My boyfriend of 16 months and
I have a great relationship. He loves my blowjobs, but he will not kiss
me if I have his come in my mouth. It grosses him out. We have talked
about this, and he won’t even try. I have no problem if he kisses me
after going down on me. I just want him to try. Is there something
wrong with asking him to taste himself? I do it all the time and love
it.
Missing Kisses
It’s funny that your question—with its
hint of gay panic—should arrive today. I’ve been on vacation with
the family all week snowboarding in beautiful British Columbia, and
what I enjoy most—besides the snowboarding and the half-naked,
fully stoned Australian snowboard instructors lolling around in hot
tubs at the end of the day—is watching the straight boys who
refuse to sit four to a chairlift. They want to ride up alone or ride
up two at a time on a four-seater with two empty seats between ’em.
They seem to think gayness can be contracted through thigh-to-thigh
contact.
Which it can.
Now, MK, there’s kissing someone with your
come on her breath and then there’s kissing someone with your come in
her mouth. It sounds like you’re interested in the latter, which makes
it sound like you’re interested in passing some of your boyfriend’s
load into his mouth—i.e., snowballing—and not simply being
rewarded with a kiss, his come on your breath, for a blowjob well-done.
And that’s an entirely different wad of spunk.
Just because you enjoy tasting yourself on
his lips doesn’t mean your boyfriend will enjoy or should have to enjoy
mouthing his own load. First, there’s a significant difference in
volume and consistency between your kissing his glazed lips and his
eating his own spunk. And then there’s this: After a woman comes, MK,
she’s still in a groove, still capable of more orgasms, still cranked
up. After ejaculating, a man is essentially uncranked. He’s not capable
of another orgasm (not right away, anyway)—he’s been knocked out
of his groove. So even if the idea of snowballing appeals to a man as
you’re blowing him, it might not hold the same appeal the moment after
he comes.
Some men are afraid of tasting their own
come because they believe that doing so, like sitting too close on a
chairlift, can turn a guy gay. And it’s not an unreasonable fear: not
because it will turn a guy gay, but because, judging from my mail, a
lot of women are convinced that any man who would taste his own come
must secretly be gay. It’s possible that your boyfriend is dying to
taste himself, MK, but, like the boys on the chairlifts, is afraid of
getting a reputation if he goes ahead with this and you blab about it
to your friends.
I am at the Meshuggah show at
El Corazón as I write this. There are tons of guys I consider
hot here, 98 percent of whom, I’m sure, are straight. But I got a vibe
off this one guy. This is such a macho environment, though, that
there’s a considerable amount of danger in asking the question “So, you
gay?”
I remember an episode of Law and Order where
Jerry Orbach tried to determine if a suspect was in AA by asking a
secret question, something like “Are you a friend of Bill W.?” The idea
was that the question was innocuous if you weren’t in AA.
Since you are the king of “santorum” and
“pegging” and “saddlebacking,” I thought maybe you could invent a
secret question for masculine gay men in masculine environments.
Something like, “Hey, do you like to barbecue?” So how ’bout it? Can
you declare the official secret are-you-a-masculine-gay-guy
question?
Men Are Cute Hot Objects
The best I could come up with on my own,
MACHO, was this: “A Little Night Music—
original
Broadway cast recording or original London cast?” But that line will
get your ass kicked in a lot of gay bars—as I know from bitter
experience. So let’s toss this out to my readers, the folks who came up
with the definitions for “santorum,” “pegging,” and “saddlebacking”:
Okay, gang, we’re looking for an innocuous question that (1) all fags
everywhere would know the answer to, but (2) no straight guys anywhere
would. My long-suffering interns—their uniforms chafe—await
your suggested questions at mail@savagelove.net.
I had to refrain from opening
this with “Hey, Asshole!” (oops, guess I kind of just did) after
reading your advice to Sex Best One On One, the woman who married a man
who warned her that he could not be monogamous and who then realized
she couldn’t share him. While I agree with your assessment of SBOOO’s
husband—up-front, honest—your assessment of SBOOO is
obviously influenced by your need to have a good rant at
polyamory-unfriendly marriage counselors, family, friends, and the
world at large. SBOOO does not have to apologize for who she is (not as
willing to do long-term nonmonogamy as previously thought) to elitist,
more-liberated-than-thou jerk-offs (hint: you!) after giving it a good
fucking try (12 times!). Pun intended.
