Three months ago, I met a woman who I’m really into physically, emotionally, and mentally. She’s someone I could see myself with. Problem is, when we started having sex, she insisted on a condom for birth control. I haven’t worn one in probably eight or nine years. (I’m 33 now.) I would be hard, then put on the condom and start having sex, and go limp because of the feel. This happened many times over the first couple months, leading to frustration on both our parts. She went on the pill a couple weeks ago to deal with the issue, but now I’ve got a mental issue going on and still go limp once we start having sex. As soon as I get inside her, it’s all I think about and things turn to shit. I feel like it’s not a physical problem, as it hasn’t happened before, so I’m not sure that drugs would even work. I don’t know what to do. It’s at the point of ruining this relationship.
Futile Limp-Ass Cock Is Dreadful
Before I get to your question, FLACID, I wanna pull rank—it’s my column, people—and briefly mention the staggeringly amazing thing that happened two weekends ago while I was in New York: the 8:00 p.m. performance of The Book of Mormon at the Eugene O’Neill Theater on the Saturday of Pride weekend. I didn’t think it was possible, but Trey Parker, Robert Lopez, and Matt Stone’s brilliant new musical about well-intentioned Mormons on a mission exceeds the hype. It’s the funniest, dirtiest, smartest thing that this showqueen has ever seen on Broadway.
Yeah, yeah, something else happened in New York while I was in town: A bill legalizing same-sex marriage was approved by the state legislature, and signed by Governor Andrew Cuomo, the night before we saw The Book of Mormon. And, hey, being in New York for the marriage-equality victory was nice. It was great. But The Book of Mormon—holy shit!
Okay, FLACID, if your dick goes limp once you put it inside her, stop putting it inside her. Just for now. Have oral sex, masturbate together, have lots of imaginative, nonpenetrative sex, all the while paying careful attention to her vulva, clit, orgasms, etc. A few dozen successful, low-stress sexual encounters with your girlfriend should help break the association your dick has made with her and failure. Good luck.
Yay, we won gay marriage in New York. I’m so happy, I could cry. But not tears of joy. Here’s the deal: I support gay marriage. I’m a freakin’ lesbian. I’ve been with my partner for 10 years. We live together. We’re the proud parents of the two cutest dogs ever. We suffer through each other’s families, and we’re treated as a married couple for all intents and purposes by everyone in our lives. I’ve made passionate speeches to friends and family members about the importance of gay marriage. So in 30 days, we can get married in New York. Everyone will expect us to get married. But I don’t want to. I’m happy in my relationship, I have no plans to leave, but I don’t want to be married. I think part of the strength of our relationship comes from being together because we want to in the moment, not because we promised to in a moment that has long passed. How do I tell my partner and everyone else that I love her with all my heart but don’t want to marry her? Or anyone else, ever?
Defense Of Marriagephobic Asshole
Same-sex marriage is legal in New York, DOMA, not compulsory. But instead of telling your partner that you don’t want to marry her, or anyone else, ever, tell her you need time. This freedom is new, hard-won, and not going anywhere. There’s no rush to commit to committing, DOMA, and no rush to commit to never committing. And you might want to ask your girlfriend how she feels. If she hasn’t been dropping hints, picking out china, or proposing, it’s possible that she feels just as conflicted or ambivalent about marriage as you do.
I’ve just ended a four-year relationship with a great man who didn’t lay his kink cards on the table until way too late. He’s your typical straight guy with a she-male fetish. Apparently, the dom pegging I provided wasn’t enough, because I found a secret e-mail account where he was soliciting she-male escorts. I’m genuinely more pissed that he didn’t tell me he wanted to explore this—real cock—and didn’t give me the opportunity to make his fantasy fit into our life together. I can’t tell if any of these escorts ever met with him, and in usual hetero-male fashion, he is mortified that I know about his darkest cock-fetish secret at all. So my question is this: As a GGG girlfriend who would honor just about any fantasy, is this secret search for a stranger the betrayal I think it is? I get it that our play isn’t the same as the real thing, but isn’t cheating cheating?
