When I saw this headline…

Romance difficult with three in the bed

…I immediately assumed the story had something to do with threeways, open relationships, or polyamory.

UPDATE: That I immediately assumed this CNN headline, which I saw while half asleep, linked to a story about non-monogamy tells you everything you need to know about the clips and stories I slog through on a typical Monday morning. I clicked through expecting to find yet another piece by yet another mainstream media “sexpert” issuing dire warnings about the dangers of open relationships—they never get around to writing up relationships that fail when monogamous partners take each other for granted or succumb to the despair that monogamy can induce (can induce ≠ always induces)—and not a story about the “family bed,” or letting your small children sleep with you every night, which has to be the worst idea in the whole sordid history of parenting.

Like many parents who do the family bed, the author and her husband do what they can to maintain their sexual bond…

The first time we tried having sex after the baby was born, I got one of those horrible, gut-wrenching feelings that come with the possibility that one’s own mother is right. There we were, awkward and stiff, stuffed into the far corner of the bed, afraid to move, afraid to move the baby and have her wake and make the whole thing moot. We built a stack of pillows just tall enough to separate us from her, as if we could just do our business like she wasn’t there.

Hm… I wonder what the reaction would be from the usual gay-hatin’ suspects if gay parents admitted to doing what comes unnaturally with their kid sleeping in their bed.

41 replies on “Says Who?”

  1. And, I thought of young children that climb into their parents beds, or are put down there for the night. Not my cup of tea.

  2. I don’t know anything about romance, but it is hard to actually sleep with three people in bed. The middle person can’t get in and out or regulate temperature without disturbing the other two.

    If it were a wiggly little kid, ugh, that would be extra awful.

  4. I agree, romance dies with only three people in the bed; you need at least 4 or 5 guys in bed to keep the flames burning and passion alive.

  6. @3,

    We know you don’t give a shit, it’s just that we enjoy emphasising it for you personal amusement. It’s our way of showing you that we care.

  7. “My husband and I first brought the baby into bed because rushing in to check on a newborn every ten minutes never worked for us.”

    First: There’s a reason you’re told not to do this. Babies are accidentally smothered by their parents in their sleep every year when people do anyway. At the PICU where I’m shadowing, there was a family trying to decide whether to remove life support from their infant who was essentially brain dead after her father accidentally rolled on her in his sleep. It was heartbreaking.

    Second, the kid STILL doesn’t have her own room. I’d give good odds on clingy, controlling parents who either are going to produce a child incapable of functioning without them or make that child’s life miserable when they hit their teen and adult years and have the temerity to seek some independence.

  8. The mom is still breast feeding the varmint at 2 years old, at night, in bed. And they wonder why the kid wants to join them every night? Duh.

  9. @7: I totally agree. Sharing a bed w/an infant isn’t just detrimental to your sex life, it’s down right dangerous! Every year you read tons of stories about infants accidentally crushed or smothered by sleeping parents. Also, having a kid in bed with you must be the worst! Having watched my 18 year old thrash and wriggle in her sleep I couldn’t imagine her in our bed.

  12. @ Savage, you did see the picture under the headline with the little kid in PJs, didn’t you? And you still thought of polyamory? Sicko.

    @ 7, was the dad obese and/or drunk? If you don’t go to bed inebriated, cosleeping is perfectly safe.

    When kids get big enough, they don’t want to sleep with the parents anymore. You can charge the parents with control and being clingy when they won’t let go at that point.

  14. Wow y’all are a judgemental lot. Don’t want to cosleep? Don’t do it. Many families love it. As for the idiot parent who tried to have sex with the baby in the bed, that’s what the guest room is for. If you’re going to cosleep, the family bed is for sleeping.

  16. I’m with @14 – why the hell would you have sex with your baby in the bed? Even if you are co-sleeping, how about putting the baby in a crib for 20 minutes? Or, how about sex on the floor or another room? Sheesh.

    Co-sleeping isn’t inherently dangerous. If you do it right, there can be significant benefits for the baby.

  17. Dan, believe me you don’t have to be gay in order to have people tell you your parenting choices are weird and gross.

    Just try co-sleeping and nursing your kid til she’s 3 years old, and see what your neighbors / family / strangers on blogs have to say about it.

    (Just for the record, the aforementioned kid is now 21 and well-adjusted, and our sex lives survived her early childhood very nicely. Having an awake-able child in bed with you is an absolute antidote to lust, so a certain amount of room-hopping tends to take place when your co-sleeping kids are little.)

  19. OMG, I’m totally sicked out by the idea of doing it with a child (however old and unaware) in my bed. You’re right, if the gays were to do that it would be called direct indoctrination.