Loving Toronto Reader
I am a polyamorist. I am
always up-front with my partners about this, especially if I want to
get serious with them. So many people seem to say that they are fine
with it out of some kind of misguided assumption that they can
eventually change my mind. You know, “Polyamory isn’t real; it’s just a
phase!” You know, like being gay.
I just wanted to say thank you for your
reply to SBOOO! I couldn’t have said it better myself. That was an
absolutely fantastic response. Just like you said, counselors (and for
that matter, family members) always see the polyamorist as the bad guy,
unreasonably refusing to take the simple, easy route of strict
monogamy. It was really nice to finally have someone stand up for us.
Thank you!
While I’m sure you enjoy positive feedback,
saying thank you is cheap. A lot of times you plug various charities
and causes in your column—is there any group you’d like me to
donate to as a more concrete symbol of my appreciation?
Longtime Fan
Some folks think I was too hard on SBOOO,
some think I was just hard enough. Like I said in my original response,
I intentionally came down hard on SBOOO to compensate for the vast and
overwhelming majority of advice professionals who would, per LF, side
aggressively with her because a nonmonogamous partner—even an
honest one like SBOOO’s mate—is always perceived as the bad
guy.
For the record: I am not biased toward
nonmonogamy. But I do think monogamous people should be with each other
and refrain from marrying folks who are self-aware enough to inform
them in advance that they don’t think they’re capable of being
monogamous.
Some folks who wrote in about my advice for
SBOOO raised a good point: I should have come down on the husband as
well. If nonmonogamy was a deal breaker for him, then he was a fool to
marry SBOOO before verifying her ability to be nonmonogamous. Agreed.
So, for the record: SBOOO’s husband? You’re an idiot, too.
Finally, LF, I’m always happy to see money
go to Planned Parenthood.
MK to me, “waahhh *whine* he won’t his boogers and I love eating my boogers whats wrong with him that he won’t eat them or kiss me when I eat them?” Damn B he just doesn’t like it get over it.
If MK’s boyfriend was a woman refusing to even try something her partner wanted, Dan would have been all DTMFA before the end of the first paragraph.
“Friend of Dorthy” has been done to death. Even my brothers know that…
The question needs to be something two straight guys would say to each other, but only gay men would know that it’s code:
“Do you know anything about automatic transmissions?”
“Make sure it’s lubed well…”
Okay, bad example… but you get the idea. I figure Dan’s readers are pretty clever and can think of something perfect.
Try this: Hi, I’m gay. What do you think about that?
No good? Then forget about getting equal rights or even simple respect.
If you can’t tell whether he wants to fuck you, he doesn’t want to fuck you. There is no secret code called for. And really there is something totally creepy about trying to start one.
That being said, when my sister wanted to know if a guy in her dance class was gay or not, i recommended starting up a round of this friendly game: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuck,_Marry…
“Try this: Hi, I’m gay. What do you think about that?
No good? Then forget about getting equal rights or even simple respect.”
YES! Thank you.
“If MK’s boyfriend was a woman refusing to even try something her partner wanted, Dan would have been all DTMFA before the end of the first paragraph.”
As many examples of women dating guys into rape play demonstrate, that is patently untrue.
Re Missing Kisses
Giving good head is hard work. As a straight guy I wouldn’t know this myself, but I do know that the better a BJ is the more it prolongs my erection and thus intensifies the eventual OOOOHHH MMMMYY GAWWWDDD!!!
This must require exceptional diligence and patience, and a good degree of skill to bring me right up there and avoid gagging. I like to share a good deep kiss soon thereafter — not because I am a fan of ‘snowballing’ (which I had never heard of) but to let her know that I am not in the least grossed out by that which is, after all, dribbling down her chin.
This is more than affectionate and thankful. It is gentlemanly! At least the ladies seem to think so.
Oh hell, if a guy expects me to swallow and kiss him after he goes down on me, he can damn well not act like my lips are radioactive ’cause they’ve touched his jizz. If he’s that self-conscious and grossed out by sex, he’s not worth fucking.
