My boyfriend of 16 months and
I have a great relationship. He loves my blowjobs, but he will not kiss
me if I have his come in my mouth. It grosses him out. We have talked
about this, and he won’t even try. I have no problem if he kisses me
after going down on me. I just want him to try. Is there something
wrong with asking him to taste himself? I do it all the time and love
it.
Missing Kisses
It’s funny that your question—with its
hint of gay panic—should arrive today. I’ve been on vacation with
the family all week snowboarding in beautiful British Columbia, and
what I enjoy most—besides the snowboarding and the half-naked,
fully stoned Australian snowboard instructors lolling around in hot
tubs at the end of the day—is watching the straight boys who
refuse to sit four to a chairlift. They want to ride up alone or ride
up two at a time on a four-seater with two empty seats between ’em.
They seem to think gayness can be contracted through thigh-to-thigh
contact.
Which it can.
Now, MK, there’s kissing someone with your
come on her breath and then there’s kissing someone with your come in
her mouth. It sounds like you’re interested in the latter, which makes
it sound like you’re interested in passing some of your boyfriend’s
load into his mouth—i.e., snowballing—and not simply being
rewarded with a kiss, his come on your breath, for a blowjob well-done.
And that’s an entirely different wad of spunk.
Just because you enjoy tasting yourself on
his lips doesn’t mean your boyfriend will enjoy or should have to enjoy
mouthing his own load. First, there’s a significant difference in
volume and consistency between your kissing his glazed lips and his
eating his own spunk. And then there’s this: After a woman comes, MK,
she’s still in a groove, still capable of more orgasms, still cranked
up. After ejaculating, a man is essentially uncranked. He’s not capable
of another orgasm (not right away, anyway)—he’s been knocked out
of his groove. So even if the idea of snowballing appeals to a man as
you’re blowing him, it might not hold the same appeal the moment after
he comes.
Some men are afraid of tasting their own
come because they believe that doing so, like sitting too close on a
chairlift, can turn a guy gay. And it’s not an unreasonable fear: not
because it will turn a guy gay, but because, judging from my mail, a
lot of women are convinced that any man who would taste his own come
must secretly be gay. It’s possible that your boyfriend is dying to
taste himself, MK, but, like the boys on the chairlifts, is afraid of
getting a reputation if he goes ahead with this and you blab about it
to your friends.
I am at the Meshuggah show at
El Corazón as I write this. There are tons of guys I consider
hot here, 98 percent of whom, I’m sure, are straight. But I got a vibe
off this one guy. This is such a macho environment, though, that
there’s a considerable amount of danger in asking the question “So, you
gay?”
I remember an episode of Law and Order where
Jerry Orbach tried to determine if a suspect was in AA by asking a
secret question, something like “Are you a friend of Bill W.?” The idea
was that the question was innocuous if you weren’t in AA.
Since you are the king of “santorum” and
“pegging” and “saddlebacking,” I thought maybe you could invent a
secret question for masculine gay men in masculine environments.
Something like, “Hey, do you like to barbecue?” So how ’bout it? Can
you declare the official secret are-you-a-masculine-gay-guy
question?
Men Are Cute Hot Objects
The best I could come up with on my own,
MACHO, was this: “A Little Night Music—
original
Broadway cast recording or original London cast?” But that line will
get your ass kicked in a lot of gay bars—as I know from bitter
experience. So let’s toss this out to my readers, the folks who came up
with the definitions for “santorum,” “pegging,” and “saddlebacking”:
Okay, gang, we’re looking for an innocuous question that (1) all fags
everywhere would know the answer to, but (2) no straight guys anywhere
would. My long-suffering interns—their uniforms chafe—await
your suggested questions at mail@savagelove.net.