  20. I’m with @14 and @16. Co-sleeping worked great for us and I suggest having an open mind about it if you have a baby or will soon have one. My wife and I read “Sleeping with Your Baby (link below)” after our first was born and we’ve been a happy co-sleeping family ever since. It’s not for everyone, but co-sleeping was great for us and still is great with our two-year-old. And the living room couch works great for sex after the kids are asleep. Cherish the closeness. The kids will be surly teenagers soon enough.

    http://www.amazon.com/Sleeping-Your-Baby…

  21. Raising my hand. I did the family bed thing while my child was young, knowing that in most cultures, and historically, kids had someone next to them in bed–siblings, parents… There is nothing weird about it, except in America, apparently (my Japenese friend said it’s normal until around 13 in Japan). It’s not for everyone, but I raised a kid who never had nightmares, never was afraid of the dark, has tons of independence, and has (coincidentally or not) not felt “neediness” in terms of seeking out affection. So the comment above @7 about raising defective kids and being controlling parents–based on what?

    Oh, yeah. Maintained a great (and not too traditional) sex life.

    Just saying–it’s not for everyone. But it aint whacko, either.

  22. I don’t think its whacko. There were times when we had one of the two of ours in the bed with us, ear infection, darn hotel only had rooms didn’t have any doubles available. It’s just not something I’d choose on a regular basis, I’m one of those people who needs their space to sleep, and a king size bed doesn’t hold three (or four) well when one of the regular occupants is 6’6″ and the other regular occupant (me) isn’t short either.

  23. “the worst idea in the whole sordid history of parenting”

    Really? Dan, you are way off here. Surely it isn’t for everyone and having sex with a kid in bed is never a good idea, but co-sleeping is done by many loving and thoughtful parents. It is often the only way that parents of young children can get sleep and for those of us who abhor the idea of ignoring a baby in a crib he while screams and cries, it is a solution.

    Congrats on having a kid never insisted on sleeping next to a warm body. I hope you can back the fuck off of the rest of us who are trying to parent our kids in a way that is appropriate for the whole family even if it doesn’t quite square with your experience.

  24. BTW, some time ago there were studies showing a connection between co-sleeping and reduced risk of SIDS (the hypothesis being that sleeping next to another human helped the baby regulate its breathing and heart rate, especially during the critical time when breathing switches from an involuntary to voluntary/involuntary).

    I’m not up-to-date on the most recent research, but, just saying that it’s been the norm for much of human history for infants to sleep near their mothers (and is still currently the norm in many places, as @21 points out). Co-sleeping may be culturally weird in America, but it is biological weird for babies to sleep alone.

  26. I’ve enjoyed having our second child sleep in our room – but in her own bed next to ours. I figure it’s the best of both, she’s close, but I never had to worry about throwing a pillow on her face during the night – and I got better sleep not having to worry about her rolling off, either. We’re going to have to move her into her sister’s room with our third arriving soon, but then she’ll still be sleeping with someone.

    I insisted our first child should sleep in her own bed in her own room, and now I doubt I should have. I don’t think it has altered her at all though. One can still be a responsive and empathic parent even if your child sleeps in the other room. One can also be a domineering and controlling parent even if you sleep with your child – I know a parent who slept with her daughter until she was three and their relationship is still in tatters… So all of you co-sleepers who insist it’s better can’t call yourselves better parents; there’s a whole lot more interaction happening during waking hours than sleeping.

    But having sex with a child in the same bed, even a child who won’t remember it if she wakes, is just… so… wrong. Really, really wrong.

  28. Infants die alone in their cribs far more than when sleeping in the same bed with their parents.

    Having kids in general kills the sex life, but no more than sharing a bed with an infant – unless one lives in a studio apartment. Who says you can’t do it in the living room?

    And Dan, what activities can gays do that gay-haters approve of? I can’t think of any, so yeah, they probably won’t approve of the family bed situation in a same sex marriage either. Go figure.

    Family beds are as natural as breast feeding but like breast feeding, it’s kind of a to-each-their-own type of thing.

  29. Chalk up another comment for the co-sleeping camp. We shared sleep with our kids and leaving them in the bed while we ‘christened’ almost every other room in our house actually improved our sex life.

    Also, our son had/has night terrors. It was a lot easier to get him back into normal sleep when he was sleeping with us and I could catch it in the early stages. Episodes are rare now, but we are all thoroughly awake by the time we can get him calmed down.

  30. We tried the family bed thing for the first 3 months.

    We stopped it when my wife started going insane from sleep deprivation. Both mom and baby slept better in separate beds.

    If sleeping with your baby works for you, wonderful. But there’s nothing more “natural” about it than having your kid sleep in their own bed.