Willing But Not Enough
The snooping-is-wrong absolutists will shit themselves if “snooping is wrong” doesn’t appear somewhere in this response. So here it is, gang, right at the top. Heck, I’ll toss it out again—”snooping is wrong”—even though I disagree. No long-term relationship is snoop-free, just as no long-term relationship is lie-free, porn-free, or thinking-about-fucking-someone-else-while-I’m-fucking-you free. And when a little snooping uncovers something like this, well, it’s retroactively self-justifying.
On to your question, WBNE: Your ex’s secret search is the betrayal that you think it is. No question. Cheating is cheating, and the kind of cheating your ex was engaged in or contemplating amounts to a Very Serious Betrayal. He put you at risk of acquiring a sexually transmitted infection*, assuming he saw a sex worker, or he was thinking about putting you at risk, assuming he was about to. And it was all so unnecessary: He had a GGG girlfriend who he could’ve opened up to about his secret kink. He could’ve negotiated a deal that allowed him to explore this without betraying you or putting you at risk. But he didn’t ask for permission because he was deeply ashamed, first, and terrified of losing you, second. And now he’s really got something to be ashamed of—the lying and sneaking around—and he’s lost you. Unless…
Unless you can find it in your heart to forgive him.
His kink cards are faceup on the table now; you know his deepest, darkest sexual fantasies, and, more importantly, he knows you know. Yes, he betrayed you, but forgiveness is meaningless if it’s limited to trifles and never comes after a Very Serious Betrayal. If his kink is something you would’ve signed off on had he gone about things differently, perhaps you could take him back on the condition that he go about things—finding things, sucking things, getting fucked by things**—very, very differently from now on.
*I’m not saying that a man who visits a sex worker is automatically going to get a sexually transmitted infection; a good sex worker is typically more thoughtful about sexual safety than your average freebie slut. But outside sexual contact is outside sexual contact. Whomever it involves, it involves risk for the insider back at home, and it should be disclosed and discussed in advance.
**I’m not calling MTF sex workers “things.” I’m calling their things things.
Find the Savage Lovecast (my weekly podcast) every Tuesday at thestranger.com/savage.
I just love you, Dan. If you were straight, I would totally stalk you… in a good way.
@22 As a polyandrous female, I haven’t found that males are ‘unwilling to commit in a relationship’, but I’m honest about what I’m looking for, so my relationships pretty much start committed or don’t start.
“Can anyone in an open or poly relationship really expect long term commitment to the relationship?”
Yes, why couldn’t you? Committing to a relationship, for me, means being there for the people you love, supporting them emotionally and financially if need be, supporting their goals, being GGG, and so on. It can happen in monogamous, monogamish or nonmonogamous relationships. It can also be absent from any of the above.
When you say women complain about men’s lack of commitment, do you know what they mean? It’s a concept I’ve always struggled with because it seems to suddenly come up in established relationships, and I always wonder “why didn’t you discuss these issues before starting the relationship?”
@30 Poor choice of words at 2AM, but as far as I know other women don’t ridicule or laugh at a woman whose husband/man cheats on her. Possibly because they realize how easily it could happen to them. I could well be wrong about this. Of course humiliation is experienced by regardless of your sex and anyone’s self esteem will take a hit. Self hatred is also not gender specific.
I love how Dan’s so good at this now, he just can do it reflexively. To FLACID, he digresses into gay marriage, The Book of Mormon, then, oh, yeah, the question? Do this this and this. Bam-solved! Next.
P.S. I feel unbearably lame that I don’t know what GGG means. Enlightenment anyone?
jill
http://inbedwithmarriedwomen.blogspot.co…
FLACID: Buy some Viagra online. That sh!t will rehabilitate your limp dick faster than you can say “hard-on”.
