My boyfriend of 16 months and
I have a great relationship. He loves my blowjobs, but he will not kiss
me if I have his come in my mouth. It grosses him out. We have talked
about this, and he won’t even try. I have no problem if he kisses me
after going down on me. I just want him to try. Is there something
wrong with asking him to taste himself? I do it all the time and love
it.
Missing Kisses
It’s funny that your question—with its
hint of gay panic—should arrive today. I’ve been on vacation with
the family all week snowboarding in beautiful British Columbia, and
what I enjoy most—besides the snowboarding and the half-naked,
fully stoned Australian snowboard instructors lolling around in hot
tubs at the end of the day—is watching the straight boys who
refuse to sit four to a chairlift. They want to ride up alone or ride
up two at a time on a four-seater with two empty seats between ’em.
They seem to think gayness can be contracted through thigh-to-thigh
contact.
Which it can.
Now, MK, there’s kissing someone with your
come on her breath and then there’s kissing someone with your come in
her mouth. It sounds like you’re interested in the latter, which makes
it sound like you’re interested in passing some of your boyfriend’s
load into his mouth—i.e., snowballing—and not simply being
rewarded with a kiss, his come on your breath, for a blowjob well-done.
And that’s an entirely different wad of spunk.
Just because you enjoy tasting yourself on
his lips doesn’t mean your boyfriend will enjoy or should have to enjoy
mouthing his own load. First, there’s a significant difference in
volume and consistency between your kissing his glazed lips and his
eating his own spunk. And then there’s this: After a woman comes, MK,
she’s still in a groove, still capable of more orgasms, still cranked
up. After ejaculating, a man is essentially uncranked. He’s not capable
of another orgasm (not right away, anyway)—he’s been knocked out
of his groove. So even if the idea of snowballing appeals to a man as
you’re blowing him, it might not hold the same appeal the moment after
he comes.
Some men are afraid of tasting their own
come because they believe that doing so, like sitting too close on a
chairlift, can turn a guy gay. And it’s not an unreasonable fear: not
because it will turn a guy gay, but because, judging from my mail, a
lot of women are convinced that any man who would taste his own come
must secretly be gay. It’s possible that your boyfriend is dying to
taste himself, MK, but, like the boys on the chairlifts, is afraid of
getting a reputation if he goes ahead with this and you blab about it
to your friends.
I am at the Meshuggah show at
El Corazón as I write this. There are tons of guys I consider
hot here, 98 percent of whom, I’m sure, are straight. But I got a vibe
off this one guy. This is such a macho environment, though, that
there’s a considerable amount of danger in asking the question “So, you
gay?”
I remember an episode of Law and Order where
Jerry Orbach tried to determine if a suspect was in AA by asking a
secret question, something like “Are you a friend of Bill W.?” The idea
was that the question was innocuous if you weren’t in AA.
Since you are the king of “santorum” and
“pegging” and “saddlebacking,” I thought maybe you could invent a
secret question for masculine gay men in masculine environments.
Something like, “Hey, do you like to barbecue?” So how ’bout it? Can
you declare the official secret are-you-a-masculine-gay-guy
question?
Men Are Cute Hot Objects
The best I could come up with on my own,
MACHO, was this: “A Little Night Music—
original
Broadway cast recording or original London cast?” But that line will
get your ass kicked in a lot of gay bars—as I know from bitter
experience. So let’s toss this out to my readers, the folks who came up
with the definitions for “santorum,” “pegging,” and “saddlebacking”:
Okay, gang, we’re looking for an innocuous question that (1) all fags
everywhere would know the answer to, but (2) no straight guys anywhere
would. My long-suffering interns—their uniforms chafe—await
your suggested questions at mail@savagelove.net.
I had to refrain from opening
this with “Hey, Asshole!” (oops, guess I kind of just did) after
reading your advice to Sex Best One On One, the woman who married a man
who warned her that he could not be monogamous and who then realized
she couldn’t share him. While I agree with your assessment of SBOOO’s
husband—up-front, honest—your assessment of SBOOO is
obviously influenced by your need to have a good rant at
polyamory-unfriendly marriage counselors, family, friends, and the
world at large. SBOOO does not have to apologize for who she is (not as
willing to do long-term nonmonogamy as previously thought) to elitist,
more-liberated-than-thou jerk-offs (hint: you!) after giving it a good
fucking try (12 times!). Pun intended.
