Yes, being gay makes you an oppressed minority. Now that we have that established, I would like to point out that you are white. This may seem confusing for you, but you have a dual life. You’re a minority who also enjoys white privilege. I know this is a lot to take in, and I know that you feel frustrated anytime anyone accuses you of being racist, and I know that there are a lot of things you want to say to defend yourself, and let me guess—all of them get you in more trouble. That’s because you’re doing it wrong. Here are the most common reactions people like you throw at people like me when I point out that something you’ve said or done is racist.
“I’m gay, how could I be racist?”
Homosexuality is not a race. I am black. I am also gay. I am not gayack or blagay. Being in one minority group doesn’t excuse being insensitive to another minority group. If I were to walk around dressed in a kimono with my eyes taped back for a slantlike effect, it should not come as a surprise if any and all Asian persons took offense to it. I promise you, none of them would stop and think to themselves, “Oh wait, he’s black. It’s totally cool.”
“I have a good friend that is [insert
ethnicity].”
Categorizing your friends based on ethnicity is a racist act in itself: There is no quota to fill when it comes to the diversity of your group of friends, and constantly announcing their ethnicity causes them to be more of a novelty than the individual people they are. Also, your friends should definitely not be your first line of defense when someone calls you out on being racially insensitive. Your “friend” doesn’t represent an entire race. Last I checked, we don’t elect representatives for each race to confirm what is and what isn’t considered racist. As a matter of fact, each race has millions of people who have their own experience with racism and how they respond to it.
I am an African immigrant; my experience with racism is different than someone who is black American, even though we have similar skin color. Because of my background and upbringing, there are some things that I would not immediately acknowledge as racist. For example, I know all the lyrics to the song “Pick a Bale of Cotton.” If you’re not familiar, it’s a jovial song about the joys of picking a bale of cotton. There is a lot of jumping, turning around, and exclaiming, “Oh Lordy!” I was taught this song by my white music teacher while I was part of a predominantly black fifth-grade class in Fresno, California. I am not upset at said music teacher, because she was genuinely a nice woman who taught in inner-city schools and probably just loved that repugnant slave song without thinking too deeply about the lyrics. However, I would hold no qualms if a fellow classmate decided to call her out for subjecting descendants of slavery to the Uncle Tom of Negro spirituals.
However, there are also some things that come off as blatantly racist to me (e.g., Disney’s The Lion King, Popeyes chicken commercials, and everything Tyler Perry) that others may just brush off.
“But I voted for Obama.”
Are you admitting to voting for the president based on his race?! Please, from now on, vote for our leaders based on merit and experience. You got lucky this last time, but I can’t promise that the next black president you blindly vote for won’t start a “beheading all white people” initiative the moment he or she steps into office.
Or are you trying to tell me that because you voted for Obama, a supposedly nonracist action, everything you do/say from that point on could not be deemed as racist?! Have you not been paying attention the last three years? Obama has been on the receiving end of some of the most finely executed subtle racism I have ever witnessed (seriously, medals should be given out for excellence in the artistry of subtle racism, and winners should be shot afterward). And some of these practitioners of subtle racism are former/current Obama supporters. If I had a nickel for every time the phrase “he’s one of the good ones” was uttered with regard to Obama by the population of this country over the last few years, I would send a thank-you note to the magic nickel machine that made me a gajillionaire. The most annoying part is that Obama, THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, can’t do anything about these comments except take them in stride.
“Get over it.”
I will give you a moment to collect your teeth now that I’ve punched you in the mouth. You got them all? Good. Now sit.
Exactly what do you mean by “Get over it”? Am I getting over your racist actions? Am I getting over my own personal history with racism? Am I getting over the centuries (yes, CENTURIES!) of oppression that my ancestors endured? “Get over it” is something you say to a 13-year-old who is angry at his parents for not allowing him to have an unlimited texting plan. “Get over it” is not something you say to an adult who has suffered a lifetime (yes, a LIFETIME!) of being victimized by racism.
“Okay, I’m out of excuses. What should I really do?”
Apologize. Yes, it’s that easy. I know you’re upset and you believe you had good intentions. Unfortunately, intentions are not visible. I know it sucks being called racist when you feel you’re not, but I promise you that it is far worse being on the receiving end of racism.