Thank you, Ms Erica. I have noticed that some women get at least a partial pass about being “Pet Parents”.
More power to you as you do your best to handle a tricky situation with grace. I have half an instinct to compare you to Jacqueline de Bellefort and another to ask if you’ve read much of Iris Murdoch.
@ 34, for not caring, you sure have a lot to say about my minor annoyance.
I didn’t give a pass to DOMA’s description of herself as a dog’s parent. I rolled my eyes and everything as I read it. But I just didn’t feel like engaging with it. For what it’s worth: your pets aren’t children.
@37 EricaP
If I may paraphrase you:
I don’t want to trade her in for another person who (insert any reason); I want her. Every day. That’s how I know that I’m staying.
Thanks for articulating that so well. Of course how I go about managing to stay may be quite different from the way you do.
Owners. By calling yourself a Pet Parent, you’re calling yourself a dog. Only dogs have puppies, is that what you are? No, STFU. An owner-pet bond is completely different to a parent-child bond. Taking care of things you like does not make you their parent. Go read a dictionary.
@ 42 I know! I love pets but I hate children, so to me it’s like an insult!
OMG DAN!!! ROFL!!!
In your podcast & in response to the “hungry unicorn” question … “it’s not gay because a man could do it to a woman and lick her ***TAINT***”.
What does a woman have where a man has a taint, Dan?
This is not a trick question …
There’s a *vagina* there, Dan.
*Please* try to remember – you’re the pro here.
@64: Yes, I thought the same thing when I listened to the podcast.
@ 17 – On the topic of referring to trans-people as she-males… ugh. Most people here are presumably aware enough not to use the “N-word”, can you (and Dan) not see that using the term she-male would also be offensive?
And yes, language does matter – specifically, the language YOU use matters because not using offensive terminology shows that you are respectful and not a complete turd.
I think that if you truly have empathy for the struggles of trans people, you should be doing everything in your power to make their lives easier, not using it to justify your own crap behaviour.
@54 a woman who stays with her philandering husband is seen as a fool.
@57, how does Jacqueline de Bellefort come into this? She conspires to murder her lover’s wife. I will confess to holding myself to higher standards. My inspiration, such as it is, comes more from Sondheim than Murdoch.
@69, yes, Hunter. By the few friends I’ve told. Our culture is cruel. As are you.
Hi EricaP @ 71,
I’m wishing you joy. Thank you for your transparency. And, you’re right, relationships are a give and take. You’re wise and you know how to keep the balance.
Take care,
k
@ 69,
You remind me of my childhood bully, always making little jabs. Please don’t tell me she started it, either. I think you’re a better person than you like to portray here. And, lets face it, “cruelty” is only sexy when it is in a consensual BDSM relationship. Stop please.
Hi Kim! I missed you in Slog Bible Study this week 🙂
@64 & 65: There’s a nice little sensitive bit of skin twixt the vagina & the anus — the lower edge of the “wall” separating those organs. ‘Tain’t pussy & ’tain’t asshole — you know, TAINT!
More anatomically correct name is the “perineum.”
I don’t know, 36. I was once of the mindset that “doesn’t sticking around – day-in and day-out – make our relationship more meaningful than being beholden to a public commitment?” Once we had a lengthy discussion about how not getting legally married would actually be a better option for us, I was ALL FOR the ceremony. I wasn’t actually afraid of telling the world how I felt, I was afraid of being trapped by a legal structure that I believe has a lot of flaws for many people (but many benefits for many other people, just not us).
I’m simply suggesting that the sudden availability of marriage and all the other issues that come with having a legally-binding relationship *might* be part of her discomfort. Just an opportunity to think about the source of the discomfort a little more, and explore all of their options rather than taking a “marriage or nothing” approach. If she ultimately decides that any type of public declaration is not up her alley…fine! Really, it’s her and her partner’s choice. But I know, for me personally, having the pressure of conforming to a set standard of “marriage” taken off me made me want to declare my intentions post-haste…much to his pleasure as he was all for marriage until we really sat down and examined what that would mean for us! He was interested in the commitment, I was interested in preserving my legal autonomy…middle ground is great from my vantage point!
