Apparently, December 3rd was going to be “Yelp Day” in San Francisco. But at the last minute, the mayor canceled the celebration. Apparently, the founders of Yelp, which is a San Francisco-based company, voted against Proposition 8, but they removed posts that identified owners of businesses as Prop. 8 supporters. Yelp claimed that the reviews were removed because they were about the politics of the owners and not specific to the products or services provided by the businesses.
Here is the story of how Yelp Day got canned:
The removal of reviews didn’t sit well with Matthew Goudeau, director of the mayor’s Office of Protocol and a then-frequent user of Yelp. He forwarded us an e-mail exchange he had last month with Jeremy Stoppelman, Yelp’s co-founder.
Stoppelman told Goudeau it was akin to somebody opposed to foie gras giving bad reviews to all restaurants that use the controversial pate, even if they’d never dined at the establishments.
“I am not foie gras. I am a person. No comparison between the two,” Goudeau shot back. “People should have the right to know what businesses supported the inclusion of hate and discrimination into California’s constitution.”
Goudeau canceled his Yelp account and encouraged his friends to do the same. He stressed he did this all on his own time and not in any official capacity, but when he heard the mayor was about to name a day after Yelp, he told chief of staff Steve Kawa about his concerns.
Is someone keeping a master list of Prop. 8 supporting businesses? Would Yelp wind up on that list?
Yelp was correct to remove the false reviews. Good on them. Fuck Goudeau, he can find his list elsewhere.
And would Yelp wind up on that list? Rating places you’ve never been to based on the political views of their owner (which people still have no clue about) screws up the ratings. It has nothing to do with Yelp supporting Prop 8.
Are you going to start including the author’s and publisher’s position Prop 8 in all of your book reviews, Paul?
They should not have removed reviews that point out businesses owned by bigots who supported this or any other hateful measure or a particular political view. I think it’s a perfectly reasonable factor to know and think about when you choose what businesses to patronize.
Yelp blows anyway.
And then Goudreau screamed “What am I, chopped liver?”
The nice thing about the Internet is …
It has a Wayback Machine.
Use it.
POP. All the posts are back.
Now go screen scrape your database.
Here endeth the lesson.
I too think it is not Yelp’s responsibility to keep those reviews up. If Goudeau wanted a list of Prop 8 supporting businesses, he should start his own website. blah blah blah most boring comment ever.
Politics of owners in Yelp reviews is totally off topic. You want to publicize that a local business owner is an asshole in their off time, Yelp isn’t the place for that.
Same goes for those post-breakup couples that can’t help but have entire cryptic conversations through Missed Connections. Fuck off you nitwits, no wonder you got dumped, you’ve got the communication skills of a casserole (if they could only talk!). This is what we want to see in Missed Connections 1. Where? 2. When 3. Description of myself 4. Where you want to meet (hint: “coffee” is incorrect).
What were we talking about? Oh yeah, “Yelp Day” on December 3rd? Not on International Day of Disabled Persons… uh, Day, you don’t!
McCarthy would be awed by the gall of the anti Prop 8 Fascist.
If that what’s reviewers care about, what’s it to yelp. Yelp should’ve kept the comments.
Yes, my pretty, alienate the friendly business interests who are trying to create some sort of wall between their sales and their politics. The gay rights movement doesn’t need sponsors. Not. At. All. Because we have such rapport with minorities, right? Hell, the gay rights movement can probably stand alone on its own merits, independent of any allies at all. Fucking brilliant.
Good. Should my partner and I ever visit SF again I would like to know what businesses supported prop 8 or harbor employees who supported prop 8. After having perused the Yelp site (rather poorly designed) I would think there would be a better site or at least a more efficient one to provide this information anyway. It is bizarre to read apologist (to say the least) postings on Slog (i.e., elenchos aka Dennis, Eugene, Dougsf, etc.) who seem to think that those who are the target of an anti-gay action by a populace should just lie there and take it like some rape victim. To you apologists I say, go fuck yourselves and I can only hope that someday I’ll have the pleasure of being able to vote on something to take a right away from you or someone you love. And just to make something very, very clear. This faggot doesn’t want your or anyone else’s tolerance. Tolerance implies inferiority, as though we have to put up with something we find inferior about someone else. I couldn’t give a shit whether you accept me or not, your approval is not wanted or welcome. When we’re talking about civil or equal rights, we don’t need to like each other or get along personally to have the same rights.
Mark,
Would you really like to discover how much of the support for the gay community is about ideals, or as you would prefer to call them, ‘inalienable’ rights? Do you think any t.v. shows have gay characters in them, or some jobs offer DP benefits, or resorts have ‘gay days’ out of the goodness of their little corporate hearts? Or is it because they find some real profit in doing so? By all means, test out your theory on natural rights. Because if these businesses think we are lawsuit-and-boycott happy, they will drop our business–and be rapidly courted by the Christians.
Pat Boone compares opponents of Proposition 8 to the Mumbai terrorists. Calls gays “Sexual Jihadists.:
From the equally evil World Net Daily:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?f…
@13
You are trapped in needing approval and paralyzed by fear.