Just remember that the person upset with you is projecting from a place of suffering and endless frustration. Take a moment to listen, let them vent, and apologize. I know it’s not fun to deal with misdirected anger, but sometimes proving that you are not racist is hearing people out and letting them have their moment to release that anger. It’s something we should all do in these circumstances, because that’s what grown-ups are supposed to do.
“What if the person accusing me of being racist is white, too?”
You lucky bastard! You know another white person who is in tune enough to stop you from looking like a jackass in front of a group of minorities. You should stop reading this right now and go hug this person.
“Seriously? I know I’m not racist. There are just too many overly sensitive bleeding hearts in the world.”
Oh, well in that case… GO FUCK YOURSELF, YOU RACIST PIECE OF SHIT! 
Solomon Georgio is a comedian and a member of the comedy production group Children of the Atom (www.childrenoftheatom.net).
@46, and anyone who has made a similar comment, I”m sorry you experienced what you did, in @46’s case as a white person in the south. But the discrimination you’re talking about has to do with going to a particular place and experiencing blatant hatred because you’re white. But racism isn’t always overt. Discrimination, and I think you can agree with this as a woman, is often discreet and usually the person doing it doesn’t even know they are doing it. Minorities can experience this EVERYWHERE they go. Down south, up north, east, west it doesn’t matter. And if that minority is also a woman… well I think you can understand how that could compound the issue.
So you’re wrong (and you’re not the only one on here). It’s not necessarily a sense of entitlement that drives people to speak out against this. You should always speak out when someone has hurt you, especially when done so systematically, which is what we’re really talking about here. And although I think I am too a stronger person for my personal experiences good or bad, I don’t think we should ever be complacent with any “ism” whether obvious or hidden.
Also, anyone who has commented that someone white can’t be racist because they live in certain parts of Africa is ignorant (literally you don’t know what you’re talking about).
Anyone who commented “Yeah, so you got problems, but here’s why it’s not that bad… me, me, me!” You need to stop. Really not a competition. The negative experiences in your life do not negate the author’s, nor does it negate the author’s feelings or criticisms.
#119 so all white people need to apologize for having white privilege and then “don’t do it again”? Sorry I’m white. Am I good now? No? I still have it? Now what! Again? “Sorry I’m white!” Is it still there? Shit!!! “I’M SORRY I’M WHITE!” I said I was sorry! How do I “don’t do it again”?
@98 “I repeat, I am not telling you to fuck off and die…right now…right this second…in an incredibly painful and humiliating way.”
Perfect.
“Instead, I am going to go the surely pointless route of trying to reason with you.”
How you flatter yourself. I would listen to you why?
“What is it about black people that makes them so “destructive” to the moral fabric of this great nation?”
Culture. What does it say about your culture that a black person who gets an education and speaks proper English is a ‘sell-out’, to be looked down upon by fellow blacks? Dog fighting, pimping, the failure of “baby daddys” to give a fuck about their own flesh and blood, etc. Whitey didn’t do these things to your people. Your people did these things to themselves. What white injustice has caused your men to abandon their children? I’d love to hear your justification for that.
“(we like to stab things)”
Crime statistics back you up.
“there must be some external force causing black people to “act out” in this way”
Whitey! Whitey! Whitey! You’re mere puppets on our strings. I myself forced 3,281 black men to abandon their children last year alone.
“(we like bullets)”
See above.
“the environment of the black community CAN ONLY be a product of the larger environment of this (mostly white) country…that’s just fucking science.”
You crack me up. Whitey made you think pimp is a valid career choice. Whitey told you to foster a culture where education is not important. Whitey made you sprinkle bastards about the countryside like so many daisys. Hilarious.
“If we accept that the color of your skin does not DIRECTLY determine your behavior then we must accept that the negative aspects of the black community CAN ONLY be aspects that were primarily imposed upon it by the atmosphere that envelopes it…this is the only thing that makes sense.”
To you perhaps. But not to a thinking person. Black culture is toxic. It was created by you. Stop trying to shift blame. Take responsibility and begin to cure your ills.
“PLEASE FUCK OFF AND DIE NOW!”
That’s so sweet.
Look, I know that in the black/rap world I’m just a bitch/ho, but I’ve spent 50 years coming to my current beliefs. In the 70’s I was a big supporter of civil rights for all. But then came the 80’s, with their gangs, crack, black crime, rap, etc. My views changed. I began to see what the southern man had been talking about for the past many years.
Just my opinion. Don’t care if it offends.
Wow, more trolls in these comments then on a secretary’s desk in the 90’s.