“Friend of Dorothy” is an ancient codeword, dudes. I’m 57, and its use predates me by a lot… like when was the Wizard of Oz a new movie? The reason this codeword and all codewords already in use are ancient is because being in the closet in now an out of date practice. To quote Harvey, “come out, come out, wherever you are…” Get a grip, dudes, you’re gay, live with it — well.
How about the tried and true, “Do you know Dorothy?” or “Are you a friend of Dorothy?”
so sboo and her husband are both idiots. that means they belong together.
but seriously, i was wondering why you didn’t throw out the possibility of her pretending to not know about her husband’s forays, and him pretending not to forage. the “willing suspension of disbelief” you talk about, often in regards to porn might be an option here if they really really want to stay married.
4 deep on a chair = crash at the top of the lift.
2 deep on a chair = no crash and it’s more comfortable.
There’s nothing related to homophobia in this behavior (although it’s quite selfish and rude if there’s a long line). Also, the holder of the weed only has to smoke out one person, not three.
“Try this: Hi, I’m gay. What do you think about that?
No good? Then forget about getting equal rights or even simple respect.”
Tell that to the guy that just got gay bashed in Central District…
my name here ….
yeah, I forgot about the crash and delay aspect when four total strangers are on the lift and don’t communicate well.
Did Dan really go snowboarding or could he simply not refuse the overt tone of SNOW in that first letter. Either way, The Chi says Hi!
How’s this for an “are you gay” ice breaker? If a guy you think might rock your world if he swings that way walks up to the seat next to you in a bar, you can ask as you politely pull the bar stool out for him to sit on “would you like me to turn this over for you or do you prefer the cushion side up?”….LOL Sorry, just had to pull from the how do you seat 4 gay men at a bar with one seat available joke. 😉 Rock on Dan, if I were gay and if I were male you would be my dream dude!
Lastly, I used to date a guy who would given the chance (either he had mastrubated himself to orgasm in front of me, or he had pulled out) would not just taste his own cum but he would eat it ALL…at first it was kind of interesting but then it kind of grossed me out. Not because I thought he was secretly gay but I started to think if he would eat all of that, maybe he was eating his boogers too. So I DTMF. 🙂
In my family, we have our own ephamism for our beloved gay members: “he doesn’t go to the barn”. Comes from my cousin that was the first ‘out’ member of our family and was always known as the boy in the family that didn’t like to hang out in the barn with the rest of the boys – wanted to be in the house doing ‘house’ things. So the question ‘does he go to the barn’ is our question. If no, then he’s gay. Now that I type it, it would seem that the barn boys are probably closeted.
“Tell that to the guy that just got gay bashed in Central District…”
Who can he thank for that? Who will be responsible for the next generation of assaults? The haters have always and will always be with us. You can stop waiting for the coast to be clear. It never will be.
Q: Do you like baseball?
A: Yeah, I prefer to (pitch/catch)
Probably not too transparent if you aren’t looking for it.
I like your writtings Dan I enjoy It I read IT on Now Magazine In Toronto!
Francisca.
my question…how can guys be so weird about touching each other (sitting to close, hugging, etc.) because they think it makes them gay, but they’ll get together in big groups to watch porn and jack off in the same room, but that’s perfectly straight???? I mean, it seems like the first things are the more innocent ones…
Straight guys who are half naked wrestle each other, play football and pile up on top of each other all the time what makes you think we can’t sit next to each other on the ski lift chair? As for the guy who didn’t want to kiss his girl after a blow job, I think thats bullshit too. I don’t think much of oral sex performed on me one way or the other but when my partner wanted to swallow I managed to cum in her mouth. Afterward we shared a long deep kiss. To me it intensified the intimacy and was hot as hell!!! As an HIV educator, I think it is human to share body fluids with your sexual partner. That is why I think condoms are such a poor alternative and hence the spread of HIV/AIDS.
Like some have said, any code will eventually be common knowledge and then it’s the same as asking, “are you gay?” – which defeats the purpose in the first place. So guess what? It’ll never truly work. Get over it. Those “macho” guys at Meshuggah are probably all fags anyway.
I have done a lot of work with black gay men and the code was Are in the family? or Are you on the team? If the answer was yes that indicated you are gay.
I don’t think MACHO needs a question that only gay guys are going to recognize – just one clearly recognizable by gay guys and not recognized by straight guys that would kick his ass for asking such a question. There are, of course, plenty of straight guys that read this column and who will all know what Dan eventually comes up with. I would think most of the people that would read this column wouldn’t be offended by a question about their orientation and certainly wouldn’t kick someone’s ass over it.
