On Thursday, December 22, Dangers, a hardcore band from Southern California, loaded their gear into West Seattle’s American Legion Hall, excited to play another show on their West Coast tour. The show never happened, though—a threat of violence shut it down. As 50 or more kids paid the $7 cover charge and filed into the venue, about a dozen members of a small but intimidating gang called FSU (Friends Stand United, or, as some call them, Fuck Shit Up), quietly stood outside the building. Dangers’ singer, Al Brown, wasn’t surprised FSU was there. A few months ago, when Dangers played a house show in Tacoma, members of FSU showed up, and according to Brown, said, “If Dangers plays, Al’s going to the hospital.”

Hoping to avoid any sort of conflict this time around, Brown and Matt Weltner, the show’s booker, approached the group of men. “It was explained that as long as we didn’t do anything ‘faggoty,’ we would be all right,” says Brown. “They said they were there to respect hardcore and as long as they weren’t disrespected, then nothing bad would happen.”

Dangers, an abrasive hardcore quartet of young twentysomethings, could play, but they couldn’t perform “Neo Neo-Nazis (Stop Fucking Shit Up),” a song where Brown criticizes FSU’s violent practices. If they did, the men told Brown, “You know what’s gonna happen,” alluding to the past, when Brown suffered minor injuries after being assaulted by FSU members outside a show in L.A. (Police weren’t called.) In lieu of censoring their set, or suffering the violent consequences, Weltner and Dangers decided to cancel the show.

The fact that a dozen guys have made it their mission to dictate what can and can’t happen in the scene and are capable of shutting down a local hardcore show is alarming. Seattle’s music community has worked hard to make all-ages concerts legal and safe—and those shows have overwhelmingly been safe since the passing of the All-Ages Dance Ordinance in 2002. Even more surprising is the fact that the incident was completely ignored by local media. If a dozen young black men showed up to a local hiphop show threatening fans, performers, and promoters with violence, it’d easily make front-page news. Seattle’s chapter of FSU is, for the most part, a group of linebacker-sized white males in their early to mid-20s who often wear FSU T-shirts and sweatshirts and come from suburban neighborhoods. And despite being tied to a number of violent incidences over the past two years, they still aren’t on the radar as anything more than a nuisance.

FSU started in the ’80s as a group on the East Coast aiming to eliminate racism from the hardcore music scene. As Nazi skinheads became less prominent in the community (perhaps due in part to the work of groups like FSU), the gang sort of fizzled out. They re-emerged in the mid-’90s in areas like Boston, New Jersey, Arizona, Los Angeles, and Seattle. While the group doesn’t seem to have a discernable political agenda today (members declined to comment when asked), FSU members have claimed on message boards that their actions are in response to those who “speak out against them” or “disrespect” them. All they’re asking for, they say, is respect, and if they feel they aren’t getting it, the situation often ends in violence.

Earlier this month, one incident involving FSU’s Arizona chapter came to a fatal conclusion. According to the Arizona Daily Star, members of FSU, armed with hammers and machetes, invaded the venue and started shoving concertgoers. The fights moved out onto the street and one injured young man ran to his car, pulled a gun, and fired a shot at an FSU member who was chasing him. The FSU member died at the hospital later that night.

Luckily, things have yet to turn that tragic in Seattle, but the city has still suffered its share of blows. According to his bandmates and concertgoers who were there, a member of a local hardcore band suffered minor injuries after a show in Seattle when members of FSU jumped him, allegedly for “talking shit” about them on a local message board. And this summer, concertgoers reported that another kid was attacked during a Paradox concert when he confronted FSU guys for hitting his friend in the mosh pit. Twenty-year-old Lucas Thilman says he was beaten at a house party last July, when members of FSU refused to leave. He suffered a concussion, brain contusions, and a broken hand. FSU has also reportedly threatened a number of local music fans and bookers, to the point where some feel it’s unsafe to book and attend shows. While members of FSU were reached for comment, they declined to say anything on record.

According to the Seattle Police Department, the cops looked into FSU after another incident at Studio Seven, a rock club in the SoDo neighborhood, but considered the gang to be of little threat since they are a small group and seemingly disorganized. Still, certain members of Seattle’s hardcore scene have had enough.