Great job, Solomon. Most of these people probably didn’t read beyond the first sentence. Also, for those complaining about snark:
A. He’s a stand up comic.
B. You are reading The Stranger.
Oh jeeze. I think it’s articles like these which only widen the gap between sincerely well-meaning, non-racist white people and quote unquote minorities… because these types of articles make it sound like every white person is guilty of racism, or perpetuating racism, or not doing enough somehow unless we are militantly picketing. All because of being born white…
Fuck that shit. I’m doing my part by not being a racist and not tolerating racist comments in my presence. And if people use the excuse of voting for Obama or having friends who are [insert minority], it is not further racism, it is usually a (somewhat misguided) attempt to demonstrate to the interlocutor that they, in fact, do not view people of a different race as less capable or worse.
When I see articles like these, whether attacking people for racism or sexism or whatever, all I can think is: grow the f**k up. Acting high and mighty, adopting an angry, self-righteous tone about racism and alienating potential supporters will get you nowhere. Because believe it or not, for many white people being called a racist is extremely hurtful. We would never want to come across that way.
Dear death makes some of us happy (@107),
50 years “coming to a belief” does not give any validation to your racist self-justification. Obviously you are not a sociologist, so have had no opportunity to delve into the structural, political, and economic foundations of the ‘black crime wave’ of the 80’s. And I don’t expect you to. But rest assured that you are mistaking the symptoms for the cause, and clearly have given up on being part any cure.
You are not so much offensive as sad.
Enjoy your beliefs. May they bring you the comfort of self-righteous superiority.
Also, Ahamefule J. Oluo (@98)
Thank you for your well-reasoned response. While it probably won’t convince anyone who as spent ’50 years coming to a belief’ (which I read as ’50 years reinforcing my prejudices’), it provides some great arguments for those who are perhaps just ignorant and willing to learn.
@123, let me just ask you, why did you feel the need to write your original comment? What was your motivation? Did you feel the need to make sure people knew it was ok to treat individuals poorly purely because of their race? Do you think you are helping to make the world better with your statements? I’m done disputing your absolutely insane and ignorant “reasoning”, you are clearly beyond hope but luckily you are old and you will die soon. I just want to know why you felt your comments contributed anything to this conversation or the world as a whole…or is it possible that you are just a sad human being that, upon assessing the depressing mess that is their existence, looks for any excuse to make themselves feel superior to others??? I THINK WE HAVE A WINNER. I’m sure that will make you very happy in your few remaining years.
@129 In response to the writer’s (and early commenters) Angry Black Man tirade; his idea that gay people should somehow be immune from racist thoughts. My response was yes, of course most white people are racist. My point was that we have every reason to be. What was so difficult for you to understand about that?
I have to go to work now. Someone has to pay taxes to support all of those fatherless black children.
Stay out of jail while I’m gone! And for fuck’s sake, pull up your pants. I’m so sick of having to see black men’s underpants.
@87 Can I come live in your universe? White heterosexual men are not free from unthinking automatic prejuidice. It is just those prejuidicial assumptions don’t have as much impact on their lives.
Of course, the subtle racism and sexism of the rest of your post is funny.
A white man going into a neighborhood where he is unwelcome either as a visitor or as a new resident have no negative assumptions made about him? Do you really think that white people are held up on that high of a pedastal? Are the concerns possibly different? Sure, but that doesn’t mean that the people in that neighborhood don’t have their own preconceived assumption nor that those assumptions are positive or friendly.
I’ve got bad news for you, it is likely that there are women out there spreading stories about those times you were a drunken jerk as warnings to other women about men. I know that I’ve heard enough of those stories from the women in my life.
There is this discounting of the negative thoughts of people toward you because they are not white males, and you are, that seems funny (as in odd, not ha ha) to me. Why do you assume that you are not being veiwed negatively because you are a white male?
Can’t love this enough
There are no such thing as “races”.
I am not saying there is no such thing as “rascism”. It is an unfortunate and terrible social problem.
Races were/are arbitrary labelings created to oppress and control (rascism) that have lasting effects to this day. Judging someone on thier phenotype makes Zero logical sense. I think it is problematic to continue to say there are different races becuase this creates a clear line between people thus perpetuating prejuduce.
Why does no one ever challange this point?
The creation of “races” was arbitrary. If tou want to argue gentics-Fact: there is more genetic difference between people that come from the same part of the world then there is people that come from different parts.