I had to refrain from opening
this with “Hey, Asshole!” (oops, guess I kind of just did) after
reading your advice to Sex Best One On One, the woman who married a man
who warned her that he could not be monogamous and who then realized
she couldn’t share him. While I agree with your assessment of SBOOO’s
husband—up-front, honest—your assessment of SBOOO is
obviously influenced by your need to have a good rant at
polyamory-unfriendly marriage counselors, family, friends, and the
world at large. SBOOO does not have to apologize for who she is (not as
willing to do long-term nonmonogamy as previously thought) to elitist,
more-liberated-than-thou jerk-offs (hint: you!) after giving it a good
fucking try (12 times!). Pun intended.
Loving Toronto Reader
I am a polyamorist. I am
always up-front with my partners about this, especially if I want to
get serious with them. So many people seem to say that they are fine
with it out of some kind of misguided assumption that they can
eventually change my mind. You know, “Polyamory isn’t real; it’s just a
phase!” You know, like being gay.
I just wanted to say thank you for your
reply to SBOOO! I couldn’t have said it better myself. That was an
absolutely fantastic response. Just like you said, counselors (and for
that matter, family members) always see the polyamorist as the bad guy,
unreasonably refusing to take the simple, easy route of strict
monogamy. It was really nice to finally have someone stand up for us.
Thank you!
While I’m sure you enjoy positive feedback,
saying thank you is cheap. A lot of times you plug various charities
and causes in your column—is there any group you’d like me to
donate to as a more concrete symbol of my appreciation?
Longtime Fan
Some folks think I was too hard on SBOOO,
some think I was just hard enough. Like I said in my original response,
I intentionally came down hard on SBOOO to compensate for the vast and
overwhelming majority of advice professionals who would, per LF, side
aggressively with her because a nonmonogamous partner—even an
honest one like SBOOO’s mate—is always perceived as the bad
guy.
For the record: I am not biased toward
nonmonogamy. But I do think monogamous people should be with each other
and refrain from marrying folks who are self-aware enough to inform
them in advance that they don’t think they’re capable of being
monogamous.
Some folks who wrote in about my advice for
SBOOO raised a good point: I should have come down on the husband as
well. If nonmonogamy was a deal breaker for him, then he was a fool to
marry SBOOO before verifying her ability to be nonmonogamous. Agreed.
So, for the record: SBOOO’s husband? You’re an idiot, too.
Finally, LF, I’m always happy to see money
go to Planned Parenthood.
RE: Expat’s comments…Sasha’s the columnist for Eye Weekly in Toronto, for those curious to know who was being referred to, though I’m not necessarily a fan of hers…when she shoots someone down in print, she sounds bitter rather than straightforward.
Hey Hairhead: You are the king of all the straightmen on Slog!
Re: Semen Swallowing
I get that some men just plain don’t like the taste of semen. I’m happy to swallow it. It usually doesn’t taste bad. The spunk from a boyfriend who drank Yohoo (the chocolate soda) daily tasted sweet. It’s also tasted like soup stock. I wouldn’t dress my salad with it but I don’t gag on it either. (I’m also happy to partake of the cooter, second hand juice and all, but that’s another column.)
I do wonder what the straight men who are disgusted by semen think of their partners who swallow it. Cocksucker isn’t an insult for nothing. Scratch homophobia and you find misogyny.
RE: MACHO
While I wouldn’t want MACHO to miss out on any opportunities, the possibility of his getting bashed is likely enough (sadly) to take precedence over coming up w/ a pick-up code. Further, guys who vibe gay in a macho, ostensibly straight environment would seem like the most risky to engage (You know, similar to secretly gay politicians who promote anti-gay legislation).
For the shibboleth; must have something to do with Liza Minelli. As in “my sister asked me the other day if Liza Minelli was still married… I’m not sure I even know who Liza Minelli is. Do you?” A little long, needs work, but the response would be difinitive.
el caminos are pretty macho. how ’bout “do you drive an el camino?” or something remiscent of david sedaris: “do you own a stadium pal?”