Loving Toronto Reader
I am a polyamorist. I am
always up-front with my partners about this, especially if I want to
get serious with them. So many people seem to say that they are fine
with it out of some kind of misguided assumption that they can
eventually change my mind. You know, “Polyamory isn’t real; it’s just a
phase!” You know, like being gay.
I just wanted to say thank you for your
reply to SBOOO! I couldn’t have said it better myself. That was an
absolutely fantastic response. Just like you said, counselors (and for
that matter, family members) always see the polyamorist as the bad guy,
unreasonably refusing to take the simple, easy route of strict
monogamy. It was really nice to finally have someone stand up for us.
Thank you!
While I’m sure you enjoy positive feedback,
saying thank you is cheap. A lot of times you plug various charities
and causes in your column—is there any group you’d like me to
donate to as a more concrete symbol of my appreciation?
Longtime Fan
Some folks think I was too hard on SBOOO,
some think I was just hard enough. Like I said in my original response,
I intentionally came down hard on SBOOO to compensate for the vast and
overwhelming majority of advice professionals who would, per LF, side
aggressively with her because a nonmonogamous partner—even an
honest one like SBOOO’s mate—is always perceived as the bad
guy.
For the record: I am not biased toward
nonmonogamy. But I do think monogamous people should be with each other
and refrain from marrying folks who are self-aware enough to inform
them in advance that they don’t think they’re capable of being
monogamous.
Some folks who wrote in about my advice for
SBOOO raised a good point: I should have come down on the husband as
well. If nonmonogamy was a deal breaker for him, then he was a fool to
marry SBOOO before verifying her ability to be nonmonogamous. Agreed.
So, for the record: SBOOO’s husband? You’re an idiot, too.
Finally, LF, I’m always happy to see money
go to Planned Parenthood.
“Snails or oysters” is awesome, but it’s also the gayest thing I’ve ever heard. You might get your ass kicked with that one.
I’d also like to offer up my vote regarding MK: I’m happy to sleep with either gender, but I happen to think girl juice is yummy, while semen is disgusting. MK’s boyfriend may feel the same.
smoka-dee-pole?? hint hint wink wink
Isn’t agreeing to abstain from something your partner doesn’t like as much a part of being GGG as being willing to try new things and test your boundaries? If MK’s boyfriend really hates the taste of his own cum, she should agree to brush her teeth after her blowjobs before making out, unless she really has some kind of desperate snowballing fetish, in which case she’s with the wrong guy. My boyfriend hates his own cum too and takes a quick shower after we have intercourse, which doesn’t bother me in the slightest–I’m still fucked and satisfied.
How about “Basket alert!” while looking away. Straight guys will look at you and go “huh?” Gay guys will follow your eyeline.
To LC,
The quote from the letter was as follows, “but he will not kiss me if I have his come in my mouth.”
Having come “in (her) mouth” is not the same as, “having HAD come in her mouth.” Dan’s advice is on point as usual.
Though I agree your proposed situation is a red flag, this one doesn’t seem to be given the information available.
How much verification do you need that your partner is non-monogamy friendly? He told her, he tried to include her, and she stuck around through the wedding and for an ENTIRE YEAR afterwards. At what point does it just become badgering to ask if she’s okay with it?
He may be a bit of an idiot, but come ON. This is why people say non-monogamy doesn’t work: someone isn’t honest and the whole thing falls apart in a spectacular way. 😛
Also, guys that won’t sit 4 to a chair are either jerks or they’re 15. If you’re someone that does this, grow up so we can all get to the top of the mountain faster. I ride 4 guys to a chairlift in the summer when biking, and we’re all in spandex shirts and have shaved legs.
I usually ask friends when I see a hot guy and don’t know if “is he on the bus?”