Do we judge people on blood type? Or eye color? Or how hairy their chests are? Seems silly right? Well it is the same thing.
“Being gay is not a race” Neither is having dark skin, or light skin.
I am challenging the idea of “races”.
I am not saying there is no such thing as “rascism”. It is an unfortunate and terrible social problem.
Races were/are arbitrary labelings created to oppress and control (rascism) that have lasting effects to this day. Judging someone on thier phenotype makes Zero logical sense. I think it is problematic to continue to say there are different races becuase this creates a clear line between people thus perpetuating prejuduce.
Why does no one ever challange this point?
The creation of “races” was arbitrary. If you want to argue gentics, Fact: there is more genetic difference between people that come from the same part of the world then there is people that come from different parts. Meaning you are more similar to someone who does not have the same skin color as you then you are with someone who has the same skin color.
Do we judge people on blood type? Or eye color? Or how hairy their chests are? Seems silly right? Well it is the same thing.
I get it, based on your premise that although a Caucasian Gay person is a minority they are bestowed (due to white skin) Caucasian Privilege -albeit about two seconds until it is realized that they are Gay, then all bets are off.
Making racist comments, and being a racist are not the same thing. I have been accused of being a racist, and making racist statements. It seems the default accusation these days when engaging in a discussion of Race, and the other side does not agree with your opinion.
So, the Negro is oppressed every day of their life -you are oppressed every day of your life. What was that you had stated, oh, that you are ‘victimized’. Victimization is a self-inflicted crime that you perpetrate against yourself. Get over it, the Negro is not the only oppressed individual in America.
Sylvia’s Seattle
@122 – I didn’t say apologize for being white. Good job for being purposely obtuse. If you say something offensive be prepared to be called out on it, apologize and don’t do it again. Is that clear enough for you?
So let me get this straight. You make wild assumptions about your entire audience, accuse them of being racists, ask them to disprove your vile assertion, and then ask them to sympathize with you. Good luck with that, dipshit.
So let me get this straight. You make wild assumptions about your entire audience, accuse them of being racists, ask them to disprove your vile assertion (impossible, apparently), and then ask them to sympathize with you. Good luck with that, dipshit
I have a question for the writer: if a black guy says something profoundly racist, then you call him on it, how would you react if his answer is “I can’t be racist, I’m black”? (from personal experience)
@6: “Even if our goal is to be as non-racist as possible, we’re still white people (often men) who benefit from all that privilege and can only work as hard as possible to fight against it.”
So no matter how my parents raised me, no matter how I live my life, because I’m white and male I will always be racist? Really? Hmm… explain to me how THAT concept is not racist in and of itself. Is it because white males are the majority in this country? Doesn’t this mean that all black men are sexist against black women in any society where they are the majority? And what about if Seattle has more black men than jewish men? All black men must be anti-semites.
Fail.
@143: Dude, seriously, you are spending way too much time trying to prove your point. Rape and pillage has no race, it’s been done by every society at some point.
@SOLOMON GEORGIO: I’m white and I’m gay, but I never thought for a minute that it makes me incapable of racism. Racism is something that is in all humans at the genetic level. It is fear of the different. It comes from a time when we were microbes and when you bumped up against something different it was probably eat-or-be-eaten. That is why some people who are educated to the idea that racism is wrong try to teach their kids what they learned from their parents, that racism is wrong and to work against it. You are right, being gay is not a pass on the racism card. And being black is not a pass on the homophobe card. Especially the self hating homophobe card. Thus you have the “down-low”. But don’t worry, I”m not saying that ALL black men who are also gay are self hating homophobes.
And I love the circular logic here: White people are racist and if you call them racist they will get offended, thus all these white people getting offended on this message board proves they are racist. That’s really sad.
All humans are afraid of the “different” on a genetic level, it’s what we used to survive the climb up the evolutionary ladder. Take away all the white people and non-white people will find a way to differentiate amongst themselves and hate each other because of it. Take away all the white people and you have Tutsi-Hutu genocide. Take away all the black people and you have the Irish Catholics and the Irish Protestants killing each other. Or Germans killing Jews. Asian countries have been hating and killing each other for generations. The only thing that has moved us forward has been people working together despite all of this. Not punching each other in the face.