Question to MACHO- Why the cloak and dagger stuff? JUST SAY HELLO, nitwit. if the guy is gay, and interested, you’ll receive the kind of feedback you are looking for (flirtyness, buying you a drink, giving an hj in the bathroom etc.) if he’s straight and friendly, you make a straight friend. if he’s gay and not interested or straight and not friendly, you’ll part ways, no harm no foul. start up a conversation and see where it goes, no codeword needed. a codeword is no guarantee of anything.
Are you a friend of Dorothy? wins hands down. Of course, if you’re under a certain age, that may not mean anything, whether or not you actually are a friend 😉
Try so what blog do you frequent? 0_o
Sounds like snowballing to me. Her exact words are, “He will not kiss me if I have his come in my mouth.”
…Sounds like snowballing.
But that’s an interesting take, LC, but it might be as simple as she gets off on swallowing, so he lets her do as she pleases.
GayQuest
Q. Would you do Samantha Ronson?
A. Yeah, I’d hit that ass!
=Gay Male or Female
Q. Would you do Samantha Ronson?
A. Maybe. Will Lindsay be there too?
=Bi-Curious Male
Q. Would you do Samantha Ronson?
A. Who?
=Straight
Speaking as a straight woman who loves giving blow jobs, I don’t enjoy the taste at all, but the submissive elements of it are all the rage. In that regard, I don’t mind if he doesn’t want to taste himself… the blowjob is laced with submissive undertones, and the jizz can be sorta gross-tasting.
I think it’s a little disgenerous to say that a model should come with oral, and yet if he won’t kiss you after he swallows, that’s the last bj he gets. Seems like punishing him in a big way for the small crime of not liking something. And if you’re giving blowjobs despite your ick factor (how can he not kiss me after I swallow?!) maybe you need to renegotiate the terms.
from a straight guy.
“are you a gymnast?”
“ever been to greece?”
“you have pretty eyes. wanna fuck?”
that last one is to be used only in a perfect world, where a straight guy would simply answer “no thanks.”
Marty, there is nothing dishonest about saying that if I am too disgusting to kiss after I blow you, then I am not blowing you again.
I would also not do repeat performances if the chap demanded a towel to wipe his mouth after he went down on me or just plain refused to do it. I would explain my position and move on.
“You are good enough to be a receptacle for my disgusting come, but I should not have to be intimate with it in any way.” How is that not offensive?
As I said before, I have once or twice encountered some pretty funky spunk but I had the GOOD MANNERS and courtesy, not get up from the proceedings, spitting and wiping my mouth with the bedding, screaming “Eeeew, disgusting, yeugh, cough, gag. Are you a man or some sort of fermented offal factory?!”
Too, I have eaten things at people’s houses that I found pretty revolting. (Usually they were from the brassica family.) A friend is an ambassador and has had to graciously consume eyeballs, live crustacean and rotting fish. It is called being a grown-up and living in a world in which the feelings of other people are respected, not just your own.
“If you can’t tell whether he wants to fuck you, he doesn’t want to fuck you. There is no secret code called for. And really there is something totally creepy about trying to start one.”
Exactly! I’ve had guys asking those kinds of leading questions to figure out if I’m gay. And I always resented the underlying assumption: that if I’m gay, I must be willing to have sex with anyone who is interested (or at least be willing to out myself to a total swisher and complete stranger in a homophobic environment to satisfy his curiosity). As if.
So unless the guy was superhot (they never are), any shibboleth would be a dealbreaker. You need to find out if he’s interested in you, not if he’s gay or straight. If he’s interested in you, just make freaking small talk and you both should be able to figure out what’s going on by the eye contact, smiles and body language. At least until you can get to a gay safe or neutral environment to be more frank.
Oh yeah, I forgot to add there is already a dicksucking shibboleth for straight/bicurious guys, so just start using that one. It goes, “I’m so horny I could fuck a pig”. If your self-esteem can handle it, go for it.
@Gutterlush
Nope, the Sam Ronson question wouldn’t work for me, since I don’t like the andro type. A bit more girlie for me, thanks.
As for the lesbian/gay question, I don’t know how I’d address someone directly. I’ve *said* about people, “Are they part of the family/sisterhood?”.