I can totally relate to MK actually. My boyfriend doesn’t mind kissing me after a blowjob but I HATE tasting myself on his lips after he goes down on me. Maybe her boyfriend just doesn’t like the taste of cum (as many many women don’t). I dont think people are grossed out by cum because they see it as waste product, LC, I think people are grossed out because it tastes, well, gross.
“Ginger, Mary Anne, or the Professor?”
MK could also not swallow, let the jizz fly, and get her post cum kisses. For that matter she could always lick it up after.
How about “Hey, have you ever tasted your own come? Would you like to?”
Oh, puh-lease. I’m a straight guy who’s gotten hit on every since I was 15. Trying to figure out the gay people? Just look for the dudes who are looking you straight in the eye and don’t look away. Some guys look w/ a tinge of guilt, some guys look w/ unabashed lust, some guys look w/ intense curiosity but THEY LOOK. Geez. Like you all need a stupid code-word when your horny eyes say pretty much everything.
Posted by and NO, i’m not even ‘bi-curious’
What a shame. You sound hot.
Even if MK was talking about snow-balling, I’m not sure I agree with his last statement. He shouldn’t have said that the boyfriend was probably dying to taste himself. That’s like telling a guy, “I’ll bet your girlfriend is dying to *insert sex act that she already said she didn’t want to do here*. Just keep pushing the issue until she finally gives in.” That’s something that Dan would never say to a guy. I know that Dan didn’t actually tell MK to press the issue, but she might anyway because she’ll think he’s just saying no because he’s worried it makes him gay.
As for the question in a masculine environment, I think it’s probably best to be honest:
“Let me ask you a question: if I were to buy you a drink, would I be barking up the wrong tree?”
Keep it simple.
Hi Dan, glad to hear you got some of that sweet powder snow here in BC! Hope you had a great time.
Whatever became of the question “Are you a friend of Dorothy’s?” It was in reference to Dorothy from the wizard of oz. If you said yes, then you were in the family. I have no idea as to the origin of the question i just remember hearing about it and it being mentioned in a movie or TV show i once saw.
Are you shitting me? Dan, you must know “Are you a friend of Dorothy’s?” Or is it actually so well known that even the he-men at a Meshuggah gig will catch on and throw this guy a beating?
I was woulda thought this was open & shut, but if you wanna burn a column on it…
P.S. That’s too bad you weren’t booked at the U of Calgary around your Lethbridge date. This neanderthal town could use it.
We bears do the “Woof” thing… that way if another guy is a bear, he’ll get it.. if he’s just a hot bearded straight guy, he’ll just think we’re nuts or that we mumbled. Either of which is fine.
4 guys not wanting to sit next to each other on a chair life may say something about them being homophobic but it definitely says something about them as skiers/riders, namely that they are not. I have skied for 30 years, hetero for all, and to this day I would take a chair, gondola car or whatever with as many dudes as possible if it meant getting some fresh tracks, but that’s just me.
Dan please check out this link about how them clean Utahns are the people that most enjoy their internet porn
http://blogs.computerworld.com/online_po…
Why not just make the question “Do you read Dan Savage?” If the answer is yes they either get the joke, or are open-minded enough to appreciate the offer — gay or other wise. I’m a straight man, but would like to think gay men would find me attractive. Because if gay men find me attractive, chances are there are a lot of hot women out there who do to!
Yeah, I’ve experienced the “chair lift effect” with friends (well, former friends now) at the movie theater. They would always try and sit with a seat between them. Hilarious!
How about “Do you drive stick?”
Obviously, there is no way to come up with a question using this column that only gay men and no straight men will recognize since tons of straight guys read this column
There seems to be an assumption that women like the taste of themselves on others lips while most men don’t, which I take issue with. The reason this assumption seems to have grown is the fact that very few women would have the insensitivity to say, “ew, gross, get away from me with my cum on you!” to a guy who had just spent some unreciprocated time and energy making them cum their brains out! Many men do not seem to have this sensitivity. And then complain that their wife/girlfriend/boyfriend/husband USED to give them blowjobs. I see no reason to make a man who has just given me pleasure, and hopefully taken some pleasure in it himself, feel that he is gross and has done something dirty, demeaning. That’s the last message I want to send to my lover, so I don’t mind in the least kissing him after oral even though I get absolutely no thrill from my own flavor. It’s respecttul and intimate.