It should be: “man, how hot is Madonna?” Straight guy will realize it is sarcasm and say “no way”, gay guy will try to pass and say “way hot!”.
I think that it is perfectly fair to not want to kiss a girl after you have come in her mouth PURELY ON THE GROSS-OUT FACTOR, as long as you don’t insist (and make clear that you don’t insist) on coming in her mouth. A lot of girls don’t like having come in their mouths, and there is nothing “gay” about that. If the girl is happy with come in her mouth, that’s great – and you can reciprocate by being happy with her come in your mouth.
I don’t know about ski lifts, but I have noticed the same thing on the subway. Guys who are obviously friends, going somewhere together – but they make sure they have not one but TWO seats between them on the subway – even if it’s crowded.
If they’re alone, they sit with their knees far enough apart to take up 3 seats and make sure No One sits next to them.
What’s up with that? (besides being rude)
MK’s boyfriend must be worried about her thinking he’s gay. I say he try it once just to please her. What’s the harm in that? Let her know that this is a one time thing and thats that.
To BJ Kisses’s Boyfriend: You need to think about all the stuff she has done for you and remember that next time you say no, jerk!
Dan, I think you and the sloggers miss the point on come in the mouth and taking ski lifts togethor.
At least with come, it’s a matter of individual preference (and huge spectrum of preference), and it’s unfair to judge.
Token straight old dude is perfectly right. I would feel mortified if someone refused to kiss me after I had tenderly, sluttishly, eagerly sucked him off. It is just plain old ungrateful and unmannerly – like spitting out a foodstuff you do not like when you’ve been invited out to dinner, something that I was taught not to do when I was two.
I have gamely swallowed one or teaspoons of jizz that were less than lovely and you notice that B&J’s does not yet do a ‘spunky monkey’ flavoured ice-cream; probably for a good reason. But: it will make me gay?! GIVE ME A BREAK! If you are so babyish that you are scared of a tiny bit of come, then you are certainly too young to be playing with the grown-ups in bed.
Jeez, about the boy who didn’t want to kiss his girlfriend after she blew him — Christ,I’ve tasted my own cum *thousands* of times, and if cum made me gay — well, I’d be a lot different than I am now!
Why? Well, after I cum inside a woman, I always offer to go down on her and help her cum. I haven’t had too many demurrals, and the ladies have mostly seemed very happy. It always seemed to me to be the least I could do, having gotten my own rocks off!
(And about the “thousands” — I’m in my mid-fifties, and I was eating pussy the very next time after I lost my virginity, loved it instantly, and I haven’t given up yet! After all, I know my cock is gonna give up the ghost way before my tongue will.)
If this is a duplicate post, I apologize, but my first response didn’t come up . .
About the guy who wouldn’t kiss his girl after he came in her mouth — Christ, I’ve tasted my own come *thousands* of times, and if that makes me gay, my wife and all my previous girlfriends will be *really* surprised.
So how did I do this, you ask? Well, every time after I came inside a girl, I always offered to go down on her and help her come. I met with very few refusals, and the ladies who said yes always seemed happy. It seemed the least I could do, after I had gotten my own rocks off!
(And about the “thousands” — I started eating pussy the second time I fucked, loved it, and have done it ever since. I’m in my mid-fifties now, so that’s more than three decades of experience. Also, I know that my cock is going to give up the ghost, Viagra or no, before my tongue does.)
Mario Cantone has a great way to ID gays: Walk up to a guy and say “Clang Clang Clang” If he says “Went the trolley” He’s gay.
LC, reader’s note says explicitly “his come in my mouth” – as in the full load. I’d guess a high percentage of guys have tried their own brand at one time or another on their own (I know I did back in my crazy youth). Wasn’t for me.
As Dan said, most SGs don’t like spooge (even their own) for the same reason they don’t like dick. It just doesn’t do it for us.
I have no problem with after BJ kissing but I don’t want my load back. It was a thank-you gift, you get keep it.
A lot of people seem to think that a guy who doesn’t want to taste his cum must be afraid it makes him gay. No. Just no. I don’t want to taste my cum because it’s disgusting, I couldn’t care less about it seeming gay or whatever, I just don’t want to, that doesn’t make me homophobic, or a bad BF. Can’t a guy not want to taste his own semen anymore?