And in the end I also acknowledge that this is a Stranger article and thus its true purpose is to stir people up and be as controversial as possible. I can picture it at the Stranger home office:
“See Dan? Look at all those people fighting and hating on each other, call each other names! I sure stirred up some shit! It’s edgy!”
“Good job Solomon! Keep ’em coming! There’s a spot for you on the Stranger editorial board some day.”
I guess they win since I read the article. But I still feel cheated.
Perhaps the author of this piece should look at the photo of the only democrat of vote against gay marriage in NY.
correction “to vote”
Knowing that America is perceived as a “racist” nation, despite subsidizing the complete destruction of Detroit, Birmingham, Atlanta, Newark, Baltimore, Cleveland, St. Louis and Los Angeles – not to mention the fact that every person in the world would immigrate here if possible – all you can do is ruefully smile.
@12/14
You’re right about not being able to help your skin color. The thing about “white privilege” is basically that a lot of what is considered normal and acceptable from within that schema is created/benefits by harming or oppressing others. At the end of the day it’s also harmful to you – it also limits your options and oppresses you in a number of ways and there’s really not enough space to go into THAT whole thing. If you read up on the idea of how the patriarchy also harms men, you’ll have the knack of it.
When people talk about the intersection of whiteness and white privilege, it’s my impression that the discussion centers around recognizing how harming/oppressing others is normalized by the system, and learning to combat that.
I’d recommend resources but I’m a lot more familiar with feminist theory to name off-hand, but they’re very related (functionally identical, in my opinion) theories. Perhaps someone else can recommend some explanatory reading material that focuses more on race.
@ 150 – Speaking as a non-American: I know absolutely no one who would emigrate to the States if they could.
You have a pretty exagerated view of your country’s reputation in the world. You should travel a bit. It’s supposed to broaden the mind.
@144 What was your response?
@ 46 Sorry that it’s not about white women this time?
Responding to the articule by sections: ‘I am gay,how could i be racist’?:ever hear of the anime ‘afro samurai’?…’ihave a good friend that is (insert ethnicity)’:dude,seriously,wake up and look around you!!! every minorty has friends that help friends out…what is considered offencive to you may not be to others…(example:if you don’t like ‘the lion king’ watch ‘kimbala the white lion’ instead)…’but i voted for obama.’:ever since george washinton to obama,whites have had a chance to behead all blacks…look niggat or fagger,think you could be the next prez…’get over it.’I WILL ‘KILL YOU’ IF YOU EVEN THINK OF ASSALTING ME,AND I WILL NOT STOP UNTILL YOU ARE DEAD,NO MATTER WHO INTERFERES,SO.DO NOT TRY IT!!! NOW, GET THIS THEN:ever since mankind was created we have been under someones rule,be it a person,place,or thing..so WTF is you point?…’okay.i’m out of excuses.what should i really do?’:FOR WHAT? TELLING THE TRUTH? (cont…)
i think this articule is just double standered horse shit this paper dreams up,who REALLY gives a dam about what race you are? AS FAR A I’M CONCERNED,you can be a alien from space and be gay…would you be racest then?
OK, if anyone wants to get serious about white privileged, what that means and how it works, this is the best article I’ve ever read regarding:
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0504…
“there’s no GI Bill today. The more recent government programs open to people of color, such as welfare and Food Stamps, have been tiny compared with the vast assets conferred on whites by the Homestead Acts and the GI Bill. And these recent programs have only helped with immediate living expenses, not college, home ownership, or other assets that provide security for coming generations. People of color have recently become homeowners in greater numbers thanks mostly to their own savings, without the kind of substantial government assistance that white families got in the 1950s and 1960s.
Government boosts for white people were invisible to my father. He opposed government hand-outs as destroying incentives to strive, without considering the hand-outs his family had received.”
I should add, that is just addressing white privileged on a historical, institutional level.
It doesn’t address being followed around Macy’s by a security guard because you have more melanin in your skin…
this article is talking to the white gay racist out there, rather then saying every white gay person is racist, right? If I’m wrong and the author is saying the latter, that’s the most outrageous thing I’ve read in a long long time, and he should be held to account.
@87 – very insightful.
What can we do about it? Because apart from the obvious trolls, I think most readers here are not the ones who cross the street.
Silvio Levy
Wow, so many defensive white people. Methinks thou dost protest too much. Obviously this got the Stormfront types’ frothing at the mouth.