Just ask the guy if he’d like to go to dinner sometime. If he bursts a blood vessel you can say, “What’s wrong? Don’t people around here eat dinner? Jesus fucking Christ, don’t be so fucking dramatic. People will think you’re gay and you obviously couldn’t handle living with THAT stigma… you asshole.”
Simple.
Semen is an acquired taste, like oysters, alcohol, or anal sex. Until new neural pathways linking these activities to the pleasure center of the brain are formed, it’s unlikely to happen. Repetition and some form of positive reinforcement helps. Perhaps she should bait/reward him with rimming….
Hey MACHO… do you prefer twinkies or bears? Don’t like Hostess cakes, huh? Too bad.
Support for “family”.
I’ve always liked the usage of “are you family?”. It’s enigmatic enough, protective, community-minded, etc. I recall that being used a lot in the 90s, when bumper stickers of rainbows or that said “family” were still private winks that the majority of straight folks weren’t privy to. Rainbow flags are universal now, but “family” is still comparatively preserved and closeted, which seems appropriate for the situation here, whatever rip-roaring macho bull fighting/Nascar/cage match/information technology symposiums this guy is going to.
Re: 26 Feb 09 letter from M.A.C.H.O.
This writer postulates while at a heavy metal show, that 98% of the guys there are straight, therefore he wouldn’t have a chance to “hook-up” with any of them. Furthermore, you present to the readers the challenge of finding that magical phrase that will uncover if a guy is gay.
In your response to this reader, you have have done a disservice to us by missing the greater picture. By positing (A) that there might be (in) one unified question, or knowledge that is universal to all fags, and (B) that any magic question alone, like Dorothy clicking her heels, could transform us to Oz of a cute guy’s bedroom, and (C) that there is only a gay, or straight, solution to a problem such as MACHO’s, and (D) there is knowledge exclusive to “gays”, or not know to “straights”; then you have done your readers a disservice, and shows myopic reasoning on your part.
The Central flaw in your faulty reply stems from a very simple premise: that there exists either straight men, or the 10% that is homosexual. By believing this nonsense, you will, in fact, miss 98% of the opportunities that life throws our way.
The fact is this: 20% of guys are gay, 20% of guys are straight, the other 60%, the rest of us, are bisexual. I am bisexual: a 5 on the Kinsey Scale.
I find interesting things happen when I bring-up this topic in conversation where gays, straights, and those inbetween meet. I find that both true-gays, and true-straights refuse to accept the scale, and that there even is one. It seems the prevailing logic is that “if you’ve sucked a cock, you must be gay.”
Therefore, my obvious “universal question” is: do you think a guy can be bi?
However, I’ve said repeatedly that I’ve had sex with more married guys than both gay men and females combined. We know that guys can be, and are bi.
My experience has taught me that straight guys are eighter single, or divorced, usually multiple times. One of the question I use to find a guys is: are you married, and for how long?
By thinking that there might be a “universal question” really misses the point. If we look at the A.A. model, we find that all A.A.’ers are taught that they are identical, and that the program works because you do not suffer from “terminal uniqueness.”
Gays might follow the stereotypic creed of: Musicals, fashion, Liza, or what have you, but we bisexuals don’t, generally. But were we to have that secret knowledge, like the marriage-thing, earlier mentioned, the fact still remains that there is neither a definitive question, or should there be.
By advocating that there might be, or there should be, or to wish that there cold be, Dorothy, you will miss those opportunities, because a solid “no”, or “yes” rarely makes-or-breaks the meeting. Point of fact, you are looking to start a conversation, and as such, you would ask open-ended questions, designed to further the topic.
Ok, this is Hook-Up 101. I understand, but this moves us to the next issue.
Perhaps we shouldn’t consider one magic question, but rather a golden equation.