Earlier this week, three men were fired from their security jobs at the rock club El Corazón because they have ties to FSU. El Corazón owner Lori LeFavor says it was a difficult decision to make, but she felt as though she had little choice since she’s received a number of phone calls and e-mails from concerned parents who don’t feel comfortable sending their kids to a venue that employs “gang members.”

Also following Thursday’s incident, a group of bookers, band members, and music fans joined forces and decided to take a stand against FSU. Though they’re still in talks as to what actions need to be taken, they’ve brainstormed ideas including alerting area club owners as to who local FSU members and bands are and organizing citywide boycotts against clubs and people who support them.

LeFavor hopes a peaceful conclusion can be reached. She’s offering to host a “State of Hardcore” public forum at El Corazón. The public would be invited to come voice their concerns and start searching for solutions regarding the current problems in the hardcore scene.

Some still feel, though, that more drastic measures need to be taken. One man, a music fan who has been active in the hardcore community for almost a decade in every role from musician to booker (and who wants to remain anonymous out of concern for his safety), first noticed a problem two years ago. “When one member of FSU busted in the face of a 15-year-old kid at the Redmond Fire House, that was the first indication there was a problem,” he says. “We hoped the violence would go away, but obviously, when they’re capable of rolling up to a DIY show and getting it shut down, things have only gotten worse. Now’s the time to start doing something about it.”

megan@thestranger.com

Megan Seling is The Stranger's managing editor. She mostly writes about hockey, snacks, and music. And sometimes her dog, Johnny Waffles.

88 replies on “Shit’s Fucked Up”

  1. If the alternative to drinking and promiscuous sex is random violence, intimidation and unbridled self righteousness, i’ll have another shot, please.

    fuck fsu and fuck spoiled white boys with baseball bats. No one get’s my respect without earning and if those jerks want anyone to respect them they should sit the fuck down and let everyone have a good time.

    I really hope this conversation happens and that we get fsu out of our city. Everyone deserves to be safe and we shouldn’t have to be looking over our shoulders and shows and parties, hoping not to say the wrong thing about the wrong person. Fsu doesn’t own this town, it’s music scenes or it’s venues.

  3. Who looks at Henry Rollins funny because he reads too many books? I thought it was because he grips his microphone in a defensive stance as though he expects to be jumped by his lecture audience at any given moment.

    Yeah, FELLA, I probably am that kind of punk. But I say we need more Rollins’ and Biafras, fewer Rottens and Vicious’, and way fewer dangerous dickheads.

    FSU: throw away your brass knuckles and volunteer at a soup kitchen.

  4. fuck all you haters of fsu i support everything that they do for the scene and everthing else we are down in the SC and trying to start our own fsu so fuck all the haters of fsu

  6. I have seen the episode of Gangland about this crew or gang called FSU. I’ve heard about them starting fights with people just for drinking a beer at a show or for just bumping into one of them by accident. These dudes are the biggest hypocrites I’ve ever seen. They preach unity and brotherhood, but they actually feed off of the fear and intimidation, of innocent people. What kind of unity and brotherhood is that? Notice how they don’t have a chapter in NYC. They wouldn’t last a second here in NYC or Long Island or any of the 5 boros. They have destroyed people lives and committed murder a few times. They are just as bad as any of the negative gangs out there.

  8. there a bunch of fucking Nazis.
    they do nothing more than what nazis did in the 80’s. the swarm attack is SO SO fucking PUSSY. fight someone one on one you fucking idiots. thats the only way pussy ass punks can fight. you get mad when people drink and do drugs, WHY? who gives a shit, its your own personal freedom, again another nazi-commi tactic. id love to see these assholes show up in ATL at rap show and talk shit about drinking, they wouldnt leave the spot they were standing, maybe in a ambulance straight to grady. they target people that are alone or with like 3 people, then 25 of them attack. we beat the shit out of people that dont like our beliefs, wow so did the christains in the crusades, the nazis in germany, the commifucks in china, i mean come on you think beating up people that want to have fun is cool. thats why i pack, point blank period. the assfuck JOE HARDCORE, come on man, does this retard have any idea his name he took is a gay porn star! lmao

  9. does FSU even exist anymore? I thought they disbanded when they got too old to keep living in their parents’ basements. If they are still around, I’d love it if someone would point me to a show where I might be able to find them. Some of those sissies came up from Boston and tried to overrun a Hatebreed show when I lived in Maine. We beat them like rented mules and sent them running back to the suburbs.