I think it’s harder for men. I don’t care what sexuality a woman is; if I get the right signals from a cute one, I’ll signal right back.
ha nicely played makenna. didnt think to see that one here
I’d hope that MACHO’s intent wasn’t to find a come-on, but a way to find solidarity in a hostile environment. And I don’t think the ideal here is quiz questions about gay icons, but an innocuous question that can be answered honestly on the surface level. Like Fred34’s example: “So, how ’bout them [local sports team].”
How about:
Do you like innies or outies?
Hot dog or taco?
Do you have a girlfriend? …or boyfriend?
How about, “Do you have Madonna’s latest album?”
Which resort, exactly, should I head to for the stoned Austrailians in the hot tubs? I just happen to be planning a long weekend.
Here’s a probably dumb question: Do Australian snowboarding instructors learn snowboarding *in* Australia? Where?
Snowcurious, I don’t think there’s much skiing in Australia, but I think NZ has plenty of skiiing.
in response to, “men are cute hot object”: the qustion asked was if there was a code word to find out if someone is gay. the only one that i know is to ask the person if they know dorthy. apparently ever gay guy ike judy garland. if they respond w/ dorthy who, you have your answer.
Ginger, MaryAnne or Mrs Howell?
MK never said he was a girl. It reads as MK is a guy. Still, his BF should at least ‘try it’ or if he won’t, then MK will just have to determine if it’s a deal-killer or not.
The secret gay code: Give the jazz hands-shake. If they’re gay they’ll know, if they’re straight, they’ll just think you’re having a seizure.
If MK boyfriend has never tipped his own lip in the privacy of his own experimentations… he’s either the only guy on the planet that hasn’t thought of it yet… or just plain brain dead.
Americana… post Kinsey demands that men think about what there “spunk” tastes like…
…as exampled by the perpetuation of crass double standards by jerks that insist the vaginal cavity that smells like tuna should honor the sword of stupidity just because it is placed before the breath of demure sweetness.
“Pallin’ around?”
@Smith in Warsaw:
Those only work if you get in a time machine and go back to the 70s or earlier (there’s a slight chance someone under the age of 40 will know “Friend of Dorothy” if they’ve had a classical gay education, but even then, it’s iffy). It’s the 21st century, look at their facebook or myspace page for what’s there and what isn’t.
Because she is his come dumpster.
I’m straight and I suspect that some guys hit on me with homo-faux-bia. You know- “What are you looking at, fag!” and then they try to read your reaction to somehow see if they should follow up.
For the MACHO Metalheads:
“What do you think of Rob Halford?”
When I lived in Texas, the question was “Are you family?”
This was back when the song, ‘We are Family’ was big in gay dance clubs. It was also rarely safe to say in public that someone was gay… so if someone were to ask,
‘How do you know Bob?’ you’d reply, ‘ Bob is family’.
And then you’d know to continue the conversation details in private.
Was that true anywhere else? or was that just a Texas thing?
Just so you know, sitting two to a chairlift almost always means you /have/ to sit far apart for two reasons. First, the chair should be somewhat balanced; the guys in charge of the lift usually try and spread out the weight. Second, you don’t know if the guy is going to fall as soon as he gets off the lift. If you’re close to him, he’ll take you down or tie you up. Sitting far away not only means you have more time to have fun on the hill, but gives you someone to point and laugh at from a distance.
Cheers dude!
I think the best way to tell if another guy is gay is to ask him, ‘where do you like to hang out?’
He might name a straight bar if he’s being cautious. But you can respond with “do you know ‘X-gay-bar’?”
Finding the perfect bar to name might depend on your city and the circumstances:
If you’re seriously worried about getting gay-bashed, you could name a nightspot that is mostly (but not entirely) gay. Or you could name a pretty obscure gay bar.
Most homophobic straight guys aren’t going to know the name of the third- or fourth-tier gay bar in your town. The straight guys who do are likely to be supportive.