A gay friend of mine in college (odd thing: identical twins, one was gay and the other straight) mentioned how asking “Do you know Dorothy?” used to be the question (alluding to Judy Garland, musicals, and being “over the rainbow”), but that fell out of favor among less-effete gays, so the butchier question had become “Hey man, d’you know Stonewall?” Even naive gays will probably at least have heard of the Stonewall riots, whereas narrow straights will think you’re referring to the Civil War general or just some guy’s nickname, and non-narrow straights who get the reference can say, “Not personally, he’s not my scene, but I’ve got friends who know him.”
“Are you a friend of Dorothy’s?”
That is awesome. 2 thumbs up!
Now I’m grey and Gay, but back in the day to determine if someone else was homo THE standard innocuous question was, “Are you a friend of Dorothy?”. Why? Because if the answer was, “Dorothy who?”, then keep on movin’ cause he’s not Gay. Why? Because if he were Gay, he’d follow up with a related question, such as, “Why, YES! And don’t you just love the gorgeous gown Adrian designed for Glenda the Good Witch in her opening scene?” All ‘mos love the Wizard of Oz. It’s a metaphore for our own stormy path to a technicolor future full of Gay farm hands acting out like lovable rubes in a dream sequence. And costumes by Adrian to boot! So if “Mister Right (now)” wasn’t clued in then, well, he would deserve the answer he asked for, “Dorothy GALE, of course! From KANSAS.” If then he “Got it.” a flirty conversation might just develop and off you’d go together anyway. Don’t you know… We recruit.
Yay Dan! Sondheim is my favorite!
To the women who responded to MK with an I-kiss-him-afterwards-he-should-too attitude: As a bi woman who has tasted several different men’s cum, and several different women’s juices, in my experience women’s fluids taste much better than men’s. We’re talking hands down, no contest; all of the women tasted considerably better than all of the men. I agree with mintygreen and spunktasteslikejunk that it’s very possible that a man might just be grossed out by the taste of his cum, without there being any “gay panic” or misogynism involved. If you kiss a partner whose mouth tastes disgusting to you, how much intimacy does that create?
As far as MK’s original letter, I agree that the bf’s not being willing to even try might be a red flag, but it could also be that he has tasted it on a previous lover’s mouth, and already knows he can’t stomach it. Or he may just be a homophobic, misogynist asshole. If it’s the former, then take the advice given so far up the page I’ve given up crediting it, and keep mouthwash by the bed, if it’s the latter then DTMFA.
I wouldn’t expect my gf to swallow anything that I couldn’t myself. I’m not gay, just a realist…
I’d normally be happy to go up four-to-a-lift with three of my best guy friends, but on the few occasions this opportunity has arose we’ve declined for safety reasons.
See, with four in the lift at least one of us would get it in our fool heads to “rock” and thereby freak out the other three. We’re not homophobic, in that case, just jerks! (For the record, I admit that I would be the first-or-second most likely to start rocking.)
What is so important about getting kisses after a BJ? I’d rather have a neck massage.
I do not disagree to your response to MK in terms of content. However, I feel that it is important to point out that not all women can have multiple orgasms, as you seem to be suggesting. In fact, some research (which granted, given the self-report nature of the work, may be exaggerated in either directed) shows that only 43% of women can have multiple orgasms when masturbating. Additionally, given that women have orgasms less reliably via intercourse than masturbation, it is likely that number actually drops when including a partner in the equation. Even if it doesn’t, that’s still over half that don’t fit the multiple orgasm stereotype and get just 1, just like men!
I’m late, and I haven’t read all the comments above, but I would still like to put this on the record : ladies – any man who refuses to take his cum back into his mouth from yours means you no good.
Signed,
A Ragingly Heterosexual Male
I’m late too, but…
I’ve got news for you: Everybody knows about the friends of Dorothy.
not sure if this is just a bay area gaysian thing, or a high school thing, or universal.. but a lot of my gay friends use to ask people .. “are you downe?” maybe this works better in print. but it’s kind of a code word. see downelink.com
I know I’m two years too late but the gay equivalent of “Are you a friend of Bill W.?” is obvious..
Are you a friend of Dan S.?