EricaP, I’m in the early stages of ending my 28 year partnership and understand the heartbreak, stress and anxiety you’re going through in making your decision. This was obviously very difficult for me for many, many reasons, but ultimately I couldn’t keep postponing the inevitable. I kept recalling this old saying: “Change occurs when the pain of remaining the same is greater than the pain of change.”
I hope everything works out for the best for you. You’ll be in my thoughts. xo
64, 75– The best explanation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thPN6-5tA…
But yes, perineum is the most correct term.
@Erica
I’m not married and have less life experience than most people here but I think it’s salient to point out that there’s a difference between staying with a philandering husband (ie. staying with someone despite them having been disrespectful to you, and shown a lack of concern for your feelings – which I do think IS somewhat foolish and not something I would do) and opening up your marriage with the desire to make them happy (which is something I personally could not do, but I don’t think you’re foolish for doing it. Not that it matters)
@76
we would, but they’re just so gash darn cute
@79 — Of course — and both males & females have perinea!
From Urban Dictionary:
1. On a man, the area between the sack and the crack
2. On a woman, the area between the giney and the heinie
@ 74,
Hi Erica,
I responded to your request on that thread.
One thing that might help with wearing condoms is to get better fitting ones. For some reason the USA does not have really wide condoms, so I import mine from Amsterdam:
http://condomerie.com/condooms-op-maat
(Switch the little flag in the top corner to English if you get Dutch.)
Win all around.
Not all women can do hormonal birth control — drugs make it less effective and it has side effects. Seen the articles about it changing what men women are attracted to? Eek.
despicable_me @78 – so sorry to hear that you are going through sad times; I hope you receive not just less pain through the change, but some chance for joy as well.
>> “Change occurs when the pain of remaining the same is greater than the pain of change.”
I didn’t have an option called “remaining the same.” He changed. I could cope, or I could leave, but I couldn’t force things back the way they were. That’s life. And I like my lemonade just fine, even if I didn’t ask for a lemon tree in my backyard.
In any relationship there is always the risk of one party or the other of bonding with someone else. As I see it that is risk greater with an open or poly relationship since the participants are already engaged in the type behavior that makes bonding possible. That is a risk I would rather avoid as much as possible.
@32 Wow, how many assumptions can you cram into one comment. You went from 9 years not wearing a condom to 9 years of fucking anything that moves without a condom. Did it even occur to you that the reason this guy hasn’t used a condom in 9 years was that he was in a long term relationship and this is his first relationship since?
I think most people expect that in a straight monogamous relationship where both partners are STI free, and have been tested to make sure, and another birth control is being used (or the woman has entered menopause) that condom use will usually end.
I do think FLACID just needs to get over it. Honestly I’ve never understood men whining about getting a bit soft when putting on a condom. Like once they start getting soft they can’t get it up again. That’s when you ask you partner to help you get it hard again with a little hand or mouth assistance.
It sounds like FLACID may be putting just a little too much emphasis on vaginal penetration over other forms of sexual contact. Not all sex has to end with the guy coming from fucking a pussy. Dan is right, relax when it comes to penetration and do something else.
Erica- having a nice party for the family is no reason to get married- why not just throw a party? If you think your husband respects you for your ability to compromise and or be open minded about this, you are wrong. He sees you as a dumb sucker that he can continue to use…. have some self respect and maybe he will come to respect you as well.
The advice for FLACID sounds so reasonable. I only wish we got follow-through in these columns. Does it work? Did it work? I’d like to hear from someone who tried non-penetrative sex for a while and now is happily getting hard again with or without condoms. How long did it take? Do you think viagra would have been the better way to go? Was your partner happy with the arrangement? Were there other issues besides the condom, maybe something to do with not getting hard when emotionally involved?