  10. FSU are cowards they claim to be against drugs and the dealers but why aren’t they fighting with MS-13 or Latin Kings groups that really have a foothold in the Boston drug scene.They will get killed is why they are nothing but chicken-hawks preying on the weak and defenseless.I live here in Boston that is and I have never seen them do anything but pick on kids weaker than them.

  11. fuck all you all bitches I dontgive afuck about your skinhead pride and i dont care about your lower eastside…… if your really hardcore you know this is the one and only motherfucking hardcore band ( slapshot. aggie front… madball… and discipline…) not included lick my whole asshole bitches

  14. Before I mention FSU I will set the standard for a real punk rock gang. In the mid 1980’s punk gangs consisted of Circle One The Family, East Side Punks, Urban Punk Assault, Hungry Gang, LADS, The Drunks, L.A. Firm, North Side Firm, and The X Men. These gangs were not straight edge and none of these gangs were nazi’s. Most of these punk gangs had drug using Mexicans, Whites, and Blacks!!

    The shows were in crime ridden South Central LA, and East Los Angeles. They fought traditional Black gangs and Mexican gangs. These fought so punks could walk down the street with out being harassed. FSU can not light a candle next to these older and true punk rock gangs. FSU is not voicing the needs of all punk rockers. They are only voicing their own personal agenda. FSU makes noise until a new generation pushes them into history.

    What will FSU do when the Maravilla gang, or Avenues gang, or 18 Street gang go after them? These gangs each have thousands of members in prisons and in Los Angeles streets. What will FSU do when they get their attention? These and other LA gangs have weapons and members consisting of hard convicted felons. FSU should not try to get their attention.

  15. No offense, but all you who support FSU are fucking whack. I realize you may believe drugs and alcohol is wrong, or that it is what is causing problems in your scene(not a hardcore fan) but that doesnt give anyone the right to randomly just start shit with people they dont agee with. Seems the “group” started with good intentions but looking at the evolution it has definetly reached “gang” like status. I personally do smoke pot occasionally and drink so does this make me a bad person. Personally i would rather have the laid back druggie then the people who think there so god damn tough and act as if they need to prove it. Personally i feel these people need to start having fun with your lives and try being happy rather than mad. Dont worry about everyone else and just live YOUR life. And if beating the piss out of someone is fun to you, then YOU are the one with problems and should probably seek help because noone should constantly be mad at the world. Im just happy i am not a hardcore fan, musics to negative anyway and thats the problem with the scene to you trying to pin it on drugs.

  16. FSU origanl basis was just but as of today they seem to be the problem. You people from the hardcore scene say the problem is drugs and alcohol. The reason there are the problems that fsu say they are fighting is that which make the hardcore scene what it is. Your music is angry(at least sounding cant understand lyrics),and you dance by throughing your body violently in every direction so what do you expect. With music that tends to draw angry people lost in society and you get a rough atmosphere I.E. the hardcore scene. Ive been to many of parties shows and never have i had the need to beat the shit out of someone and yes i was either drunk high or tripping. The fact is i have rarely scene a physical fight break out. The reason people heresupport fsu i you are the same type of person as them and for that im sorry because you clearly have the wrong view on life. Smoke a joint and mellow out, then eat some shrooms and i know your outlooks on life will be better and you’ll see the glass as half full not half empty

  17. This sounds like I song I once heard.

    “Punk ain’t no religious cult. Punk means thinking for yourself. You ain’t hardcore ’cause you spike your hair, when a jock still lives inside your head.

    “If you’ve come to fight, get out of here. You ain’t no better than the bouncers. We ain’t trying to be police. When you ape the cops, it ain’t anarchy.

    “Ten guys jump one, what a man! You fight each other, the police state wins. Stab your backs when you trash our halls. Trash a bank, if you’ve got real balls!”

    Then again, since I’m under 25, I’m not a true punk, so what do I know about it?

  18. FSU is lame..
    if they really wanted to keep the “scene” real. then they would let anyone speak their beliefs.
    whether that be religious, political, etc.