Um, I’m not a fan of the taste of my semen, but tastes vary.
I don’t want lima beans anywhere near my mouth either, but I see people enjoying them all the time.
What if someone asked “Are you a friend of Dorothy?” and you said yes, and then he pushed you aside and said, “Sorry Mary, I’m trolling for trade tonight?” Then wouldn’t you feel bad? I read a Victorian porn novel years back and one of their code phrases was “Do you like a bit of brown?”
Sorry but it’s gay history and if you want to live like that, build a time machine.I’ve never had a good experience meeting someone whose first point of business in our conversation was trying to size up if I was gay or not.
I kind of think MK is a guy.
I don’t much care for tasting cum after a bj. I am quite amazed at how much women I have been with seem to love their own taste and have never expressed any problem with kissing me after going down on them. If a woman doesn’t like it, I would hope she would tell me. They never do.
If a gf wanted me to kiss her so bad, or snowball or whatever, then I might try it once or twice to be ggg. But really now, what woman out there is so interested in that, as some kind of kink or fetish or big turn on. The truth is, most women would probably want to do it just because “if he wants to come in my mouth or kiss me after going down on me, then he better…”
It is almost out of spite or some sense of being treated unfairly. Bottom line is, if a person wants to, they should do it, and if they don’t they shouldn’t. What is the big deal. Did this woman ever say it was some huge turn on that she felt deprived of?
As for guys on the ski lift or anywhere else, it is not homophobia. It is male use of space. Some women get upset about it and call it male priviledge, but it is just the way males are not afraid to take up space and like to. Women can do it too if they want.
But the reason that silly Bill W question doesn’t work is that it’s not really a secret. Duh.
@ Hairhead: … awesome.
If a guy won’t kiss me after I go down on him, that was the last blowjob he’ll ever get from me. I’m not into snowballing, but it is seriously offensive if somebody expects you to go brush your teeth before they’ll show you any appreciation.
On the subject of MACHO’s letter, I had the same initial reaction as some people (that he should just come out of the closet) but really, it is not his responsibility to put himself in danger.
Can we have a similar code question for lesbians?
PACK THE CHAIR, BUT NOT WHEN THERE’S NO LINE!
First of all, if there’s a lift line, then you pack ’em in, no empty chairs. But there’s is something to the personal space issue, too. For example, what bugs me is the guy in the singles’ line or the other twosome that want to ride up with me and my wife when there is no or only a minimal lift line. The efficiency isn’t increased, and the chance to ride up with a little bit of privacy and romance once in a while is lost.
JUST MORE TASTY?
As for the post-BJ kiss issue, I am 100% with Dan on this one. The thought of the girl wanting me to taste it (as an old GF used to do) always turns my crank DURING the BJ, but after the orgasm….boy, I am just not that interested. I don’t mind kissing post swallow or spit, even if you can tell there’s some residue, but I am not cranked by it and would just as soon pass on the extra flavor.
I can’t explain why guys in general don’t dig the post-BJ spunk breath while ladies in general seem to mind the post-get-down glaze, but I am sure it has a lot to do with the switch getting thrown, as Dan explains, the more pliable sexuality of the female of the species, and it just may have something to do with vaginal juices being a lot more tasty than jizz….
The simple solution for Missing Kisses is to put some mouthwash in a cup and stick it next to your bed – then your kisses will only be delayed by a few seconds.
Re: The Question.
Geesh. Where are all the film-literate queers around here? It’s an old one. From Sparticus: “Do you like snails or oysters?”
http://tinyurl.com/ap97kl
Thing is, MK’s problem seemed to be that her boyfriend wouldn’t even *try* to kiss her after she’d been down on him – not that he wouldn’t do it, period. Whether what she wants to do with him is snowballing or just making out after a BJ, if it means that much to her shouldn’t he at least give it a shot?
…no pun intended.
The gay porn star name is the best solution, for sure. It constantly updates itself and only someone in the know would be current enough to know. Any other solution is either going to become way too widespread to be secret or get quickly out of date, or not have wide enough coverage.
This assumes though that all gay guys watch gay porn a lot and are current with the “actors”. Do they? Are they?