Enjoy your lemonade, EricaP 🙂
@86: What do you mean, ‘risk’? The whole point is often to bond with someone else, not to avoid bonding.
It just seems wrong somehow when many of the most ardent and vocal advocates of social change refuse to participate once society caves to their pressure. Whether it be abolitionists placing restrictions on where freed slaves could live and work or proponents of desegregation refusing to send their children to integrated public schools. Is it unreasonable to expect those who fought for equality to be in the forefront in the execution of it. Failure to do so undermines their credibility. While you can legislate social change, you can’t legislate social acceptance.
I fucking hate it when pet owners call themselves parents. Animals are not kids you dipshits!
I know, right? It’s completely different. If you have a cat or a dog, you’re committing to taking care of them for the rest of their life; you clean their pee, poop, and vomit, stay up worrying when they’re sick, comfort them when they’re afraid, teach them right from wrong and how to play nicely with others, and try to make sure they’re physically healthy and intellectually stimulated.
Whereas with a kid………………..wait, where was I going with this?
Sadly, to one who has followed EricaP’s story for some time, it appears that based on what she is sharing that she is no longer in a mutual primary relationship with her husband. [Reading tea leaves with limited information is not a precise science] Some general observations not necessarily applicable in this or any specific situation. There is no satisfying some people and they will always want more. Repeatedly compromising with them is ultimately futile and only delays the inevitable. Coming to that realization is often a very painful and torturous process. No matter how desperately you may want something or someone won’t make it true and will in the long run just cause you more pain and humiliation.
Damn server didn’t save my qualifying postscript.
From the adult child of a (really long) dead, extremely insecure and manipulative alcoholic mother. At times I still flash back on the frustration and helplessness of my youth.
@ 22:
“Can anyone in an open or poly relationship really expect long term commitment to the relationship?”
Well… yes. My wife and I have been together almost twelve years and going strong; the two of us have been with our shared boyfriend for six years, and I’ve been with my girlfriend for two. This all took lots and lots and LOTS of talk and work and making-sure-we-shared-the-same-expectations for each relationship, but it works very well.
I think you make an interesting point, though, in your comment @54… “as far as I know other women don’t ridicule or laugh at a woman whose husband/man cheats on her.”
With the implication that other men do. This says a lot to me about patriarchy. If women are seen as conquests and property, then a man who can’t keep a woman– whose conquest turns out not to have been quite conquered after all, and whose property gets stolen– is a failure, and deserves to be laughed at. For women in that system, though, it’s unfortunate but inevitable that men won’t be satisfied with just one conquest, and will go on to others– and so women in that system sympathize with each other about men’s infidelities rather as they would about natural disasters or illnesses.
Dear *gods*, do I prefer to live in a system wherein I’m in relationships with people because I like *those individual people*, and want to be with them because I enjoy their company, not because my self-image depends on it.
(I’m not saying that people in the above-mentioned system don’t *also* enjoy each other’s company as people, but that overlay of patriarchy/conquest adds some nasty complications to it.)
Ms Erica – Well, JdB is a bit extreme, but on occasion one does pick up little hints of “un qui aime et un qui se laisse aimer,” which is Poirot’s impression of Jacqueline and Simon when he happens to overhear them at Chez Ma Tante. Actually, of the triangle, I invoke Linnet quite often, and it was nice to give Jackie, whom I find far preferable to either Doyle, an airing.
Dame Iris actually seems to have more explorations of married couples with an outside BF/GF than not, and reasonably well balanced. Let’s see: The Sandcastle(H), The Bell(W), A Severed Head(HW), An Unofficial Rose(HW), The Nice and the Good(W), Bruno’s Dream(WH), A Fairly Honourable Defeat(WH), An Accidental Man(H), The Sacred and Profane Love Machine(H), The Philosopher’s Pupil(H), The Good Apprentice(W), The Book and the Brotherhood(W), The Message to the Planet(H), and several others with an indirect look at the couple or in which they aren’t married: The Unicorn; The Italian Girl; The Black Prince; A Word Child; The Sea, the Sea; Nuns and Soldiers.