  19. Ok, here’s the deal. The vast majority of the people knocking FSU on this thread, have no idea what Hardcore is. You are the people that chime in with “yeah, I listen to some hardcore, like Pantera and Metallica.” All I see is everyone on here saying give me a break. How about you give me a fucking break and shut up about FSU. If you had half a mind of how stupid and commercial Hardcore has become, you would understand where they’re coming from.

    Hardcore has become about fashion, kids coming to shows to hook up, or to just plain be seen at the show. What FSU is doing, is simply trying to hold on to something and keep it pure. Ask any parent in the world, you want a child to grow up right you need discipline. Well Hardcore is there child, and without discipline and guidance, it will become just another fad.

    So basically, what I’m trying to say is. Fuck all you ignorant holier than thou assholes who feel that FSU member deserve to die. I’m sure there was one point in your life where you bullied someone at school, or at work, or at church and you felt damn proud of yourself for being superior to them. Stop being hypocrits, don’t talk shit about a subject you don’t know about, and stay the fuck out of hardcore.

  20. FSU and hardkorners beware – if you disrespet me I will roll up on you because that is how I rowl.

    I come from the BH 94110 and my Cal Anderson posse and Lincoln Res / bobbyMo gang will ice-latte your asses. We will get postmodern up upon thee. I defakate you not – respet the Frank TJ Mackey!

    Lower NW Side (aka the pine trees) Rulz! These colors don’t run!
    Love it or leave it!

    -Peter John Thomas

  21. FSU and hardkorners beware – if you disrespet me I will roll up on you because that is how I rowl.

    I come from the BH 94110 and my Cal Anderson posse and Lincoln Res / bobbyMo gang will ice-latte your asses. We will get postmodern up upon thee. I defakate you not – respet the Frank TJ Mackey!

    Lower NW Side (aka the pine trees) Rulz! These colors don’t run!
    Love it or leave it!

    -Peter John Thomas

  23. FSU has become just another gang, no different than those other “ghetto” gangs. They jump other people, if you catch one of them alone then you’ll see how big of a pussy they really are. They now have that mob mentality. No matter how FSU tries to justify their extistance they are another hate group.

    This isn’t about hardcore and commercialism anymore its about gang violence. If this keeps up that guy in AZ isn’t gonna be the last one to die. “You play you pay”, now you FSU guys will learn the meaning of that first hand.

  24. I just don’t understand how the supporters of FSU don’t get that they’ve become what they hated. Why did they hate the Nazis? It was a group of people coming to shows intimidating people and beating people down for how they looked or who they were. what is the difference with FSU? I’ve been going to shows since 1990 in CT when the scene was really violent with groups like the leach mob. it’s all a gang mentality. Punk/hardcore is about showing the outside world that there is a different way of doing things and we don’t need to cling to their ideals cause we have our own. Gangs in general make me sick but especially when it involves hardcore because thats something that had a positive effect on my life. I think it’s great when people are straight edge and that is one more way of rejecting societys norms but don’t force it on others. The whole respect thing is a prison mentality and if thats all they want let them go to prison and fight for it. There is a certain degree of danger and violence in the hardcore scene that i always liked but just not fights. If there is any truth that some of the FSU people did join biker gangs, that tells you something right there. There’s some people that like hardcore because it is loud aggressive music and a soundtrack to their fighting and others like myself that always looked at it as a way of life.

  25. Fuck FSU they are a bunch of tough guys that arent tough. First off they are not all Straight Edge some of them are retarded assed drunk bums. I feel bad for these hippy cities like Seattle that are too scared or weak to stand up to these pussies. If they in fact did they would see that there is nothing more than the fear and rumors that are spread(prob.by themselves to make people scared)and they would see they are really quite laughable. Every year for 6 years they show up to the Chain Reaction music festivalin Anaheim Ca. and try to tough-guy everyone. You know what happens???? Every year they get beat up by Grudge City Straight Edgers. The good people of Grudge City (SLC) the real straight edgers go to enjoy some of the best bands in hardcore and every year FSU starts shit and gets beat up.
    Just my thought but maybe if people besides Grudge City put these kids in their place they would no longer be a threat anywhere. Just my 2 cents.