As a white guy who’s dated black men (and is married to an absolutely incredible one), if you’re white, you really don’t see the 1000 cuts because you’re white – that’s part of the white privilege right there. I’ve seen people do shit to my man that they’d never do to me or wouldn’t have done it if they’d known I’d been paying attention.
If after reading this, your first reaction was “This isn’t me, it can’t be me, the poster is a racist!” instead of “Well huh, maybe I should learn more about what would make someone feel this way and what I can do to stop it” you’re part of the problem.
To Susanswerphone and “death makes some of us happy,” besides being utterly loathesome human beings, it’s obvious you want black cock and feel a deep, deep shame for it. Also, I hope that for karmic balance that the voting disenfranchisement bullshit going on bites you in the ass and you’re either prevented from voting or your vote doesn’t count. May you never breed, or if you do, your children grow up to despise you.
P.S> Solomon, this article was awesome. It can’t be easy to stomach the bile that was generated in the comment threads, but that’s what happens when you speak truth and people can’t allow themselves to hear it. Thank you again.
“Being in one minority group doesn’t excuse being insensitive to another minority group.”
Now that is a great thesis sentence.
Thanx
@160
“To Susanswerphone and “death makes some of us happy,” besides being utterly loathesome human beings, it’s obvious you want black cock and feel a deep, deep shame for it.”
Ah, yes. That must be it. This shamelessly racist lesbian secretly desires black cock. So good to know.
“if you’re white, you really don’t see the 1000 cuts because you’re white – that’s part of the white privilege right there.”
Care to get into a discussion over male privilege? The 1000 cuts that males will never see?
So given the fact that women have been oppressed since the beginning of time, why aren’t prisons filled with us? Where are the female gangs terrorizing the populace? Hell, where are the Jewish gangs? No peoples have been more brutalized than they. Apparently it makes sense to some of you that black males commit so much of the crime in this country. After all, they’re “victims” of oppression. Your theory would work if all recipients of oppression acted out in this way but they don’t.
And no one has accepted my challenge of explaining what exactly it is about the oppression of the black male that has caused so many of them to abandon their own children. Waiting. Patiently waiting. With visions of black cock dancing through my head…
Some additional information for those who are interested:
This book, The Meaning of Difference, I found at a used book store. It addresses difference, prejudice, privilege and racism in a generally anecdotal way, without being too technical or wordy. It includes the essay ‘Unpacking the Invisible Backpack’, which is often used to describe privilege.
The Meaning of Difference: American Constructions of Race, Sex and Gender, Social Class, Sexual Orientation, and Disability
http://www.nymbp.org/reference/WhitePriv…
Oh, you’re a lesbian! My apologies for the black cock comment then, but double my comment about you being loathesome.
You seem to be saying that all oppression is exactly the same and everyone is going to react to it exactly the same way. I call bullshit.
@163
Wait, you’re a lesbian and you think that black men are the only ones who wear sagging pants?!
What little credibility you ever had is now completely shot. Do you even know any lesbians?
@165
Again we must visit this basic premise – that gay people are somehow immune from having strong negative feelings about a group of people. I don’t understand the logic.
Second only to christians, black people are gays biggest enemies. They openly fight against our rights (everyone remember what happened to Prop 8 when all the blacks came out to vote for Obama?). Tracy Morgan’s recent comments are but the latest in a loooooong line of anti-gay rhetoric from the black community.
So, and correct me if I’m wrong, it’s perfectly acceptable for one minority group (blacks) to hate another (gays), but it’s a capital sin for one minority group (gays) to hate another (blacks). Someone very intelligent, and very persuasive is going to have to come along and explain that one to me. I call big bullshit on that.
Add this to all of the social behavior complaints I’ve made on this thread and do you really not understand why I don’t get the idea that gays can’t have strong negative feeling towards blacks?
I can’t speak for gay men, having never been one, but as a lesbian, 99% of the verbal harassment I’ve been subjected to has come from black men. Black men are not okay with lesbianism. Don’t know the whys of it, just know that it’s been not only my experience, but that of most other lesbians I’ve talked to on the matter. But I’m supposed to have unconditional positive regard for blacks because they’re a fellow minority? How does that work in your head?
And from the last part of your second sentence I gather you think lesbians are especially immune to racist thoughts/feelings. Seriously?! I have dated exactly ONE woman who wasn’t hugely racist. Ask your lesbian friends how black men treat them. Then have a couple of drinks with them. Once they let their guard down they might tell you how they really feel. It’s a dirty secret we share only amongst ourselves. Sorry to burst bubbles!