@89 – Who is to say who is using whom? He gets hot sex with me and his new girl friend, but on the other hand he works crazy hours at a very intense job. Me, I’m a writer, and frequent Slog poster. I take care of our kids, and I get hot sex with him (and get my intense kink needs met with other people). Maybe he’s the dumb sucker? Or maybe there is no dumb sucker, just two people trying to figure out life without an answer key.
@95 – he’s had a girlfriend for a month. The fact that they have some “New Relationship Energy” is not the same as saying he’s about to abandon me and his family. But thanks for gratuitously trying to undermine my marriage.
As for this: “There is no satisfying some people and they will always want more.” Yes. True. More love, more hot sex, more happiness, until the day they die. Crazy bastards.
Frederica Bimble said: “FLACID needs to grow the hell up! Men who whine like little babies over having to use condoms with NEW partners are self-indulgent children. I’d dump any man who had a problem with using them…”
For which the men in question should be enormously grateful.
@86 – it’s impossible to avoid the risk of your partner falling in love with someone else and leaving you, unless you lock your partner in the basement with no internet access. To love is to risk pain. There is no “safe” way through.
@96 – just noticed your postscript. I’m sorry for your childhood pain with your untrustworthy mother.
@87 – “I do think FLACID just needs to get over it. Honestly I’ve never understood men whining about getting a bit soft when putting on a condom. Like once they start getting soft they can’t get it up again. That’s when you ask you partner to help you get it hard again with a little hand or mouth assistance.”
Certain brands of condoms (Durex for one) sold in the US are too small for me and will make me lose my erection every time. It’s not whining – I don’t mind using condoms at all. It’s a complete loss of sensation past the ring that holds the condom on (I strongly suspect cock rings would have the same effect on me, but I cannot be sure having never tried one).
My partner can’t do magic – nothing will make it stiff again. I’ve come with an entirely flacid dick just trying. Whatever sensation I need to remain hard just isn’t there for some reason. But with other brands I can get, I have no problem using them and enjoying everything. Maybe you don’t understand that every penis is as unique to the man carrying it as every clitoris is unique to the woman?
@93 – You’re thinking about things a little too simply. Many people recognize that social change needs to happen whether they want to (or even can) be a part of it or not. I’m straight and I went to the Pride festivals in my area and signed petitions and everything – should my state change its legislation, do I have to marry a man just because I supported a just cause?
Also, what’s wrong with a transgender or genderqueer person claiming a word as empowerment? It’s okay for me to say “queer” or “gay” but I’m not allowed to say “she-male?” I have a friend who refers to himself as a she-male; he identifies as male, is homosexual, but acts feminine and dresses in women’s clothing, as well as having very real breasts (thanks to hormones). The term he doesn’t like is “trap” which apparently gets used on the internet a lot. AFAIK he enjoys his penis (also afaik he isn’t a sex worker).
@103 Not really. I gave two of many historical examples of people forcing what was considered to be radical social change at the time who effectively imposed it on other people, but were unwilling have it apply to them personally. Congress is/has been very good at exempting itself from the legislation it foists on the rest of us.
Some examples of failed attempts at unsupported social change include prohibition, the war on drugs, and the current assault on reproductive rights. The problem with pushing any radical social agenda is that enlivens and radicalizes the opposition which in turn will push for its own radical social agenda or takes steps to circumvent the affects of what is perceived to be forced social change. The roots of the current assault on public education can be traced back to the forced desegregation of school systems starting in the 1960’s and use of busing by judges to achieve that result starting in the 1970’s
“It’s impossible to avoid the risk of your partner falling in love with someone else and leaving you … To love is to risk pain. There is no ‘safe’ way through.” – EricaP
You have my thanks. This is true wisdom I’ve learned from.