  31. wow dan’s last comment was uncomfortable for me. i’m as left as they come on gay issues but i have to admit that i was viscerally significantly more weirded out by the thought of two dudes going at it next to baby than by the thought of a het couple. prejudice dies hard.

  32. This is a really interesting thread. Dan, thank you so much for bringing this up. It’s okay that your views are in the majority, along w/ the American something-er-other College of Pediatrics/Pediatricians/whatever. It’s normal to have that rxn. That’s how our American (and Puritanical) society has conditioned us.

    I took Psych 306 and this was an issue we discussed. Initially I was against it, but then in reading an article and participating in a sxn discussion really loosened my viewpt. Many ppl do it anyway, regardless of what drs, society, fam, and friends think. Sometimes the crying and tiredness is just too much. Why not try to issue guidelines on safety and appropriateness? It might be similar to drugs (ie, pot) in that way, eh? 🙂 As long as it’s done safely and in consideration of people’s needs (sex, physical safety, not dying), it should be fine and it may reduce no. deaths by SIDS. Tip about trying not to roll yourself or baby off the bed: Set the mattress on the floor or get a low-lying bed (I guess that’s a futon, or that would be included? not totally sure). The baby, yourself or others may roll off the mattress, but it will be a lot less far to fall and will reduce the risk/incidence of injuries.

    (Just thought of: Might be similar to teen sex in that way.)

    Of course, this thread has also broadened my viewpt as well with personal comfort considerations, ie being 6’5″ and the size (and cost) of the bed, and I agree, that is a major consideration (I’m 5 ft.).

    I also am aware of and agree with many here who note that this is a normal practice for many years in other current cultures and across history, both human and other creatures (Think about it, squirrlies and birds co-sleep in their nests w/ their young, right? People and pets co-sleep too sometimes.). Additionally, did you know this: That in many human cultures in the past (the Middle Ages comes to mind), people would have sex right next to kids! Although I agree w/ many here, I don’t know about having sex in the same bed as your infant/kid, regardless of hetero, homo, poly, solo, sex toys, ft fetish, what have you. Yeah, go christen the other rooms in the house! (Or maybe that’s just me.) I’m curious as well about co-sleeping studies w/ homosexual parents (although that shouldn’t be an issue, imo).

    Not an expert, not a doctor, not a pediatrician, not a parent, not an older sibling. Just telling you what I’ve been exposed to in college from Psych and History classes and from living in situations with people from other cultures. Just puttin’ in my two cents, like everyone else on this slog. Peace out.

  33. When I was a kid “co-sleeping” was when you stuck the children in a bed together (the parents had their own bed/bedroom). I get siblings sleeping together in a bed (less/no nightmares, less space wasted: a double bed can fit 2 small kids in it as easy as twin bunks.) I understand having the baby in the same room as you when it’s little and doesn’t sleep through the night, but in the same bed as the parents for years on end? Sounds a little needy and dependent.

  34. I think it totally depends on the type of sex you’re having with a child in the bed. Fun, bouncy and joyful sex is fine while screaming, crying, donkey-punching sex will probably cause some trauma for the wee tyke.

    Kids will soak up whatever emotions you give off, though; If you’re up tight about fucking please don’t do it around your kid, go hide in the closet or wherever.

  35. I have no patience for these people. Only in the last 50-70 years has a significant portion of any species hidden sexuality from their offspring. Given the size of the world, I’m still not sure that our single species has hit a majority. Or, more succinctly, what kind of idiots wouldn’t fuck in front of 4 month old? exactly how stupid are you, if you think it matters anywhere but in your terrified mind.

  36. To all of the folks who are cool with two people having sex together with a child in the same room, are you also cool with one person masturbating alone in a room with a child? What if the masturbator is male and the child is female? Still cool with that?

  38. I had no idea there were so many parents out there who can’t pony up the money for a crib or even a bassinet to lay their kid in for half an hour while they fuck in bed. Really? Even putting aside the general weirdness, wouldn’t the motion in bed wake them up?

  40. LOL Dan. The fact that neither of you (parents, in your household) has ever breastfed makes your pronouncement of the family bed as ‘worst idea ever’ pretty laughable. If it’s not your thing, don’t do it – but here are a couple of worse ideas:

    1) never getting enough sleep. as the sole source of food, breastfeeding moms suffer enough, believe me;

    2) labeling ‘domestic violence’ as ‘spanking’ as long as the abuser and victim are in different generations;

    3) the ‘what to expect when you’re expecting’ books. all of them.

  41. To the people talking about rolling over on top of infants– yes, its really dangerous to have the infant loose in the bed. But they make these little soft boxes that you can put the baby in in the bed– its like a mini-crib but then they’re right there in the bed with you, but protected from being rolled over on. I can see how that would be more convenient than getting up to check all the time, and also safer than just having them right in the bed.

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