  26. im gonna guess that none of you people listen to metal or punk because you keep claming its the musics fault and rappers never do this BULLSHIT there are more gangs based on rap then any other music so dont get pissed because a group of friends who listen to a different kind of music decided to fight back.
    i think FSU should be rewarded for getting rid of nazis and gang banging garbage. the country has failed to protect us from gangs so tey formed a “militia” to protect themselves from real gang members, as was there right. 2nd ammendment cock suckers

  27. i love how the argument for fsu is they are cleaning things up no they are not they are a bunch of punks and thae kid that got shot in my oppinion had it coming if someone comes at me with any weapon i am going to retaliate with deadly force and saying they are anti drinking and drug hahahaha i have a friend who just joined the seattle division and you are nothing but a bunch of white shaved head guys who drink excessivly and sell drugs weird kinda sounds like skin heads huh your all a bunch of gangmembers that are no better then bloods crips or any other gang and need to be delt with as such i honestly hope that this group meets a real gang “81” and has to deal with that

  28. Ganging up on people who have done little or nothing wrong do NOT qualify as unity and/or brotherhood. I have no respect for people who gang up on the weak to flaunt their “authority”. And if you want to stop people from drug and alcohol abuse, become a fucking cop.

  29. Shut the fuck up about respect, you FSU bro’s. Why the fuck would i possibly respect anyone affiliated with a mindless, violent organization of skinheads?

  30. people need to get the fuck over it if your scared of fsu dont go to shows. most of you are just scared little scene kids talking shit and deserve to get punched in the mouth. i dont know any fsu guys but ive seen them at shows before and yeah they do come in and run shit. but who cares if you cant stand the hit get the fuck out the pit. and as i see it slc edge guys are way worse fighting people for smoking a ciggerette next to them what the fuck is that. if you dont talk shit you have nothing to worry about everyones scared for no reason.grow some balls and if you got a problem with fsu or anyone else then learn how to stand up for yourself and settle shit face to face. hardcores about standing up for what you believe in. and standing up for yourself. also alot of people other then fsu go to hardcore shows to fuck shit up. id like to think that terror is one of the best hardcore bands in the scene right now and they keep shit real. go listen to what they have to say before you judge the scene.

  32. sounds to me that these FSU idiots are nothing but a bunch of cowards. If your so-called friend cant hold his/her own in a fight then go home coward…. no need for a swarm of cowards to start a beat down. heck a swarm of retardted kids can beat down 1 person. So is that what you all are??? A bunch of retarded kids?? Yeah thats what FSU is

  33. If you idiots believe everything this Elgin james tells you then you all are dumber then I ever thought. hell i can say i did a whole lot of everything but in reality done nothing. This Elgin james is a good story teller. But just like every gang that relies on numbers, you catch one of them alone and they will cry pussy talk. Whine, cry and pleade that you dont beat them down. See Elgin james and the rest of his coward followers are nothing unless they swarm you.. Please dont believe everything these cowards tell you. it is bad enough Gangland gave them the time of day. Anyone who acts like a bunch of animals need to rethink their lives or just put a bullit in your head loser boys

  34. What the fuck…I thought FSU stood for Florida State University. I graduated that shithole in ’92 and was so fucking happy to get out of Leon…Guess that makes me a FSU’er

  35. FSU once stood as a small group fighting against the neo nazis in the scene that spread all across america. I say fuck yes to that. But the fact that they get a group of buffed jocked out headstrung that jump kids on their own belief is a hock of shit. I’ve been living on the street since 13 years old and the only people i ever met on the street were people addicted to things, which in turn, turned me into an alcoholic. I’ve been fighting my way to kick the addiction. And for some jerk off jocks to jump kids because of the way they are is some pussy shit. People live with different kind of lives which i think FSU first stood for in uniting in the begining, Now the once neo-nazis they were fighting, they have become controlling the scene acting there above everybody because they run with groups. I know theres one or two of FSU still left with a brain and can fucking understand that they have become the people they fought in the first place. Its not black and white racism, It’s ignorance of one person black or white and not knowing they way they have grown up and known. It’s sad to see a great forward looking movement to protect, to become jockrockers who talk later about jumping one kid. You are the New neo-nazis.

  36. Hardcore to you = Jumping a single kid with weapons. Hardcore to me = standing up against people like you. You are what should be known as pussycore.

  37. Hardcore to you = Jumping a single kid with weapons. Hardcore to me = standing up against people like you. You are what should be known as pussycore.

  38. Hardcore to you = Jumping a single kid with weapons. Hardcore to me = standing up against people like you. You are what should be known as pussycore.

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