I’d like to know how many people in these comments who support “separation of politics and business” don’t shop at Wal-Mart. Hell, that’s at LEAST half of Seattle, right? I have no interest in lining the pockets of a business owner who supports a cause I abhor, so I think it’s a perfectly valid point to mention in a review. That said, no one should trust a single comment by a random reviewer as gospel. Maybe the bigger problem is that Yelp doesn’t think it’s users are smart enough to parse the information on their site? Personally I’d like a little more benefit of the doubt. I will concede that keeping this information from screwing up reviews is a puzzle, but I hardly think the politics of the ownership are irrelevant to a business as a whole.
Btw Yelp, I would find the information about foie gras helpful as well. So you can keep that in while you’re at it.
#12 – this issue isn’t whether or not people should have this information – I think they should. You have every right to know who your money is supporting. I would commend you if you organized this data and posted it online for all to access. This issue is whether or not Yelp has the right to take down off-topic posts, which they do.
I don’t think anyone “should just lay there and take it like some rape victim” either, don’t put that on me, and I also think you should rethink your fucking language. I’m guessing by your name only one of us actually voted against Prop 8, should I put that on your Facebook page? Or would that be stupid, because it’s beside the point that my orange chicken was cold and greasy when it got to my house?
No Mark,
I am gay, but have nothing invested in the marriage business. If only we gays had shown such solidarity to each other as those businesses had shown to our money, then Prop 8 would not have passed. I prefer to maintain my right as a responsible consumer to shop wherever I please. I don’t find it particularly responsible to attempt to limit, through guilt or other means, the ability of other people to do the same.
CB@16
My partner and I have never shopped at Wal-Mart. That doesn’t mean that I haven’t given my business to an organization that I oppose politically or socially as a result of not knowing their failings ever. Therein lies the point. Until you are made aware of their position/action can you make an informed choice. Your point about not relying on the review of a single commenter is spot on. I’m a librarian by trade and multiple sources are very important to making an informed decision. Comments on Yelp (again, a poorly designed and inefficient site) are a starting place but not a final say. Unfortunately I doubt most people have the attention span to care. The “3 click rule” and all.
Mark, I think we agree. I might not have been as clear as I intended. I’ve certainly given money to business owners I may not have, had I had more information. That’s why I’m fine with people mentioning these things in their reviews. So yes, I agree (unfortunately, I agree about many users as well). Cheers!
In answer to Paul’s last question. Yes, Yelp should be placed on such a list with the description that it is a site which protects businesses who supported and/or harbor employees who supported prop 8. Just as Talkingpointsmemo allowed the Yes on 8 campaign to advertise for funds on their site and should also be included on such a list.
i use yelp regularly. i think proposition 8 should rot in hell.
that said, yelp is a review site. if you haven’t used the service, visited the restaurant, etc. you can’t very well review it. that means that people who want to post positive reviews of their friend’s restaurant even though they’ve never eaten there should not be able to. people who want to post negative reviews even though they’ve never eaten there should also not be able to.
these articles say that yelp removed reviews from people who hadn’t actually tried the thing they were reviewing and were just posting a review to say “this business sucks because the owner voted for proposition 8”. it doesn’t say that reviews were removed in circumstances where people said “i went here, the food sucked, AND i found out that the owner voted for prop 8”, etc.
if the mayor wants an easy list of which businesses supported proposition 8, he certainly has enough political power to not only get that list but to make it readily accessible on the city’s website in an easily printable format.
So… the anti-8-supporter boycott has extended to boycott folks who don’t have the same opinion about the editorial function of dining reviews.
Don’t overreach.
I see Mark explains that yes business who “harbor employees who supported prop 8” are a problem.
Mark in Colorado, you keep saying people should know which businesses “harbor” employees who supported prop 8. Are you using this word on purpose? Because to me it implies that you’d prefer to see businesses fire employees who hold a disagreeable political view.
My yelp account is now cancelled. The Stranger has restaurant reveiws anyway.
Yelp is now, and has always been a hate-fest. Die in a Fire, Yelp.
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Actually, the problem with this whole issue is that the protesters on Yelp weren’t suave enough. They all should have visited the establishment in one large mass, THEN each of them should have gone onto Yelp to complain that the service was too slow (you know because of all the protesters, but details shmetails), THEN mention that the business supported Proposition 8.
Legitimate visit
Legitimate complaint
Legitimate political side note
SUCCESS!
So I’m guessing you guys in Capitol Hill probably don’t want to know that the pizza place near Chop Suey has hosted pro-Rossi get-togethers.
No one is stopping you from spilling the beans on Yelp! I mean, most of you have been there anyway, right?
Feel free to ramsack all similar businesses. Community spirit!
wtf? yelp is the greatest site ever invented. i love you yelp!
People who supported Prop 8 should wear yellow stars so we can know to avoid them and their businesses.
They should also have to sit at the back on Metro. Also I’m not comfortable drinking from the same water fountain or sitting at a diner counter with those dirty bigots.
I think detention camps should definitely be considered.
@30 – Ha! I see what you did there, how clever. Sorry, that shit doesn’t fly here. I don’t want to segregate or strip the rights of these folks, but if they are doing that to me and others, which they HAVE and ARE, I would like to stop directly contributing to that.
wow deafman23, I thought i could sn…
what?..you can’t hear me?..
WOW DEAFMAN23, I THOUGHT I COULD SNEAK THAT PAST YOU BUT YOU’RE TOO SHARP!