@ 166
That was funny. Touche!
@166
(this might double post)
That was funny. Touche!
@167, let me ask you one last question, I just want to make sure I understand your logic. I am a black man, I am a single father, I have had custody of my children since their mother and I divorced 6 years ago. She is white, she went years without seeing them and never paid a cent in child support. I have never been convicted of a crime in my life. I grew up poor, in the “black community”, got a full scholarship to an elite private college and pay taxes every year… Now, If I understand correctly, you feel like I deserve to be hated because I happen to be black…I personally deserve to be despised as an individual human being?
@170
You absolutely do not deserve to be despised.
I should probably use disclaimers whenever I speak in generalities but I don’t. Of course there are exceptions to every rule. Hell, there are even a few friendly lesbians in Seattle. But stereotypes, rules, etc, exist for a reason. They are very often true. It’s a numbers game, really. Because there are so many blacks that fit the negative stereotype, the stereotype is strong.
Do christians hate me because I’m an ‘afront’ to their god? You betcha. Do I care? Of course not. People are free to think what they think. I’ll get damn cranky when their thoughts turn into attempted legislation, but their thoughts? They’re free to have them.
Seeming to go off topic here, please bear with me, you know how so many people make the case that non-radical muslims didn’t/don’t do enough rebuking of the radical element in their religion? That by staying silent they are/were giving tacit approval to the extremists? Many white people feel the same about blacks. Why don’t you (blacks, collectively) rail against the misogyny and homophobia in rap music? Why don’t you take to task all the absent black fathers? Why don’t you take a strong stand against the sexual slavery perpetrated by black pimps, sexual slavery that often victimizes the black woman? Is modern-day slavery okay as long as it’s just bitches/ho’s being enslaved?
Did you happen to read the story on cnn yesterday about the three rival California gangs that have put aside their differences to come together in enterprise. They’re now working as a single unit to maximize profits on their prostitution business. Read about these sex slaves. Read about their lives. Why aren’t blacks up in arms about this?
When white people speak out against these things we’re beaten with the “racist” stick. Obviously I don’t think it’s an insult, but most white people want to avoid that seemingly pejorative label so they are hesitant to speak out. But blacks should be speaking out. It’s your community these young males are destroying.
Why can’t blacks like yourself start a web site, or local paper, or whatever that drills home the notion that education is the key to getting out of poverty. That black women deserve your respect – they’re not property to be pimped or abused. That pimping is neither glamorous nor moral. I have no idea what can be done to fix the problem of absent black fathers but do you have any ideas? If so, please let them be known.
Failure to take a stand against these things = tacit approval. Everyone is accountable. And not just blacks. Every non-black who raps along with songs that promote all of this hatred of gays/degradation of women/glamorization of the gangsta lifestyle is likewise part of the problem. This shit isn’t cool. Please, black people who agree, SAY SO! Stand on the street corner and preach it if you have to but take a damn stand!
@167
So black people who voted for Obama caused Prop 8 to pass all by their lonesome and all the white (and hispanic and asian and…) people who did exactly the same thing are not a concern. Huh. I think you wanted a scapegoat and OH LOOK BLACK PEOPLE fits nicely into your narrative.
Also, do you have a website where you’re railing against the beastie boys, the rolling stones, bob dylan, billy joel, and elton john for their misogynistic songs? Why aren’t you taking a stand in rural West Virginia demanding that the people there get educated so that they can get out of poverty (because, you know, good education is so freely available to everyone everywhere)? Or is your concern only limited to those who do things you consider part of the immoral black lifestyle that is destroying this country? Because, at the end of the road, that’s what it feels like.
Again we must visit this basic premise – that gay people are somehow immune from having strong negative feelings about a group of people. I don’t understand the logic.
You’re simplifying things – it’s not just strong negative feelings about ‘a group of people’ it’s having strong negative feelings about a group of people based on one immutable characteristic about them. Gays are told they’re destroying society and the family all the time, so hearing that projected onto an entire group of people by gays just because of their race is loathesome.
And bringing this full circle, the writer of this article is doing something he believes in – taking a stand against racism in the gay community – and just because it’s not the sort of thing you, a white lesbian, wish he, a black gay man, would take a stand on, you think it therefore negates his entire argument. To me however, your stand only validates it even more.
