least go do some travelling and meet different types of people.
Posted by bubble on October 30, 2008 at 9:03 AM · Report this
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Kaltes, in your rebuttal to Sarah, you wrote "women who allow themselves to be used by men." And then you went on to say that men will judge women. Seriously? Has it occurred to you that is doesn't matter what men think? That's right. If men started thinking sex is sex and stopped judging women then people like you would have an eye-opener. You sound really young and insecure but there's a whole world out there of people enjoying sex where the word "slut" doesn't even come into it. It is illogical.
You need to start listening and stop arguing. You can't change your outlook and grow from your experiences if you keep arguing logic and reason. You'll figure this out when you're older or at least go do some travelling and meet different types of people.
Posted by bubble on October 30, 2008 at 9:05 AM · Report this
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belisarius, you do not have the maturity to engage in the act of sex. If that had happened to you. Then how would you feel to have to go to a clinic and find out if you are pregnant or have an incurable disease such as herpes or the virus HIV? I get the impression that you're trying to be a troll on this one but what you did to the person who trusted you was assault and it would have "felt great" if that girl would have brought assault charges against you.
Wait until you have respect for yourself. I will repeat that, respect for yourself before you have sex. You put YOURSELF at risk for catching a multitude of diseases and that leads me to once again say that you are not grown up enough to be having sex. You have a responsibility to your body as well and to your partners. It isn't a joke or a game and you could do with spending a day at clinic and educating yourself. Herpes is painful. I've worked clinics and seen people who could barely walk because of the blisters and HIV is incurable. Have you forgotten about that?
You are no better than a rapist and should stop yourself from being with others in a sexual environment.
That is unbelievable and yes, I know you're a kid and you'll have a laugh but when you catch something you'll spend the rest of life having to treat, it won't be so funny, then, will it?
Posted by bubble on October 30, 2008 at 9:14 AM · Report this
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i would've had more respect for her if she wasn't a slut who gave it up to a one-night stand. i don't think she was on the pill (memory is a little hazy due to heavy drinking at the time), but i gave her a fake number just in case
Posted by belisarius on October 31, 2008 at 1:05 PM · Report this
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Bubble,

No such thing as a slut? That sounds like something a slut would say. Haha. If I am a wet behind the ears youngster, does that make you a dirty old lady?

If it doesn't matter what men think, then shut the fuck up and stop replying to my posts. After all, what I say doesn't matter, so you shouldn't even be READING it let alone responding to it.

Herpes is painful? Why do I get the feeling you are speaking from experience? lol. When you say you have "worked" clinics I hope you don't mean as a prostitute, lol.

belisarius is obviously trolling you, you stupid bubble-head. That guy is hilarious. He is being so obvious about it and you still can't help but take the bait.
Posted by kaltes on November 1, 2008 at 1:59 PM · Report this
178
I take a bit of offense to sarah's post about "Alone Again," as I am a pretty good-looking 21 year old single, sexually active woman. how dare you call someone a slut because she has sex outside of relationships! you don't know anything about this girl. She may just be fiercely independent, like myself, or it could just be a case low self-esteem (which as you did point out, tends to lead one to one-night-stands but rarely any healthy long term relationships.) Either way, I think that the generalizations you're making about 20-something sexual single girls were both off-the-mark and mean-spirited.
Posted by Liz on November 2, 2008 at 7:39 PM · Report this
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kaltes, i'm serious as a heart attack. i would've had more respect for her if she had the self-respect to not act luck a slut. you reap what you sow. liz, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it's a duck
Posted by belisarius on November 3, 2008 at 2:09 PM · Report this
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JC's ex is lucky I wasn't in her place not only would he have been dumped but I would have kicked him square in the balls. There is NO excuse for what he did and guys like him are scum and give all guys a bad name.

And for Princess, trust me you will find your girl. I LOVE bi cd boys and honestly I don't think there are enough in the world or omen who appreciate them.
Posted by RayvenW on November 3, 2008 at 2:59 PM · Report this
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kaltes, way to slut-shame! wow, didn't know it was still 1952 in your mind. i bet you don't even let the boys pin you.judgey-wudgey was a bear!
Posted by redwards on November 3, 2008 at 4:56 PM · Report this
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Hey redwards,

What it is with all the talk of olden days? Do you really think that use of the word "slut" is a vestige of a bygone era? Seriously, people use the word now more than ever, and women use it a lot more than men.

The funny thing is, I never even got judgmental over someone being a slut, but I'm done reasoning with all the stupid people who can't read or understand english.

So yes, if I find out that a girl I'm dating had more than a few sex partners outside of relationships, I'd think that was dirty and I would think less of her.

If I wanted to fuck whores who dropped their pants for every non-hideous person on two legs, I WOULD FUCK OTHER MEN.

;)
Posted by kaltes on November 3, 2008 at 7:19 PM · Report this
183
I date a beautiful glam rocker. I don't think anything in the world could possibly be better, because he's got the whole sexy bowiesque androgyny thing (not to mention he's hung like Bowie too *grin) and he's kinda bad ass because he's a crazy talented bass player and native new yorker who can and will kick ass for me despite weighing 120 lbs, and yes he does look DAMN hot in a dress and makeup.

Best sex I ever had involved a role play where he was a prefect (a girl prefect) and I was a lower form student and he caught me sneaking in late... and I got spanked with a hairbrush and taken advantage of...

seriously, most fun ever because it's so kinky on so many levels
Posted by Miss D on December 13, 2008 at 2:59 AM · Report this
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As for Kaltes: So essentially you're saying, it's okay for a man to be promiscuous but not for a woman? Personally I've had only three sexual partners in my life, but I appreciate the freedom modern society allows me when it comes to when, and with whom I have sex. I had sex with my current boyfriend (relationship now in year two) on our first real date (we'd been friends for about six months before that), and it was beautiful. Sex is about pleasure, and I don't think it says anything about a person whether they want to enjoy that within a relationship or outside of it. Personally I like to be in a relationship, and I like monogamy, but hey, really, whatever floats peoples boats and doesn't harm others is fine.

Who died and made you king of morality?
Posted by miss D on December 13, 2008 at 3:32 AM · Report this
185
I would say to CSPS that he should consider dating bisexual women. My current boy-toy fits a very similar description to yours and he has managed to snag not one but two very attractive bisexual women who are excited to indulge the vast majority of his kinks and who are particularly titillated by gender play!
Posted by riotousgrowlz on May 12, 2009 at 9:53 AM · Report this
186
I've beenr eading all of your older columns today since I never saw this before, and I have to say this is the best explanation of a relationship ever:

"A long-term relationship is, at its core, two people struggling to put up with each other's bullshit—day in, day out, year after year—in exchange for things intangible (love) and things tangible (sex)."

After reading that, I realize that special factor that makes my boyfriend and I work so well: we get that.
Posted by WickedMary on July 1, 2009 at 9:23 PM · Report this

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