Blogs Feb 12, 2009 at 1:55 pm

Dense Thinking

Erica C. Barnett
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Comments

1
No comment on Frizzelle ECB?
on February 12, 2009 at 1:56 PM Report this
2
oh give it a rest, @1.

Very well written article, although you do present the two extremes, when one normally sees development happen in clumps over time, similar to Fremont (which was always zoned for the current density it has for the most part).
on February 12, 2009 at 2:07 PM Report this
3
Meh. It'll happen anyway, just like you wrapped your post up with. They can lament the loss of their "nabe" and perhaps postpone it a few years, but it's already done.
on February 12, 2009 at 2:08 PM Report this
4
Make the zoning changes early enough, clearly enough, and with enough capacity to be relatively permanent and you curb speculative purchasing. Keep zoning unreasonably sparse and you'll have people buying up property, exisitng as slumlords for a while, and then eventually getting an upzone and the profit that comes from it.
What really irks me though is that his vision of his own community seems to see it as permanently and homogenously low-income. That's so pre-Obama.
on February 12, 2009 at 2:10 PM Report this
5
I'm George, George McFly. I'm your density. I mean... your destiny. ...
on February 12, 2009 at 2:14 PM Report this
6
@2 why do we need to give it a rest?

ECB has time to blog about transit and now density?

But nothing pro or con on the Frizzelle? If little Danny Westneat or Nicole Brodeur wrote something even a tenth as bad, ECB would have ripped them a new one.

We're the ones who have to put up with her ridiculous garbage so why not call her out on the total hypocrisy of it all?

on February 12, 2009 at 2:18 PM Report this
7
Hey, is that a Metro drug deal going down, down there in Belltown?

Ahhh! the perks (or should I say Perps) of density!
on February 12, 2009 at 2:18 PM Report this
8
I'd expect this out of Fox. Who with half a brain doesn't?

I'm having a hard time understanding why the Mayor would write this letter. My first guess is that the Mayor is looking forward to his reelection campaign and this is just a stalling tactic...

Hopefully once the election is over we'll get back to sensible policy. Density and mass transit need to go together for either one to achieve their fullest potential.
on February 12, 2009 at 2:22 PM Report this
9
fox wants low income housing in seattle. he will do whatever he can to preserve what's left. the density arguments being made don't address his issue. affordable housing is not low income housing.

why not zone around stations like in belltown - I mean if we want density let's have density. also, how does futurewise (is there a more arrogant name ) deal with different places such as UW stadium.
on February 12, 2009 at 2:31 PM Report this
10
God I hate Fox. He's a fucking tool.
on February 12, 2009 at 2:52 PM Report this
11
Fox loves attention - his take on most everything is off the wall

Signed, Commie who loves poor people
on February 12, 2009 at 2:59 PM Report this
12
Great article, tons of REAL information

Congrats Erica, you are in your niche, exposing the gas bags based on facts and data and graphics

Cheer, cheer
on February 12, 2009 at 3:04 PM Report this
13
regardless of whether one wants the law/mandate or not, doesn't it seem odd that the state would order the city to do this without giving funding towards the project
on February 12, 2009 at 3:08 PM Report this
14
"People buy and sell houses; density increases. That's how cities work..." I guess if it's inevitable, the government might as well hasten it with zoning incentives and tax breaks? And the renters below, say, 60 percent median, who don't get displaced? Does it matter if the rental market is completely failing them, and the only thing left is for them to pay inordinate amounts of their income in rent or live on the outskirts of the city? Or is that just "how cities work"?
on February 12, 2009 at 3:10 PM Report this
15
Oops I meant "who get displaced"
on February 12, 2009 at 3:14 PM Report this
16
People can decide not to move here too.

Growth is not inevitable.
on February 12, 2009 at 3:54 PM Report this
17
why not take those twelve single family homes (looks like they sit on about 14 lots) and make urban cottages for people who need them - like older people (65 - 90 yrs old. Yes, that will be boomers in droves and in less than a decade). How about 42 nicely designed 900 sq ft cottages. Sun, neighborhood fit; jesus - the old people could have neighbors and grow tomatoes.... or eggplant or bok choy....... is this just too far out of the developer/city box?
on February 12, 2009 at 4:04 PM Report this
18
You know the difference between density zealots like ECB who want to force people to live a certain way and animal rights nuts like NARN who want to ban fois gras?

Trick question - there is none.

on February 12, 2009 at 4:38 PM Report this
19
There's 17.5 stations in Seattle.

1 Rainier Beach
2 Othello
3 Columbia City
4 Mt Baker
5 Beacon Hill
6 Sodo
7 Stadium
8 ID
9 Pioneer Square
10 University Street
11 Westlake
12 Capitol Hill
13 UW
14 Brooklyn
15 Roosevelt
16 Northgate
17 Raineer

and 145th borders the city limits, and part of the 1490's .5 mile area is in the city.
on February 12, 2009 at 4:42 PM Report this
20
@8,

Um, maybe because actual City planners realized that Futurewise's one-size-fits-all approach pretty much has its head up its ass?

on February 12, 2009 at 4:52 PM Report this
21
@17 yes why not, why don't you go buy the land get the loan and do it?

@18 if there are some zones that are dense you don't have to live there. So it's the antidensity folks -- like you -- who are like NARN. You want folks to not have a choice to live in denser zones, they want people to not have a choice to eat foie gras.

When SOME zones are more dense, it doesn't mean EVERY where is.

Duh.
on February 12, 2009 at 5:09 PM Report this
22
@13 Did you read the post? There is no project, its just a zoning requirement.

@18 So in your world allowing people to do things equals forcing them? You are free to seek out what ever kind of housing you want and that you can afford. This does not change that in anyway. If there is no demand for density around transit stations there will be no development.
on February 12, 2009 at 5:20 PM Report this
23
...well, if you go down to Olympia and try and upzone someone else's neighborhood without their input, you might expect that folks will be a little pissed off at your arrogance and, yes, your attempt to impose YOUR view of how they should live on them. And rightly so.

BTW - Seattle spent lots of time doing this very expensive thing called a neighborhood planning process, during which just about every station area was already substantially upzoned.

You want to move to Belltown or Capitol Hill? Be my guest - no one is stopping you.



on February 12, 2009 at 5:22 PM Report this
24
Thanks for reporting about the zoning of three of the station areas in Seattle. Finally, some real, actual reporting amongst the endless blogosphere blathering. Any idea about the other 14 stations in Seattle?

Wouldn't it be ironic, given the fire and brimstone lobbed hither and yon, if this bill doesn't even apply to Seattle at all?
on February 12, 2009 at 5:23 PM Report this
25

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