I know plenty of young gay guys don’t go to the gay bars, but they’re still likely to know they exist. I think most other commonalities among gays — Madonna, Judy Garland — are either too obvious or are not universally true anymore.
Good grief. Are the universities no longer offering Gay 101? The question is, “Are you a friend of Dorothy?”
Are some women really just that bitter about having to give blow jobs?
I don’t complain when my tongue is sore and my chin is dripping. And I usually reach for something to dry my face off.
I don’t complain when I’m doing a 69 and my nose is jammed in your pussy, and i can’t breathe. No not at all.
And yes I always reach for something to dry my face in. Because, I’m considerate and I don’t assume that you want to taste you own essense in my kisses and vice versa.
Is it uncomfortable at times, perhaps yes. But it’s also a labor of love that I’m proud and happy to do!
you’re at a metal concert: “Are you a fan of Bob Mould?” If answer is yes, followed by “And have you been to one of his ‘Blow-Off’ gigs?”
‘Friend of Dorothy’ used to work just fine….
I’m with LC on this one, though I wouldn’t as much call it a “red flag” as a “disappointing hangup”. Your own cum is obviously not poisonous so show her a little affection already.
A Stonewall reference is probably a good way to go. Even young gay people know about the riots, but straight boys will think of the Civil War general.
I always thought “friend of Dorothy’s” was the gay equivalent to Bill W.
My boyfriend and I still get a laugh out of using “friend of Kenny” though. Don’t know? Have a fan of Dame Edna explain it to ya.
so do i blame santa or the easter bunny for the thigh-to-thigh transfer of gayness????
Anyone else think it’s kind of funny that people are complaining about things they find gross in sex? Sure, to each his own, but sex basically IS gross. It’s part of the fun.
And in light of that, it does seem strange to me to insist so adamantly and completely that you won’t ever kiss someone after they’ve given you a blow job post swallow or not.
For the question to ask to other potentially gay guys… I once heard the phrase “A friend of Dorothy’s” and was told that it referred to the limp-wristed Scarecrow.
“Are you family?” was still making the rounds at the New York City gay bars, at least the last time I went to one. And I’m a girl.
I was in SF with my wife recently, and spent Super Bowl Sunday in a gay bar on Haight. Although, I love sports, I can’t stand sports bars so the atmosphere was fun, friendly, etc., and perfect for the occasion.
Whilst my wife was outside enjoying a much needed cig, I got approached and asked very simply, “Do you like boys or girls?” I’m no fool, so after trying to say something clever about liking both boys and girls as people, but preferring just girls for sex, I simply said, “yeah I’m not gay, sorry.”
He was pleasant enough with my rejection, and even complimented my now returned wife on her choice. Minutes later we discussed how I watched an attaractive lesbian follow her outside and if she had in fact approached her because I saw her eyeballing her.
I never understood the revulsion factor from being told you are attractive by someone else, even if you are straight and the person is gay. It’s a compliment after all. Aggressive tactics are a different story….
So, I guess my point is do gays need a secret code or do straights need to lighten up???
If a guy’s not into snowballing, it doesn’t hurt my feelings, but if he won’t even kiss me after I’ve licked and sucked his cock until he cums in my mouth and swallowed his spunk, HE IS A SHITTY LOVER. Same for a guy not wanting to go down after he cums in my pussy. I’ve been with a few guys who would gladly eat pussy before they cum in it, but not after. I don’t ask a guy to lick up and eat a mouthful of his own cum if he’s not into it, but if he can’t figure out how to lick my clitoris and avoid sticking his tongue into his own sticky cum mess he left there, then yeah, HE IS A SHITTY LOVER!
Yeah, I don’t see how you automatically assume “snowballing” for MK’s question, I don’t see anything there that hints at that. It sounds like he’s just weird about kissing with semen/penis breath, which I think a lot of straight guys tend to be. It’s not unusual, just a hang-up guys have. I’d just tell him to get over it.
how about did you bring your hag? olny hags and their gay friends know what that is!!!