And that fits nicely into my narrative that you are a loathesome human being. I pity you. I don’t care if you don’t care about my pity for you, but holding onto all that hate to feel warm at night can’t be good for your soul, however you want to define that.
I’m also not taking this experience with you and believing that all white people (or all lesbians!) think this way. I personally tend to think that being a traditional white southern male isn’t good for society and I continue to hope that people reject wanting to be like that when they grow up. Hopefully you decide to reject it one day too.
@171
Allow me to play devil’s advocate for a moment. The VAST majority of the advances made in the realm of medical engineering, technological invention, financial entrepeneurship and political legislation in the past 200 years or so was achieved by men…that is indisputable. The vast majority of those men were married and their wives took care of the domestic duties, cooked, cleaned, raised children, etc. So, you could make an argument (again, devil’s advocate) that it for the benefit of the world that women stay in the kitchen so that their more capable male counterparts take care of running the world (I mean, if women were capable, wouldn’t they have done it? You’re not going to blame “the man” for this, are you?). You could argue that women deserve to be treated as subservient to men (again, I don’t believe any of this).
Continuing this FALSE argument, the majority of prostitutes are women, so I guess by your logic, you cant blame men for treating women like prostitutes…I mean, if women didn’t want to treated like prostitutes then maybe so many women shouldn’t be prostitutes. I mean, you are arguing that it is ok to hate black people because it’s a numbers game and a higher percentage of black people commit crimes…so clearly, it is ok to view all women as prostitutes because a much higher percentage of them are prostitutes compared to their male counterparts…it’s a numbers game, right?
AGAIN, EVERYTHING I HAVE SAID SO FAR IS COMPLETE BULLSHIT.
You and I know that none of that is true, there is no such thing as a more capable gender or race or ethnicity, people are people. You know that the historical and current 2nd class status of women (that is not my opinion of women, I am just acknowledging that is how they are treated by society as a whole) in this country is a RESULT of societal oppression, not a justification for it. You say that you ”hate black people” (verbatim), but that I, personally, do not deserve hatred…well here’s the thing, every black person is an individual person (crazy, huh?), just like every woman is a person…and because every black person also happens to be an individual person, they all deserve to be treated as such, to not be branded as this thing, this criminal, this deviant, before they have a chance to fulfill their potential. Of course you have a right to “hate black people”, but know, by doing so, you are making things worse, by advocating that viewpoint you are helping to continue a cycle.
How does equality happen? How does change happen? Lets take women for example, it takes strong women who stand up for their rights and lead by example, but that’s not enough. It also takes a shift in the mentality of our society, it takes everyone, men included, working to spread the OBVIOUS truth that women are not objects, women should not be the servants of men, women are equally capable and equally valuable…and the men that say “if women don’t want to be treated like whores, then they shouldn’t act like it” are an enemy of that progress, they are an enemy of making the world a better place.
It is the same situation for Black Americans, change certainly takes strong black people who stand up for their rights and lead by example (you said “start a website” or something…you realize there are thousands of websites made by black people aimed to make improvements in the black community, right?) , but again, that is not enough. It takes a simultaneous shift in the mentality of all Americans, including you, to push forward. So, of course you have a right to say you hate black people, but by doing so you are making a direct effort to inhibit progress and directly working to continue the issues that you are complaining about.
We’ll never, ever get past this chicken vs egg argument. Blacks say they act the way they do because of how whites treat them. Whites say they treat blacks the way they do because of how blacks act. Stalemate.
172 & 173 fail to grasp that people should police their own. I know it’s a lot harder than blaming someone else for your lot. Keep making your excuses for horrible behavior. It will keep your people down and that’s just fine with me.
To the few black males that raise/support their own children, society appreciates it. It’s your only saving grace.
@176 I will bring that up at the next black person meeting, you idiot. What you fail to grasp is that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about “police your own”, there are no “kinds” of people, there are just people. You choose to segregate, you choose to make things worse, I try to make things better, maybe you can bring some of these issues up at your next “horrible human being” meeting. I’m doing my part, if you don’t want to do yours, I don’t care, you are a sad, pathetic excuse for a person and I am done with you.
@ 176,
Consider this yet another example of white privilege: your statements make you repugnant, however it would seem ludicrous to be openly dismissive of all Caucasians based on my experience with you.
I do acknowledge that malevolent feelings (racism, misogyny, homophobia) exist in individuals of all colors. I have this thread, and you need only look in the mirror for evidence of that.